Talk:Camel racing

Untitled
The camel speeds can't be true. 168 km/h is impossible. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.180.14.14 (talk) 09:27, 4 June 2009 (UTC)

Well I went to the camel races at Douze (Tunisia), and there was no more evident 'exploitation' than at the horse racing in the UK.

Admittedly the health-and-safety aspects kleave a lot to be desired - but then that can be sadi about poorer countries generally. (Also, children tend to start working at a mcu younger age than in 'civilized' countries


 * Johnbibby 11:32, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

Someone please tell me this is a joke. Is this serious? If so that last paragraph may be one of the most brief and intriguing things I have ever read. Does anyone know any more about this?

Its no joke, watch the documentary.

Nope, no joke. Thousands of children are kidnapped and stolen and kept as slaves just to race for the elite class.


 * It is very much a real sport (how is it any different from horse racing), althought the article focuses more on the problem of child jockeys than on the actual sport (which does not necessarilly have to abuse children). - Matthew238 06:05, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
 * And you find this misplaced focus acceptable for an encyclopedia article?
 * No I don't, which is why I mentioned it. - Matthew238 05:12, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Seems to me that this article has very little to do with camel racing and everything to do with protesting it. I think that the part on child jockeys (95%) of the article ought to be moved to its own category and the actual racing, which is what the article is titled, needs to be expanded. i.e. history, location,participants, etc. Everything that should be in a factual article, not the BS here. I'll move it myself as soon as I figure out how. Tubbyty 18:54, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Take care, this does not read objectively and impartially, and appears to center around this "Ansar Burney Trust". The metal helmet bloodloss scenario does not seem referenced, for example. "These tiny slaves working for the pleasures of rich Arab sheikhs face substantial risks even when they do everything right." This quote does not read objectively, and is worded fairly emotionally. -Anon

The Ansar Burney Trust details are by me. They are the only organisation that is working in the Middle East for the rescue and shelter of these children. I think now UNICEF has also been involved in the repatriation of the children, but Ansar Burney Trust is still the most reliable source for information on slavery and trafficking to the Middle East.

I have seen quite a few programmes on them on TV, so added some bits from those here in writing.

npov
This page reads like an article from a humanitarian magazine. That is to say, too much npov with sentences like "Still, there have been many success stories." and to much elevation of the Ansar Burney Trust, just say that they rescued the kids and are spreading awarness. Dont make it a full blown endorsment of them. Johhny-turbo 00:27, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Damn right it reads like a humanitarian magazine. I did some checking, and sure enough, the Wiki articles for the Ansar Burney Trust and Ansar Burney were taken WORD FOR WORD from ansarburney.org. I wouldn't be surprised if quite a bit of this article was written by the same people. Now, there are two options:
 * 1. The scandal is false. This is a scam, the photos were staged, and Ansar Burney is just trying to make easy money off people with good intentions.  This material has to be removed.
 * 2. The scandal is true. SURELY, SURELY, someone else would have taken notice.  Someone besides Ansar Burney, the Ansar Burney Trust, or Ansar Burney's HBO documentary MUST have some kind of information published.  The material must be modified heavily.

Now, I am rather inclined to believe, based on this page (under Qatar), that the scandal is true. But the way in which it has been presented on Wikipedia is almost completely discreditable. Anybody else have some thoughts on this? The Dogandpony 03:34, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

o.O This is my first time editing a talk page, so I'm probably doing it wrong, but...

I agree -- it's probably true, but whoever put this BS in is just using Wiki as a soapbox. Wiki is -- without dispute -- an encylopaedia. This article is not only totally irrelevant to its title but it sounds like a poster stuck up to advertise children's rights. Personally I think it ought to be flagged for deletion if no one who knows more about the sport expands it. This is like a damn advertisement for charity like on TV, not an encyclopaedia-tone article.

I know nothing about the issue, otherwise I'd edit it myself.


 * on second thoughts, I'm going to propose deletion for it. There's only two sentencesabout the subject itself and, hell knows, I've lived in Australia all my life and the closest thing I've heard about or seen to camel racing is beachside camel rides. No idea about Africa and the Middle East.Misaki Suzuhara 04:12, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Accuracy
I'm actually writing a legal article on this subject right now, and from the immense amount of research I've done, I've actually found this report to be quite accurate. It does read like a subjective reporting from an NGO, but when you're dealing with a difficult issue such as this, it is quite difficult to remain objective. There have been changes in some of these countries with the introduction of robot jockeys, but there still remain serious concerns about driving this practice underground, making it harder to detect. If you want to find out more about the treatment of some of these children, see Camel Jockeys of Rahimyar Khan (1.5 mb). For a nationalist view of camel races in the UAE, see Camel Racing in the Gulf. --Shashi.k 21:39, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

The problem that is cited is that this is an encyclopedia- emotional issues, whether rightfully or wrongly heartfelt have no place in such articles. It discredits the hard work of the many thousands of people who contribute to the articles as well as lending credence to the notion that such an article as this may well be overly subjective. The cause of creating an encyclopedia, as with many objective accounts of issues is greater than any individual need to galvanise support in the readers. it is for this reason that the article must be toned down to read as a purely factual account of an incident.. much as a forensic scientist however emotionally affected by an individual crime must remain passive as to the findings and reports. In the long run it is the validity and objectivity of articles that gives them the power, and no individual case, however strongly felt, is worth jeapordising that impartiality.

max- 13/05/06

I agree. This article is trying to induce a moral panic. There is NO SUBJECT in which it is impossible to write with NPOV. "Neutral" does not mean "blind". Present the facts, cite them, and let the reader judge. This business of the Ansar Burney Trust is suspicious and disturbing. The group should not be linked three times AND provide the photos AND claim to be the only group stopping this evil. By the end of the article I expected to be asked for "a small contribution." I'm not doubting that this goes on (well, I am), but as it says right here beneath this text box: Content must be verifiable. The Dogandpony 03:01, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Definately needs to be moved/split
Certainly, this artice is simply WRONGLY titled. the article is about "CHILD ABUSE IN THE CAMEL RACING INDUSTRY". Even if the correct topic cant be expanded, this article needs to be moved or redirect to an article about the child abuse issue.


 * WHAT ABOUT "rapes in the sex traffic industry", with having a separate article on sex trafficking which shows only good stuff about "the industry"? Have you ever heard of "camel racing" which is not associated with "child abuse"? If not, then there's no such sport as "camel racing". There's just the abuse. And "camel racing" is, then, just what the article is about.

Completely agree. So much about this article is subjective and emotionally driven. It needs to be rewritten or deleted. And if it is rewritten it should then moved to something like "Child Abuse In The Camel Racing Industry." Who is up for it?--Tooiha 13:34, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Currently, Child_camel_jockeys redirects here; maybe that should be reversed, or split the racing and jockeys into seperate articles. The current content doesn't seem to have much to do with racing. -Sanbeg 17:41, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

I have re-directed Child camel jockeys to this page. There are adequate articles on child labor, human trafficking, and human rights. If interested readers want to know about these issues, I suggest they look to those articles. Nimur 14:38, 18 December 2006 (UTC)


 * At this point, I would also like to point out the following:

I do not believe that the content in question is legitimate or encyclopedic. I am not trying to condone child-abuse, in camel-racing industries or any other. But, it is silly to have a separate article for it. We could follow the trend and create a "Child abuse at McDonald's," "Child abuse in Department Stores," and "Child abuse in construction industry" - this is really unnecessary. The correct course of action, I believe, is to redirect all "Camel Racing"-related content to the Camel racing article, and leave "Child abuse" in the Child abuse article. Nimur 15:00, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * 1) The information which was formerly contained (in this article or the Child Camel Jockey article) came largely from a sensationalized HBO "documentary" (of questionable journalistic integrity), or from the producers of this documentary ; and
 * 2) "Camel Jockey" is an ethnic slur against Arab people.  I believe a large part of the content is racially motivated, intended to demonize the people of Qatar and the UAE by lumping an entire sport into isolated criminal activity.

Totally agree with Nimur, we should make one article about Camel racing and include everything about it. NoPity2 18:50, 19 August 2008 (UTC

average speed
Are there some references about the sentence "Camels can run at speeds up to 65 km/h (18 m/s; 40 mph) in short sprints and they can maintain a speed of 40km/h (11 m/s; 25 mph) for an hour."? --Dawuhd Arafim (talk) 10:54, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

Worst artice ever?
The title of the article is Camel Racing. Not about children. The abuse of retired camels was somehow omitted.

Are both dromedaries and Bactrian camels used? If not, why not? Are camels of both sexes used? Which are more successful? How old are they? Betting? How much? How organised? Myriad other factors not addressed, see horse and greyhound racing as models. AnnaComnemna (talk) 14:54, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Concur. There's almost nothing here about camel racing, but lots about child jockeys. While their story is terrible and deserves telling, I think there should be some mention made here of actual camel racing. 78.100.98.42 (talk) 08:47, 22 March 2015 (UTC)

Reasons for not using regular adult jockeys
I was wondering why they didn't revert back to using regular adults as jockeys. It's not that camels can't take their load as they were used in the past in warfare. Quick search engine results did show that the robots aren't cheap but nothing about this, so I assume it's just because how competitive the racing got. Ugog Nizdast (talk) 16:37, 23 August 2016 (UTC)

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More inline citations
This article is in need of more inline citations and sources for verification. SpiritedMichelle (talk) 23:24, 30 December 2017 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: The Middle East through Many Lenses
— Assignment last updated by Biographiefrfm (talk) 17:55, 22 October 2023 (UTC)