Talk:Cats (musical)/Archive 1

Importance on Broadway
User:19204 added the following paragraph to the article:
 * Cats was part of the major European influence on Broadway in the 80's and along with Miss Saigon, The Phantom of the Opera, and Les Misérables, they are often collectively known as the greatest musicals in history.

I am concerned that this is unsourced opinion. Do we have a source to cite for these assertions? If we can cite sources then there is no problem with including such claims. In the meantime, I have removed it from the article.&mdash;Theo (Talk) 22:09, 17 Jun 2005 (UTC)


 * Until the superlative sin the last clause, the statement is mostly correct. I think they're sometimes called the "Big Four" ... on the West End the big foru were POTO, Cats, Les Mis, and Starlight Express instead of Miss Saigon.


 * I'l see if I can find a quote.

--Kunzite 02:27, 10 February 2006 (UTC)


 * "Backstage costs in London, as in New York; have now reached really dangerous levels. I have a feeling that the day of the big musical is ending and that, although "Cats," "Les Mis" and "Phantom" will be with us all over the world for a long time to come, they may well be the first and last of their kind. "Sunset" and "Saigon" have done their stuff all over the world, but it still is not quite the same as the "big three" and maybe it never will be. I think people have started to look for something a little different in scale, and shows are going to have to get smaller again. "Whistle Down The Wind" and "By Jeeves" are comparatively quite small shows, and I think we've got to rein in our costs. The technology is now totally out of control. When "West Side Story" first opened, the word "foldback" had never been heard in a theater, and now if you're not careful you'll get whole casts wearing earpieces. Soon there'll be whole musicals done by robots miming."


 * --Title: ANDREW LLOYD WEBBER, By: Morley, Sheridan, Billboard, 00062510, 10/19/96, Vol. 108, Issue 42


 * --Kunzite 02:49, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

Newfoundland
Can anyone prove that the Newfoundland versions of Mungojerrie and Rumpelteazer are both female? I cant imagine that working at all, it'd clash with Bomby and Demeter as the female duo. &mdash;The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.97.25.5 (talk &bull; contribs).


 * It should be removed as it's not important. Newfoundland was either a regional production of the show or an amateur production. They can present the show as casting needs dictate.  There were a handfull of shows presented in early February 2006 at the St. John's Arts and Culture Centre in St. John's, Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada.   --Kunzite 17:43, 19 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Agreed. Done.

Personal Interperatations
Please to Kunzite and others, dont put your personal interperatation or opinions in the article, ie things like "Jellylorum is portrayed as Gus' adult daughter", this is unproven and not mentioned in the show or explained in any way other than yout personal opinion.

As for the Quaxo and Misto being 2 different characters in Japan, that's actually true. Quaxo is usually female. Dont just remove it and claim it as weird and untrue just because you dont believe it, it is fact.

Basically, lets just keep the article official. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TR Wolf (talk • contribs)


 * You are mistaken. I AM keeping it official. In Japan there is *no* Quaxo character. Quaxo has been a female character in two major productions only: Finland and the tour that the Zürich cast spawned.


 * Finland had a totally non-traditional casting and no other characters from the Finland production have been noted. For the Zürich tour it was only the name for the character who did the tap deul with Jennyanydots and was played by the same person as by Jemima.


 * But 100% NOT Japan. See also: List of international character names from catsmusical.com and See also currrent Cats Tokyo Cast list  and the official page with list of characters http://www.shiki.gr.jp/applause/cats/name.html.   If you can provide infomation otherwise, please provide the source.


 * Japan has a Sillabub and a Jemima. Perhaps this is what you're thinking of?

--Kunzite 17:44, 26 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Dunno, wasnt me who originally reported it. But the rest of my point about personal interperatations still stands. TR_Wolf


 * I have not injected any personal interpretations into the article and I often remove then when they are added by others. I removed an untrue statement that was put in by another editor. The only personal opinion was marked in the "change log" of the article explaining the reason for removal, nowhere in the main page. Anyone familiar with the Japanese production or can read the character descriptions on the official site knows it is not true.  --Kunzite 19:54, 26 March 2006 (UTC)


 * No, my point still stands, in regards to adding things like "Quaxo is unimpressed by Tugger..." or "Grizabella is believed to be Munkustrap's mother..." (etc etc) in character details, and I dont mean just you, Im referring to people who do the aforementioned things, ie their own opinions and interpretations of things in the show which haven't been officially confirmed or acknowledged. Fan opinion etc. I'm sure you understand. TR_Wolf


 * I'm not disagreeing with the point. I'm disagreeing with being singled out for something I didn't do. --01:59, 29 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Well the way the revisions were made implicated that you put in things like "She has no solo lines, which combined with her coloring has lead fans to speculate that she is deaf, making her dancing to the music even more magical." about Victoria. If you didnt, then my apologies, but its this sort of speculation in the official article which kind of annoys me, its just fan stuff.

I just removed some MORE fan speculation in the character parts! Please people, stop putting too much information per character, or your personal interperatations and opinions of the characters, its just a brief description of the character, we dont need a big detailed description of how they act and what they do, especially if they're just chorus! TR_Wolf

Look, speculation is what makes cats and any film, book or musical special and interesting. I think that Demeter has supernatural powers but then I'm a fantasy fanatic. what i'm saying is, speculation is what makes everything interesting. I think its good that people can speculte on their favourite characters. If it annoys you TR_Wolf then i'm sorry but maybe you shouldn't read this page. User: Jam


 * Uh... no... speculation is fine, thinking your own personal things about the characters is fine, thats how it becomes personal, however what Im saying is that THAT sort of thing should stay in the Discussion tab perhaps, and not put on the official entry, as its just opinion and personal interperatation, and if we did that on all the articles and for all opinions, all the entries would be massive! So please, Im not being nasty, Im asking kindly, keep personal opinions and interperatations off the main article page TR_Wolf


 * Feel free to speculate all you want here. Don't do it on the wikipedia unless you can provide a source. (When speculation becomes fact.) See:WP:V and No original research --Kunzite 05:11, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

'Flowery Language'
In my latest edit, I mention "flowery dialogue", and this is things like mentioning a "pas de deux" (which I left in). My change was when the original description of the Conjuring Turn was "approximately 29 spins" and changed to "pirouettes" and then more recently "a la seconde turns"... I just dont think there's any need for this, its kind of pretencious. So I changed it back to "spins"... I think we all know what "spins" are ;) TR_Wolf

Images
I'm not happy that the bot has deleted the picture of Jemima. Does anyone have a good Cats picture that can be used here? Perhaps of the London cast or the DVD cast, as they had some good promo shots. TR_Wolf
 * I'll add some this weekend. The photos HAVE to have fairuse rationals in the article AND clear copyright and sourcing statements on the image pages else they're bot chow. --Kunzite 12:38, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Great! :) Just make sure its the nice refined London version or DVD version, the US Tour versions give me nightmares with their 'quality' :/ TR_Wolf
 * Well, the fourth US tour wasn't so bad.  But people usually prefer regional versions of the show.,   I was going to include a few different shows; one London, one Japan, and maybe one of the more esoteric productions... --Kunzite 23:06, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Pic
Its nice to have a pic, but how about one of the London or DVD cast to some degree? The current pic looks like either a very old production or the US Tour, I dont like the costume/make up, but then that's just a personal thing :/ TR_Wolf
 * It's from the 2002-ish South African Production. Costumes based off of the 1999 Aussie Cats Runaway to the Circus Tour. I'm looking for a few more to add into the article.  New comments at the bottom, please.  --Kunzite 19:32, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I still adore: http://www.stage-entertainment.de/images/cats_castwebber.jpg and think that would be superb, hehe. TR_Wolf

birthday?
May 11, 1981 -> May 11, 2001

that makes it the 20th birthday... The 21st would be May 11, 2002... or what ?

May 11, 2001 is the beginning of the 21st year, but it is still the 20th birthday. (at least that's how thing work in french)

If someone could explain that to me!

thx,

ZeroJanvier 00:52, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

"It was better than Cats"
The paragraph about "bland" testimonials, including "I laughed, I cried, it was better than Cats", is there some cite for this? I ask because I only recall this as a filmed segment from Saturday Night Live. It was a fake commercial for an on Broadway hypnotist, the joke being every one who came out after seeing this hypnotist said the same thing - "I laughed, I cried, it was better than Cats", all in the same bland monotone used in comedy to indicate someone is hypnotised. So, did the author of this section simply remember a joke as an actual fact? Rybock 15:49, 13 August 2006 (UTC)
 * That sounds like the case. I too remember this John Lovitz skit. The entry should be changed or, better yet, deleted. User:steveg99


 * I agree; I've deleted it. If a citation can be had, it could potentially go back in. MichaelCaricofe 05:23, 9 September 2006 (UTC)