Talk:Cem Sultan

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Really an important figure
Cem Sultan is an important figure in the history of the Ottoman Dynasty. He was similar to his father Mehmed II. He was a warrior, he was a reformist(he used to love modern things just like his father). On the other hand, Bayezid II was conservative and he was more like a diplomat rather that a commander. It is only a guess but if Cem Sultan could be the Emperor, he would conquer more and maybe he could complete the campaign of Otronto(Invasion of Italy) which Mehmet II started just before his death(murder). With respect, Deliogul 21:38, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

On "in television"
Alexander VI was elected pope a few years before Djem died, so his presence in the show is not anachronistic as stated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.54.174.236 (talk) 16:39, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Sultan Cem
I moved the page from Cem Sultan to Sultan Cem. The reason is simple: The word "sultan" when used after a name denotes a woman. Like Valide Sultan or the daughters of the Ottoman Sultans. Some Ottoman historiographers have used "Cem Sultan" instead of "Sultan Cem" for not recognising his de facto sultanate (sat on the throne 3 weeks in Bursa, before he was forced to escape from the country), although Cem complied with everything proper of a Sultan: Coins with his name, referral of name in friday prayers, and the most important the "biad"(notification of loyalty) of high court officials of the time. I will develop the article with sources to clarify these issues. Please give me some time. --E4024 (talk) 22:54, 13 November 2012 (UTC)

Requested move 18 June 2020

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 

The result of the move request was: page moved. (non-admin closure)  ~SS49~   {talk}  00:31, 26 June 2020 (UTC)

Sultan Cem → Cem Sultan – Per WP:COMMONNAME. Plus Sultan after the name is not a title for women, Mehmed the Conqueror used the titles ... Sultan for their sons. See here if you want check yourself. From Mehmed's letter: "Sağ kol alayını oğlum Bayezid Sultan kumandasına verip, Mihal oğlu Ali Bey, .." So the move above was without consensus, I request to remove back to Cem Sultan. Beshogur (talk) 12:34, 18 June 2020 (UTC)


 * Support this should not have been moved in the first place. Constantine  ✍  12:48, 19 June 2020 (UTC)


 * The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Title
The title is completely wrong. Cem was never recognized as a sultan. He was a suitor. As such, he is entitled to the title of Şehzade Cem. Among other things, the men's titles never went after the name, but before. Only women bore the title after the name. Sira Aspera (talk) 12:48, 19 June 2022 (UTC)


 * the men's titles never went after the name, but before That's incorrect statement. What do you mean "suitor", he declared himself as sultan, recognized or not. Beside that Cem Sultan is the comonname, discussed before. Yet, TDV IA uses Cem Sultan as well. Beshogur (talk) 13:47, 19 June 2022 (UTC)

Grave?
Cem is a false story, what is his grave doing deep inside the stronghold of the Ottoman Turks?

he was raised to be an enemy of Christiandom his body would probably never be found, ever!

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