Talk:Bydgoszcz/Archives/2012/April

Maps and two names
On maps of ca 1600 a city named Bromberg is shown located at an arm of the Vistula river and south of it another town named Bitgotz. How is this related to Bydgoszcz? Is Bydgoszcz Bromberg or is Bydgoszcz Bitgotz?? -- JeLuF 08:09 24 May 2003 (UTC)
 * I guess it means that on an early map, two places in the vicinity of current Bydgoszcz are shown, one with a Germanic name, closer to the river, and another with the Polish name, south of the one with the German name. I suspect that this just means that the map was probably done by someone a German background, and that there was a strong enough Germanic population from at least the 1500s to have them name their own settlement. Note that Dutch and Deutsch settlers were recruited to turn the Vistula flood plain into farmland, starting in the north and working upstream. When a town grew up nearby in later years and became larger, it probably took on both names. Bwood 01:45, 27 Jun 2004 (UTC)

These two names were in use for centuries. There is a mistake on mentioned map (and some others) causing by putting two geographic nets on one map.


 * There was certainly no mistake on the map. The phenomenon that, for an extended period, two settlements - an older Polish / slavic settlement, and a newer town with German city-law and settlers - co-existed was quite common in the eastern lands. Bitgost / Bromberg is a typical example. Two different names could be in use even when the populations were already mixed. The same happened, for example in Berlin (in fact a double town, one with slavic name, Berlin, one with a German name, Cölln), later on these growing 'double-towns' merged and one name got the upper-hand. --DaQuirin 14:01, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

Atrocities
The World War II atrocities seem to be too much detail for this topic. As with Reichsgau Wartheland, this is too much detail for a general history of a town article or the Reichsgau article.

((The name "Reichsgau Wartheland" must be replaced to read "Reichsgau Danzig-Westpreussen". In chapter "History", 4th para, 1st line,it reads:" From 1939-45 during WW2, Bydgoszcz was annexed to the Reichsgau Wartheland(in blue)." But this link does not deliver the name "Bydgoszcz" (or Bromberg). For my proof only the "Map of Nazi Germany ...Reichsgaue" is important. The orange field of "Danzig-Westpreussen" shows the river Wistula. The left side to the point where the Wistula is changing its direction from East-West abruptly to North is the location of Bydgoszcz. This can be found in any common school atlas. Another proof of my statement is to click the (blue) link "Reichsgau Danzig-Westpreussen", then you will find Bydgosz/Bromberg as the names of the "Regierungsbezirk" and "Stadtkreis". Author Prof. Dr. A. Warner, Darmstadt, Germany , lived in Bydgoszcz 1931-1945. Written 6 August, supplemented 7 August 2009))

Let's summarize and move the details to a new topic, perhaps "World War II atrocities" - Bwood 03:16, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Gzornenplatz
Gzornenplatz, please stop vandalising this page. Even using your flawed search criteria the Google shows that you're wrong. . [[User:Halibutt|Halibutt]] 23:06, Oct 25, 2004 (UTC)

Terminology for atrocities committed by Polish & German rectified. If someone has a good reason why when an innocent German dies they are "killed" whereas a Polish citizen is "murdered" (which implies a greater crime) feel free to change it back. - Hvatum

Fmt of Bromberg
Bromberg is a synonym for Bydgoszcz, surely? We say, "In German, it is traditionally known as Bromberg, the city name under Prussian rule and renaming the city after 1874." Synonyms are normally rendered in bold format. &mdash; Matt Crypto 14:16, 13 December 2005 (UTC)


 * "Bromberg" is not a synonym, it's the name of the town in German. --Lysytalk 17:19, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Sure, but "Bydgoszcz" is the name of the town in Polish. They're different words with identical meanings; that would seem to fit the definition of "synonym". &mdash; Matt Crypto 17:23, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
 * "Bromberg" is not a "different word(...) with identical meaning" but a foreign name of a Polish city. Space Cadet 17:34, 21 October 2006 (UTC)
 * "Bromberg" and "Bydgoszcz" are A) different words (one is a Polish word, the other German), and B) have identical meanings. To deny that is very odd. &mdash; Matt Crypto 18:07, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Even more odd is to deny that "Bromberg" is a foreign name for "Bydgoszcz" and as such requires italics. Space Cadet 19:38, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

All right, restart: "Bydgoszcz" is the name of the town. The town is in Poland, so there's no surprise that the name is Polish. It has other names in other languages, including "Bromberg" in German (it used to be a German town during the Partitions of Poland). Similarly, "Košice" is a Slovak town and a Slovak name of the town. But there are also names in other languages, including German Kaschau. The article title is bolded. The names in other languages are in italics. Košice is only an example, of course. --Lysytalk 20:09, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Fishers' settlement
A fishers' settlement? Ha ha ha. We know nothing about it, but Bydgoszcz "castrum" was built first time for sure in 1038 (dendrochronological dating). Who wrote this article. So many mistakes! The municipal rigths were granted only in 1346. BYDGOSZCZ RETURNED TO POLAND IN 1920! (not in 1919). Bydgoszcz & Toruń have population over 670 000 people. And so on, a load of old rubbish.

Historical Records of Bromberg
Bromberg Church records of Vital Statistics of Inhabitants from c 1650, Taufen, Heiraten, Tote: Bromberg By 1900 Polish language started. To reflect the centuries of Germans in the large city of Bromberg, the name is in bold letters in article. MG 3/28/2006

night life
The section on night life seems fairly unencyclopedic. Ostap 18:24, 4 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I concur and have removed the section. Olessi 18:36, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Founding
The city is founded by two Germans, Johan Kesselhuth and Konrad. --84.142.181.242 (talk) 20:01, 13 March 2011 (UTC)