Talk:Chaldoran

Separate county from city
Even if the county and the city are to occupy the same article, please separate the discussion. For example in the last edit (29 Feb. 2008 by 217.219.145.70, the city does not have a border with Turkey. --Bejnar (talk) 01:20, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

There is an article (a stub) on Chaldoran County. Should these be merged or should we separate the town from the county? If separate, does the battle go with the county since it was outside of the town, or should it be included in both as history? Does Holy Tatavous Church (Ghareh Kelisa) go with the county, or since it is only 7 km outside of the town, should it go with the town? or both? If merged, should we just make the stub a REDIRECT since there is essentially no content there? I note that originally in 2006/2007 that this article was only about the town and Chaldoran County was about the county. It was not until the edits on 14:50, 10 January 2008 by Mani1 that the two were conflated. Should we just go back to the pre-Mani1 status (keeping the new good edits of course)? --Bejnar (talk) 00:53, 6 October 2008 (UTC)

After due consideration, and for uniformity, lets keep the two articles and move the county stuff to Chaldoran County. --Bejnar (talk) 20:43, 25 July 2009 (UTC)

Name
In most English language references pre-2000 the name used is "Chaldoran". I note that there is a tendency in recent literature to use transliterated Farsi instead. --Bejnar (talk) 23:32, 5 October 2008 (UTC)

Avajiq
At 17:08, 18 September 2007 Sahar83 added the reference to the town of Avajiq (آواجيق), indicating that the Farsi Wikipedia was the source. I found the town in the far north west corner of Chaldoran County almost on the Turkish border. It lies on the road across the border to Doğubeyazıt, Turkey (not the main main road that goes easterly to Maku, but one that goes southerly from just west of Doğubeyazıt). The town was listed on one map (MSN) as Arab Dizaj. It was listed on another perhaps as Qendeal (nav. chart ONC G4). GoogleEarth lists the coordinates as 39.33056°N, 44.15389°W (39.329933, 44.153969), which the gazetteer from Falling Rain Genomics, Inc. lists as Kelisa Kandi. I also found a reference to Avajiq in The Cambridge History of Iran by Richard Nelson Frye, p. 519, indicating that Abbas Mirza had moved the Turkic Airumlu tribe south of the Aras River to Avajiq. Minorsky, V (1944) "Roman and Byzantine Campaigns in Atropatene" (Bulletin of the School of Oriental and African Studies 11(2): pp. 243-265) says "Although what Strabo means by Abos seems to be the southern spurs of Mt. Ararat, it is possible that the name is still reflected in that of the small district Ava-jiq through which pass the communications between Erzerum and Khoy. ... In fact, in the neighbourhood of Avajiq lie the head-waters both of the Murad-su (eastern Euphrates) and of the Sari-su flowing to the Araxes." p. 259. I haven't yet identified which tributary of the Aras (Araxes) was referred to by the ubiquitous Sari-su. Anyway, appropriate data should go with the County article. --Bejnar (talk) 02:41, 6 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Avajiq now has its own aricle. --Bejnar (talk) 20:43, 25 July 2009 (UTC)