Talk:Chongniu

Claimed exceptions to chongniu-III corresponding to OC *-r-
明 míng and 英 yīng both have the MC -jaeng final (Baxter notation). All words with this final are reconstructed with OC *-r- in most modern reconstructions, but it is not a chongniu MC final. There are four kinds of MC division-III finals: chongniu-III and chongniu-IV, a pair of finals that rhyme but are distinguished after grave initials, "pure" (or "independent") division-III finals, which occur only with grave initials, and "mixed" division-III finals, which occur with all initials. The -jaeng final is of the "pure" type. Some authors reduce the four classes to two by pairing pure and mixed finals with chongniu finals, but how you do this depends on your phonological theory (see Baxter 1992 pp78–79). Baxter does say (pp80–81) that -jaeng, while not chongniu, behaves like a chongniu-III counterpart of the -jieng final.

In short, words with the -jaeng final are not counterexamples to chongniu-III being reconstructed as OC *-r-, and we can dispense with the "general" qualification. Kanguole 17:41, 5 May 2021 (UTC)

regarding this edit summary, the relationship between MC final classes and rows of the Yunjing is quite complex. We need to rely on experts for interpretation. Kanguole 10:29, 6 May 2021 (UTC)