Talk:Chipotle/Archive 1

Common Kowledge
The statement about the preference of most culinary experts preferring traditionally smoked chipotles does not cite any source and so it cannot be assumed to be true. In order for one to assume this statement is true one would have to know the preferences of most culinary experts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Foxmajik (talk • contribs) 16:52, 12 July 2009 (UTC)

Recent popularity?
I feel like the Chiptole has been the "It" Ingredient for a few years now in American cuisine (Similar to how Sun-Dried Tomatoes were the big deal in the late 80's early 90's) Literally everything was "Chipotle" this or that, even Subway had some Steak Chipotle thing right at the height of Chipotle-mania. It's died down a little now, because I think people sense it's becoming a cliche to make everything chipotle. I understand mexican food became more popular, but why is it this one specific ingredient that everyone is fawning over?

Is there any reason for this sudden burst of popularity in this ingredient? Was there one chef/restaurant that influenced others to use it? I mean seriously, find me a bag of chipotle-flavored chips before 2000.


 * It tastes good. Actually though, a number of peppers, such as Ancho taste similar, so I think it may have to do with the smoked thing.  People seem to like smoked things.  A place near where we are even smokes their molten cakes (chocolate cupcake not cooked all the way through), if I understand the menu correctly ("smoke added"). --71.192.116.43 21:35, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Is Chipotle really smoked????
I often wonder if the "smoked jalapeno" fact is really an urban myth so oft repeated that everyone believes it? My relatives work argribusiness in the Valley del Yaqui, Sonora, MX and they state to me that the Chilpotle is another chile that just happens to taste smoked. The reason I belive this to be true is because there is no evidence of other Mexican foods being smoked. If they smoke jalapenos, why not pork products, cheeses, etc.? Additionally, if the chilpotle is smoked why don't the smoke particulates come off when handled? I think the smoked jalapeno story is a myth. 21:10, 2 December 2006 (UTC)~ Arturo in San Diego
 * The article says that sometimes liquid smoke is applied. WTF is that? Alpheus 05:18, 18 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Your friends are wrong. In central Mexico other foods are smoked, particularly beef. There is little refrigeration in rural areas so if beef can't be consumed immediately it is smoked. This is called cecina. In Puebla the two chilis that are used to prepare chipotles are jalapeños and huachinangos. Huachinangos are similar to a jalapeño but larger.They ARE smokedSenor Cuete 13:45, 26 August 2007 (UTC)Senor Cuete


 * in our family (from Sonora) we have always prepared cecina, most known at this location by "carne seca" (dried meat or jerky if you want), and its never smoked, only dried, as most of the dried meats in Mexico (particularly beef) they are NOT smoked (but chilpotles are). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.222.71.112 (talk) 15:58, 15 May 2014 (UTC)


 * The fact that your family in Sonora doesn't smoke cecina doesn't prove that this is true everywhere in Mexico. Mexico is a big country. Senor Cuete (talk) 23:06, 17 May 2014 (UTC)

Pronunciation
Call me ignorant, but I believe that Chipotle is pronounced "chi-po-til" as opposed to "chi-pot-lay." I was under the impression that in Nahuatl, the Aztec language, the "tl" at the end is pronounced "til," as in "quetzaquatl." Am I really wrong? I know that a majority of U.S. pronounces it "chi-pot-lay," but I always thought that that was because ignorant Americans thought that "otle" would be pronounced "ot-lay" in Spanish, but because the word isn't Spanish, I don't think it should be.
 * OK you are ignorant but seriously yes you really are wrong. The "tl" is never pronounced as "til". Most Nahuatl nouns end in "tl", "tli" or "in". The article is more more or less correct in it's explanation of the Nahuatl word "chilpoctli" which is an agglutination of the words chil(li) and poctli - derived from the word for smoke, "popocatl". "Chipotle" IS Spanish NOT Nahuatl so it should be pronounced as "cheePOTle". You have severely mangled the name of the feathered serpent which is spelled "Quetzalcoatl" - pronounced "ketsalCOatl". Senor Cuete 13:58, 26 August 2007 (UTC)Senor Cuete

I've wondered about this same thing, but I'm pretty sure that (at least in American English) it is in fact pronounced "chi-pot-lay". According to its origins, though, it would seem that you're right. Which wins, common usage or etymology?

Saying that "tl" is pronounced "til" is ambiguous. To American ears it's roughly accurate; to speakers of other languages, and even other English dialects, "til" does not sound how you think it sounds. (I've made similar mistakes myself :)) In any case, my experience is that in Mexico, chipotle is pronounced as though it were a Spanish word - it ends in "lay".  (And there we go again with more ambiguous pronunciations.) Maw 22:54, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

On a different note, what's up with the paragraph about Tierra Vegetables? It reads like a low-key advertisement. Who or what is Tierra Vegetables, and why should the reader care? 1000 lbs of chiles doesn't sound like all that much, either. Maw 22:54, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

It's amazing and slightly irritating how often chipotle is miscredited as "chipolte." 76.185.78.163 03:04, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Really should be   Senor Cuete (talk) 02:10, 9 June 2011 (UTC)Senor Cuete

Why no info on the resterant?
a fast growing "fast food" resterant that puts an emphasis on quality, mostly know for burritos.

Yes, this article needs to be expanded to include the fast food chain, which, incidentally, is owned by McDonalds.

Info about the fast food chain should go in a different article, eg Chipotle (restaurant). Maw 22:54, 21 April 2006 (UTC)

Chipotle Recipes

 * Chipotle recipes

Central Mexican Pronunciation
In rural Mexico, people sometimes pronounce chipotle as three different sounds. Chile poct tle

Tipico
Should it be "tipico" or "típico"? Badagnani 23:20, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Is Chipotle really smoked???? I often wonder if the "smoked jalapeno" fact is really an urban myth so oft repeated that everyone believes it? My relatives work argribusiness in the Valley del Yaqui, Sonora, MX and they state to me that the Chilpotle is another chile that just happens to taste smoked. The reason I belive this to be true is because there is no evidence of other Mexican foods being smoked. If they smoke jalapenos, why not pork products, cheeses, etc.? Additionally, if the chilpotle is smoked why don't the smoke particulates come off when handled? I think the smoked jalapeno story is a myth. 21:10, 2 December 2006 (UTC)~ Arturo in San Diego
 * You are absolutely wrong and why was it necessary to put this in the discussion twice? See above reply. Senor Cuete 14:11, 26 August 2007 (UTC)Senor Cuete
 * First off, the article says that Chipotle's from either central or southern Mexico, and your relatives are from the north. I've never heard of "smoke particulates" (what?) coming off of anything that's been cold smoked OR hot smoked, both of which are supposed to be done at a low temperature - if you're creating char (which is the only thing I can guess you're talking about) with or without wood, you're grilling.  Ground chipotle has a very distinct, unmistakable smoked smell, not to mention the obvious taste.  If there's something inherent to the chile, why don't fresh jalapenos smell or taste smoked? I've found references to Mexicans (particularly Oaxacans - again, southern Mexico) smoking plenty of foods, from fish to chicken as well as other chiles: Moras (same chile, different wood!), pasilla de Oaxaca...  Indium 17:51, 12 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I've seen traditional chipotle being prepared and it is indeed smoked. Of course some industrial products named chipotle might nowadays be made with smoke aroma. I've also seen both fish and pork being smoked in rural mexican communities. ·Maunus· · ƛ · 20:25, 12 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Doesn't it seem peculiar to you that you've never seen or head of a fresh, raw chipotle? If you find one, then you'll have a case for telling us it's a myth.--Ericjs (talk) 03:31, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

Chile or Chili?
Should probably be spelled consistently. Personally, I think "chili" is more common in ordinary English usage. It is also distinct from the country of the same name. -- abfackeln 12:43, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Definitely not 'chile'. Some sources accept 'chilli'; I and most sources use 'chili'. Alpheus 05:21, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Merriam Webster Unabridged gives both 'chile' and 'chilli' as variants of 'chili' (the main entry).--Ericjs (talk) 03:28, 9 April 2009 (UTC)

In Spanish, chile is correct. Since the article is primarily about the Mexican product, I changed all to the chile. Chili seems to be mostly American English, and chilli seems to be mostly British (and Indian, by extension). There also was a plural "chilies", but I can't imagine where that came from. 207.117.33.135 (talk) 22:17, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

My usage, as an ardent and well-read home cook for nearly 40 years (including a stint in San Antonio for what it's worth) is that in the United States and northern (at least) Mexico, "chile" is the fruit, "chili" is the soup/stew made with a base of chile sauce and often containing meat and/or beans (pulses), while "chilli" is a variant I've seen most often in recipes from England, India, and China. I've read through all the discussion on the Chili pepper article, and have found no good reason to change my usage. MusicPapa (talk) 14:28, 12 February 2014 (UTC)

Scoville precision seems odd
Why is the Scoville rating of the chipotle given as "9,999 - 49,999" instead of "10,000 - 50000"? It seems bizarre to give a precision down to the units with a rating as imprecise as the Scoville. (Are we completely sure that the piquancy is never as low as 9,998?)


 * fixed 16:25, 19 July 2007 (UTC)~

Never refer to yourself as "we" and what are you talking about in that last parenthetical expression? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Senor Cuete (talk • contribs) 17:53, August 29, 2007 (UTC)

Removed text
Much of this text was removed, seemingly needlessly:


 * Chipotles are available in two basic varieties: "brown" chipotles (also called chipotle típico, chile ahumado, or chile meco); and "red" chipotles (also called moritas).  Outside Mexico, chipotles típicos are little known, and, particularly in the United States, commercially available chipotles are almost exclusively of the morita variety, in part because most of the best chipotles produced in Mexico are also consumed there.


 * Chipotles típicos, which are quite stiff and grayish tan to light brown in color, are produced from large green jalapeños that are smoked and dried. This form of chipotle has a deep, smoky flavor and is considered the most authentic variety.  Even when simmered for long periods they retain a firm, meaty, almost crunchy texture.  When cooked, the interior turns a deep red color but the exterior remains tan in color.


 * A less expensive variety of chipotle is the morita, which is produced from smaller, red, ripe jalapeños. Moritas are deep red or reddish-purple in color and not smoked as long as chipotles típicos.  They are leathery and retain more of their moisture than do chipotles típicos. Badagnani 06:23, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Removed paragraph
I have removed this paragraph form the article: "Native Mexicans refer to the pepper variously, as "tzi-POH-tull" and "chee-lay pohc-til", among other regional permutations. The most common English pronunciation, based upon misunderstanding of the Spanish, is "chee-POHT-lay", although some prefer the rather more appropriate "chee-POHT-til". The word is also commonly misspelled chipolte and mispronounced, "chee-POHL-tay", an error of metathesis." Firstly it is completely unsourced. Secondly its pronunciation guides are not very informative and some of them are even misleading. Thirdly who are "natve mexicans?", the indigenous peoples of mexico, or just any mexican? In any case I haven't met any mexicans indigenous or otherwise whose pronunciations are similar to those provided. Fourthly saying that one pronunciation is "more appropriate", "based on a misunderstaning" is not objective language and also not true. Fifthly the common misspelling is irellevant and unsourced and also uses a linguistic concept wrong - metathesis is about changing the order of two sounds, not of two letters. 06:21, 8 August 2008 (UTC)·Maunus· ƛ ·


 * "Chipolte" is a very commonly encountered mispronunciation, even on the Food Network. Badagnani (talk) 07:21, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Then that is a metathesis but the paragraph talks about spelling - and furthermore it is OR unless it can be sourced to someone saying that it is a common pronunciation.·Maunus· ƛ · 07:31, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * OK, Maunus, how would you like the prononciation issue to be addressed? It may not seem important to you, but it indeed is a constant source of confusion for the English speaking world at large, which doesn't know any better than to mispronounce the word "chee-POHT-lay"?  Please give us some wording that can suggest an authentic Mexican pronunciation that will pass your edits.  Thank you.
 * It does not seem inappropriate to me at all to indicate several alternative Mexican dialectical pronunciations if no one will suffice. Wikiuser100 (talk) 20:14, 8 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Still waiting, Maunus. How can we resolve this without you just arbitrarily excising anything you don't like? Wikiuser100 (talk) 13:08, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Firstly you can add sources for your claims of what are common pronunciations and mispronunciations of a word. Secondly you can use ways of transcription that are in fact intelligible and not misleading - your laymans pronunciations can and will be be read in any number of ways. For example your supposedly correct pronunciation is equally flawed as any of the other transcriptions - since mexicans say and not  as your transcription indicates. Thirdly Englishspeakers who talk about chipotle do not base their pronunciations on "misunderstandings of spanish" they don't speak spanish - they speak english and pronounce what was an originally Nahuatl word according to english phonology.·Maunus· ƛ · 16:23, 26 August 2008 (UTC)

Reference in South Park
Is it important enough to mention that Chipotle were mentioned in an episode of the cartoon TV show: "South Park" a number of times? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.88.86.21 (talk) 08:54, 28 March 2010 (UTC)

Chipotle Farm Team
Speaking of Chipotle I have recently been added to there farm team and thought it would be a great way to learn about food and how there "fresh" take on a lot of products can help other companies to evolve and provide better ingredients in there food. Anyone can join the farm team by going to there local Chipotle and asking to be apart of this online experiment in education about food. Not to mention you get free food and shirts out of it. The manager will give you a card with a log on code. Go home punch it in and start learning. There are videos about fresh ingredients and farm raised meats, along with questionnaires, polls, and other goodies hidden within the site. You get badges for everything you learn and after you complete a chapter you get 5 free burritos. After chapter 3 you will receive a t-shirt. Did I mention it's all free. There is even a page for fans to post videos and pictures. I happen to love burrito bars and wish all of them would offer a better quality food product. Jonplante (talk) 18:13, 29 November 2011 (UTC)


 * I added some of the information on the Farm Team to the advertising/publicity section of the article in place of the Farm Team section. I also included a reference from an independant source, i.e. not from Chipotle's website. Angryapathy (talk) 19:25, 29 November 2011 (UTC)