Talk:Castiel, Switzerland

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was Page moved, DAB created for Castiel  Ron h jones (Talk) 01:57, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Castiel → Castiel (municipality) — Castiel (Supernatural) receives seven times as many hits as the municipality page does. Because the municipality page is merely the name, a large number of its current hits can probably also be attributed to people searching for the character's article. This shows that Castiel (Supernatural) is the primary topic for "Castiel". Ω pho  is  00:23, 26 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Castiel (Supernatural) → Castiel
 * Conditional Support. WP:PLACE would suggest Castiel, Switzerland or Castiel, Plessur as the disambiguated name for the municipality, rather than Castiel (municipality).  I'm also not convinced that the fictional character is unambiguously the primary meaning for the name - the TV series won't be as popular as it is now forever.  WP:DAB therefore suggests that Castiel should be a two-element dab page. Tevildo (talk) 16:30, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Per the preferred methods for determined a primary topic (such as Google search and page hits), Castiel (Supernatural) is shown to be it. As I explained, many searchers are also looking for the character rather than the municipality. This is evidenced by the fact that the municipality only had 337 hits in August 2008. In September 2008 (when the character debuted), the municipality had a whopping 23,582 hits.
 * Last month, the character had 34,065 hits. Since the municipality has not changed since last year, it's actual average monthly hit is probably still around 330. The character receive 100x more hits than the municipality, showing that "Castiel (Supernatural)" is clearly the primary topic. Two-element dab pages are only used when there is no primary topic, which clearly is not the case. Ω  pho  is  19:07, 26 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Support move of Castiel (Supernatural) → Castiel per nom and WP:PRIMARYTOPIC; But agree with Tevildo that current Castiel should be moved to Castiel, Switzerland. Station1 (talk) 23:20, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Oppose it should move to Castiel, Switzerland ; Oppose Castiel (Supernatural) should remain where it is, this is WP:RECENTISM at work. I would support a dab page being placed at the primary name though. The meaning of Castiel is explained in the article Theophory in the Bible, so would be the third entry in the dab page. 70.29.208.10 (talk) 03:13, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * This is not Recentism, which mainly applies to real world events that are developing day-by-day. Castiel is a fictional character from a famous TV show, and will always be more relevant than a municipality. The municipality currently only gets a few hundreds monthly hits, while fictional character articles from over ten years ago still get thousands of hits. Castiel in Theophory in the Bible is merely a name on a list. Per dab rules, it is not to be included. There are only two topics, which WP:PRIMARYTOPIC guidelines determine is Castiel (Supernatural). Ω  pho  is  06:16, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Castiel in the Theophory article is exactly what alot of people want, since it explains what "Castiel" means, even Supernatural fans would be looking for such information. 76.66.202.108 (talk) 20:23, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * No, not a lot, relatively. Fewer than 1000 readers per month look at the Theophory article, compared to 35 or 40,000 for the Supernatural article. You can still have a dab page at Castiel (disambiguation) if you like, while meeting the guidelines at WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Station1 (talk) 03:58, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * That's probably because you can't find the theophory article unless you search intensely, or know exactly where to look, since there's no dab page. 76.66.197.17 (talk) 05:21, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * But would it really go from 30,000 if it were listed on a dab page? Station1 (talk) 05:53, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * As I already stated, DAB guidelines would prohibit the Theophory article on a dab page. It is merely a blip on a list, and is not relevant to this discussion as that article's topic is not "Castiel". Ω  pho  is  05:45, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Technically, yes, but better to have the primary topic at Castiel and a harmless 3-item dab page Castiel (disambiguation), than to have the dab page at Castiel. Station1 (talk) 05:53, 28 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Do what station 1 said. - Peregrine Fisher (talk) (contribs) 06:34, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Oppose Move to a disambiguation page. warrior  4321  23:32, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Care to give a reason, given the overwhelming evidence that Castiel (Supernatural) is the primary topic and dab guidelines which specify not to use a dab page in this case? Ω  pho  is  04:37, 28 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Oppose sort of I think the article on the place in Switzerland should be move to Castiel, Switzerland and Castiel turned into a dab page. Article traffic does not tell the whole story here, and as the IP points out, Wikipedia should try to avoid recentism. While there might be popular interest in the TV character, the majority of Google scholar and books hits indicate that the Swiss place is more dominant in the sources.
 * The Swiss place in Google books (over 200 hits) and scholar (nearly 300 hits)
 * The TV character in Google books (25 hits) and scholar (15 hits)
 * Just because the article doesn't get as much traffic as the TV character does not mean the TV character is more important. Nev1 (talk) 17:53, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Your google searches are highly misrepresented. Many of the results are either just for Switzerland, or "Castiel" is referring to a person's name instead of the municipality. Ω  pho  is  20:03, 28 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment. 15 (20?) years ago, Donatello would have had a similar "obvious primary meaning".  The character is popular _now_.  He won't be popular forever. Tevildo (talk) 19:32, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Donatello the character is named after the primary topic. Castiel is not named after the municipality. Ω  pho  is  19:59, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * That's a faulty argument. Being named after something does not make it less "notable" in wiki terms than the original. Case in point: Boston, Massachusetts was named after Boston, Lincolnshire. Nev1 (talk) 20:05, 28 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Move Castiel → Castiel, Switzerland since it already exists as a redirect and it should be moved. Don't move Castiel (Supernatural) → Castiel.  Create a dab page if desired otherwise leave a redirect to the city. Vegaswikian (talk) 07:17, 1 January 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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