Talk:CJ Stander

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External links modified
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I have just modified 20 external links on C. J. Stander. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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External links modified
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I have just modified 14 external links on C. J. Stander. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20140906140120/http://www.munsterrugby.ie/rugby/18987.php to http://www.munsterrugby.ie/rugby/18987.php
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Requested move 21 July 2020

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 

The result of the move request was: moved. Support arguments have demonstrated that the proposal meets the exception set out at MOS:INITIALS and opposers have failed to demonstrate any common usage of the full stops in his name  Number   5  7  14:39, 1 August 2020 (UTC)

C. J. Stander → CJ Stander – Although MOS:INITIALS states the normal correct way of initialising a name is capitalised followed by a full stop, it states that if the person has a different preferred style it can be used or a majority of sources use a certain variant. In this case the players social media uses CJ Stander and a large number of sources also use CJ Stander including primary sources from the clubs he has played for and secondary sources also. The page was previously listed under CJ Stander but moved without consensus. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 12:30, 21 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Here is a selection of sources to illustrate my point: Some sources here: Primary and personal: Instagram, Irish Rugby, ESPN,, Rugby World Cup Profile, Munster Rugby, Secondary sources: Irish Times, SA Rugby Magazine, Irish Mirror, The 42, Limerick Post, Irish Examiner, Independent.ie Rugbyfan22 (talk) 09:37, 29 July 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment Similar discussions are open at R. G. Snyman and J. P. Pietersen. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 14:22, 21 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 18:25, 22 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose Christiaan Johan is C. J. per MOS:INITIALS In ictu oculi (talk) 22:07, 22 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Support per MOS:INITIALS. As the nominator explains, our style guide instructs us that when a subject's preferred name is used in a majority of reliable sources, we use that name.--Yaksar (let's chat) 06:31, 23 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Support as per nom and Yaksar Fob.schools (talk) 07:48, 23 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Support per the nom and the guidance in MOS:INITIALS mentioned above. Plenty of sources using "CJ" rather than "C. J." --Bcp67 (talk) 20:29, 23 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose per iio. One would need a stronger rationale, not based on just on personal/inside sources. Dicklyon (talk) 01:15, 27 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Plenty of primary and secondary sources use CJ over C. J. so it's clearly not just personal/inside sources. Mentioning his social media account name preference was in reference to the person himself having a preferred style as mentioned in MOS:INITIALS. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 09:29, 27 July 2020 (UTC)
 * "Plenty of" is well short of the threshold specified in MOS:INITIALS, which is "an overwhelming majority of reliable sources". Dicklyon (talk) 02:58, 29 July 2020 (UTC)
 * As stated elsewhere I have not found one source that uses C. J. Stander, whereas all sources use CJ Stander suggesting "an overwhelming majority of reliable sources" does use the prospective name. Some sources here: Primary and personal: Instagram, Irish Rugby, ESPN,, Rugby World Cup Profile, Munster Rugby, Secondary sources: Irish Times, SA Rugby Magazine, Irish Mirror, The 42, Limerick Post, Irish Examiner, Independent.ie Rugbyfan22 (talk) 09:37, 29 July 2020 (UTC)
 * You need to state which of those sources use nostops for all sportspeople (DJ Carey, AP McCoy, ...) or even all people (JK Rowling). Such sources should be discounted since "CJ" is just their house style, not indicative of something specific to Stander. jnestorius(talk) 10:11, 29 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Ah, I see the point you are trying to make now below, however I've not found one source that uses C. J.. While that may be house style as you suggest for not one single source to use C. J. suggests that CJ is the commonly used name. If there were sources that used C. J. then I would accept your point. As you have mentioned below, personally I see this case as similar to the CC Sabathia case, and even that case has exceptions that use C. C. whereas I cannot find any for Stander. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 10:28, 29 July 2020 (UTC)


 * Oppose per above. Wikipedia house style. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:44, 27 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Again, the house style allows for this change as MOS:INITIALS states:


 * Stander clearly has a consistently preferred style for his name, and an overwhelming majority of reliable sources us the style JP for his name. Rugbyfan22 (talk) 12:20, 27 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment I think there is a difference between a person/publication having a preference for no-dots for all personal initials (which is just a style variation we can ignore) as opposed to having a preference for their own/one specific person's initials (which is where the exception kicks in). It's not clear that distinction is established wrt Stander. OTOH, of the three examples quoted in the MOS:INITIALS snippet, CC Sabathia is the only one with a reference for no-dots preference. (Maybe the others had one but it got deleted after MOS:INITIALS was written?) jnestorius(talk) 13:47, 28 July 2020 (UTC)


 * Support per nom. The subject and sources both use the proposed stylization.  Calidum   01:04, 29 July 2020 (UTC)


 * The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.