Talk:Clan Ramsay

The Banff referred to is not correct. The Ramsay family is connected to Bamff - see http://www.bamff.co.uk/. Can someone confirm this? caroljoyce 5th May, 2006
 * The seat of the clan is in Bamff in Perthshire, not Banff in Moray. The Ramsays of Banff are one of the five main branches of the clan. Adraeus 23:23, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

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BetacommandBot (talk) 20:05, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Ravens' Isle

 * The name Ramsay is not necessarily of Gaelic origin for in Old Norse the name may translate from hraems-eg (or hrafns-eyr), which means "Ravens' Isle".

I've been looking into this claim, but I'm now pretty sure that the author of this statement meant the name "Ramsey" which should not be confused with Ramsay. Adraeus (talk) 00:52, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Seems like Original Research to me. Careful about variations of names, just because names end in "ey" instead of "ay" or begin with "Mc" instead of "Mac" doesn't mean they are not derived from the same name. Anyways, you can see what the Ancestry website gives for Ramsay here . It is a variant of Ramsey. For Ramsey they give it as a habitational name derived from a place name in Huntingdonshire. The placename is derived from Old English hramsa "wild garlic" + eg "island", "low-lying land". Ancestry cites Dictionary of American Family Names, Oxford University Press ISBN 0-19-508137-4 which should be a sound source for the etymology of names, i think.--Celtus (talk) 05:35, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I think Ancestry.com's claim is equally as baseless as the indented statement. Ramsay is not a variation of Ramsey regardless of whether English revisionists and those with the latter surname would prefer so. Adraeus (talk) 08:37, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Dictionary of American Family Names baseless? Care to cite your sources for "Ramsay is not a variation of Ramsey"?--Celtus (talk) 09:43, 9 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Prepare yourself, this would appear to show your full of it, Ramsay, Ramsey, Ramshay: Ædðlstanus de Rameseia c1036 OEByn (Ess). From Ramsey (Essex, Hunts). The Scottish Ramsays derive from Simund de Ramesie (a1175 Black) who went to Scotland from Ramsey (Hunts).
 * and this, Ramsey: v. RAMSAY
 * and more "English revisionistism", de Ramsey, Ramesey, Ramsey, Ramsay: Nor. 'de Ramsey' i.e., of Ramsey, the name of more than one place in England. Though this surname is an old one in Ireland, most of those who now bear it are the descendants of late immigrants, who came hither from Scotland.
 * --Celtus (talk) 11:01, 9 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I am currently carrying out original research into the origins and migrations of the Ramsays in Scotland up to about 1700 AD. I believe that there is a modern pre-occupation with spelling, especially of names, which becomes rather meaningless pre-C19. My research involves working with medieval documents, mainly in Latin and (latterly) in Scots, and I have come across a large number of variations in how what we now spell Ramsay (or Ramsey) is spelled; here are some examples (often preceded by 'de'): Ram', Ramsa, Raza, Ramesay, Ramesey, Ramissay, Rameseye, Ramsay (1360), Ramsai and Ramesia. In some cases it is spelled differently in the same document! Cases like 'Raza' are tricky, but associated heraldry can provide pretty good evidence of identity.
 * Certainly, I would not argue with the ravens' isle as a reasonable 'meaning'. However, whether it is the ravens' isle in Huntingdonshire (rather than the one in Essex, Wales, Man, Northern Isles or elsewhere) is debatable. The evidence I have researched so far tends to favour a German origin with direct migration to one small part of Scotland, from where further migrations took place. So, depending on the context, Ramsay and Ramsey are quite interchangeable (though I would regard Ramsey as a variation of Ramsay - but I am biased!). Also, I have not seen any hard evidence that the 'original' Simon Ramsay actually originated in Huntingdonshire.
 * --MRamsay 19:00 18 Jul 2008 (UTC)


 * Interesting. I like how the heraldry seems to complement the origin of the name. When is the first occurrence of a coat of arms for any 'Ramsay'? Is it the argent, eagle displayed sable?
 * This ref gives possible etymologies of the place-names, rather than just saying the surname is derived froma place-name:
 *  RAMSEY RAMSAY - (Eng. and Scand.) Bel. to Ramsey = 1. Hram's or Hræm(m)'s Island or Waterside the genit. of O.E. hraem(n) a raven + ég, í(e)g, island, etc.] 2. Ram's Island or Waterside the genit. of O.E. ram(m), a ram.] 3. Ram(m)'s Island or Waterside [the genit. of O.N. rum(m)-r, strong + ey, island, etc.] Harrison, H. Surnames of the United Kingdom: A Concise Etymological Dictionary. Genealogical Publishing Company (1996). page 102.
 *  Ramsey, Hunts, occurs in A-Saxon charters both as Rameseg and Hrameseg. Ramsey, I.o.M., was anciently Ramsöe [Dam.-Norw. ö, island] Simon de Ramsey in Huntingdon settled in Scotland in the 12th century.- MacBain, Inverness Names, p.71. Harrison, H.Surnames of the United Kingdom: A Concise Etymological Dictionary. Genealogical Publishing Company (1996). page 103. --Celtus (talk) 08:10, 19 July 2008 (UTC)

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