Talk:Cheese analogue/Archive 1

=content from Soy cheese talk page=

"Usually does not contain casein"
I'm removing this part, since there's no citation and it isn't consistent with my personal experience. I'll replace it with "Soy cheese sometimes contains casein, a milk protein." Djk3 (talk) 21:06, 13 December 2007 (UTC)


 * Agreed. I did some research on this a few years ago in southern california. A big table I made is at b:User:Kellen/Scratch. In particular the "Rella" brands often contain casein; VeganRella is vegan, TofuRella and AlmondRella were not at the time of my research. Obviously this isn't citable, but it's a data point. KellenT 15:38, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Fixing up this article
I reworded the introductory paragraph so that it is more neutral and doesn't make value claims about soy cheese. I also removed three of the pictures. One is enough, since this article is rather small, and I think that we should opt for the "regular" cheese (slices) photo without the brand-name showing. I think that further changes should be made, but I thought I should ask for opinions here before doing so. I think that the list of flavors should be removed, as it isn't very encyclopedic. Additionally, I think that most of the external links should be removed. There is a huge number of them, and this is a very small article. The article also very heavily focuses on the Follow Your Heart and Sheese (Bute Island) brands. The references should not be those companies that produce the soy cheese, but independent sources. Please let me know what you think about this! I'll follow through on a few of the changes in a week or two if nobody weighs in. Djk3 (talk) 06:54, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I've made some substantial changes. My edits to the external links are well-justified by External Links, and I think we might go even further by removing the blog links.  That doesn't seem like a huge deal to me right now, though.  I think that the next order of business is to provide citations from respected sources, rather than just the soy cheese manufacturers, and then to expand the article! Djk3 (talk) 08:24, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Call for semi-protection due to constant vandalism
This article is obviously vandalized by a certain user (Djk3), for personal "war inside the Wikipedia" reasons. The goal of those "edits" seems to be the complete eradication or rewriting of this article to a stadium, where it is useless or almost useless for people, who seek actual information about soy cheese. My personal opinion is, that this "user" is one of the impostors, claiming to be somebody else, and actually doing destructive work for certain interest groups (in this case probably the milk lobby?). Most of the claims of this user are not backed and only showing his complete ignorance towards this foodstuff. For example, all soy cheese I ever purchased was lower in fat and completely free of any casein. Everybody who is used to eating soy cheese (like real vegans), knows this plain fact. This page should be edited by editors watching about a great variety of other vegan articles. If necessary, I will take all required steps to ensure, that this article is watched over properly and edited by people, who care about the exact content. More info - Wikipedia:Edit war. Daimakaicho (talk) 06:53, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, lord. Djk3 (talk) 07:01, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Go to Hell with your Lord you little slug. And have some fun there :-D Daimakaicho (talk) 07:16, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Please see WP:NPA and WP:AGF. KellenT 12:34, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't know. I'm watching the article now, but I haven't gone through the whole history and from the little I have seen up to now, it is not obvious that Djk3 has such vile intentions. In any case, I don't think sending em to hell is a solution, or even very appropriate to mention. And though slugs may be sentient beings, they are usually unable to edit Wikipedia articles, so I believe Djk3 is not one. David Olivier (talk) 14:01, 9 March 2008 (UTC)
 * I am not forced to stay in the Wikipedia or to contribute or anything if one of you can (yourself or asking any other trusted editors) ensure that this article will prevail/grow/improve and not being constantly deleted/rewritten to the form of an almost useless stub (that's exactly what this "editor" did, and I consider this as vandalism).
 * Wikipedia is one of the 10 most popular/known pages on the entire internet, and this is creating some unwanted frictions (like certain special interest groups "editing" unwanted articles partially down to invisibility/insignificance).
 * This article needs monitoring by several vegan editors. It is probably even one of those, which should be semi of fully protected. There is a huge controversy over milk and lactose intolerance going on, and the article on milk has been protected already long time ago.
 * If this one user shows any kind of contribution to the article, fine. But so far I have seen only reverting and deleting and rewriting into a stub-form, contrary to all the other contributors in this case. This seems fairly strange, considering all other circumstances (he claims to be a vegan, the article is very small and needing positive improvements, it is a subject of great interest for vegans, there is a huge controversy around dairy cheese/factory farming/lactose going on with a lot of really big companies involved fearing declining profits).
 * I greatly miss a semi-protection for people, who do not use the DEL button. Especially in serious articles. And a consensus about monitoring of articles by people, who actually contribute to the given subject positively and in a constructive way.
 * Daimakaicho (talk) 14:42, 9 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Removing unverifiable information is central to maintaining wikipedia. It is foolish to attribute a specific POV to someone based on their removal of unverifiable statements. KellenT 15:41, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Aroma
Have removed the following statement as unreferenced and it doesn't seem true to me. The reason toasted soy cheese doesn't smell like toasted dairy cheese is because it's not!

"This results from the methods of preparation of soy cheese kinds - until today most brands are assembled like a type of design food, and not using a natural method (fermentation, maturing process)."

78.151.174.92 (talk) 10:50, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Food and drink Tagging
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Casein-free, non-soy "cheeses"
I removed Chreese and Veganrella from the 2nd paragraph, about vegan, casein-free products. Those products are not soy cheeses. Chreese is made from yeast, and Veganrella from brown rice. Since this article is about soy cheese, any discussion over the issue of casein content could include mention of non-soy vegan cheese products, but how about in a subsection, not in the article's head. Also, those products, if mentioned, should not be stated to be soy products. --99.163.50.12 (talk) 20:35, 9 September 2008 (UTC)


 * This article should be changed to vegan cheese or plant cheese versus soy cheese.--Sugarcubez (talk) 21:24, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Comparison to dairy cheese
What does this sentence mean:

"Some soy cheeses have been named to have a very unpleasant or very uncommon taste for those being used to consumption of dairy cheese."

I'd fix it if I knew what was trying to be said. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.234.232.37 (talk) 20:31, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Non-notable information and sourcing per WP:RS
I have removed a great deal of information and links that seemed to do little more than promote "soy cheese" POV, websites and products. Unless there are significant news articles that designate this product from other cheese alternatives, I don't see why this is a separate article.Flowanda | Talk 02:18, 11 January 2009 (UTC)
 * end of Soy cheese talk page material.

link to Future Food
I think Future Food would perfectly fit in the reference list, gives a good overview of the top brands worldwide. Please check out http://www.futurefood.org/soymilk/index_en.php Best, Boris —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.113.84.212 (talk) 13:12, 9 May 2009 (UTC)

page move
Was this discussed prior to the move? I think this is a better article title than "soy cheese" but it still should be discussed. Perhaps the discussion wasn't moved. I believe that it should be if it wasn't.

As well, this move was apparently done without a great deal of preparation since "soy cheese" was consistently left, except in the title. I've gone through and changed that to the page title when appropriate. As well, whoever edited this inserted a major plug for one brand of cheese analog since almost all the refs were to that brand. I have added other brands for balance.

Please review and correct or modify. Thanks. Bob98133 (talk) 16:51, 16 January 2009 (UTC)


 * It makes sense to have an article that addresses all forms of cheese substitute, including soy cheese, rice cheese, etc. While "Cheese analogue" describes what these are sufficiently, it sounds rather odd and I've never heard to it referred to as such.  Gobonobo  T C 21:10, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

"Cheese analogues are available in these types"
This list is neither complete (however it appears as if it is complete!) nor does it really make much sense. Cheese analogues only try to resemble these types of cheese, they are very far from the real thing. --The O o (talk) 14:14, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * If you have referenced additions to add to the list,or to help it make sense to you, please do so. The Comparison to dairy cheese section makes it clear that there are differences between cheese and cheese analogs. Bob98133 (talk) 14:49, 11 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Cheese analogues is rather too complicated a phrase the title should be veg cheese as that is more suitable title for the topic.
 * Cheese analogues does not automatically mean veg cheese. Cheese analogue can also be made from alternative animal fats and sometimes even contain minor amounts of milk. So it's not really veg cheese. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.215.138.34 (talk) 10:08, 1 July 2011 (UTC)
 * I feel method of making Soy cheese should be included to make the article more informative.Pathare Prabhu (talk) 16:53, 2 February 2011 (UTC)

'These products are usually consumed due to'
This article depicts cheese analogues as different types of cheese that customers choose for. However, I think the most common form of cheese analogues is in 'cheap' cheese, e.g. pizza cheese, cheeseburger cheese, etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.46.128.232 (talk) 18:39, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

Vegetarian Vs. Vegan
Vegetarians eat cheese... It is vegans who do not eat cheese. Correcting the incorrect terminology of the page... Someone who can't even keep these two straight should not be editing pages concerning vegan food. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.22.251.138 (talk) 19:27, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
 * That's totally wrong. Ethical vegetarians should not eat cheese, but most of them don't know this: Cheese is not vegetarian! Cheese is made using enzymes from calves' stomachs. These enzymes can also be created using bacteria, however, that's not how most types of cheese are made. You are the one who should not edit pages concerning vegan food. --2001:16B8:3150:D200:CC2:740C:C594:F1EB (talk) 18:39, 4 October 2018 (UTC)

Production?
I came to this article to find out how cheese analogues are produced. I assume it's made the same way as regular cheese, with (for example) pasteurized soy milk being mixed with rennet and so forth. But that's just an assumption. I know that at least one person (me!) would benefit from having this article being updated with more specifics as to how cheese analogue production and regular cheese production compare. Any experts out there want to chime in? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.122.126.131 (talk) 09:47, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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=Name= The name "non-dairy cheese" should be mentioned as well; it is the name i prefer to use, and it is probably fairly widely used overall.--Solomonfromfinland (talk) 10:43, 27 January 2019 (UTC)