Talk:Classical cipher

Comments for Kim
WOW! Kim, you added a LOT of information to this page! Great work :) I really like how you structured the page with subheadings. I think it was a great idea to incorporate the diagrams in order to successfully explain the Vigenere square, etc. The one thing I did notice is just a small spelling error in your bottom section. The sentence reads: "It uses an asymmetric cipher, where the key for encoding the message in different than the key needed to decode the message" I'm guessing you meant 'is' different, not 'in'. But other than that, I think you did a fantastic job!!!

Mazzy29 (talk) 00:17, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Wow again! You did a great job making this article as thorough as possible. This page has most likely left the realm of stub-hood... In fact, a suggestion might be to reduce the material on this page, since there are already whole articles on the transposition and substitution ciphers. If you want, I guess you could add a bit on how else ciphers have evolved from "classical times", other than public key cryptography?

Fforeffort (talk) 04:33, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Discussion of modern cryptography
I'm removing the following paragraph because it makes little sense.
 * Since the use of classical ciphers, enciphering and encoding have come a long way. One innovative new method of enciphering is public key cryptography, which does not require an exchange of the key used to encode the message. It uses an asymmetric cipher, where the key for encoding the message is different than the key needed to decode the message. An example of this is RSA, which uses an algorithm to calculate the key.
 * Since the use of classical ciphers, enciphering and encoding have come a long way. One innovative new method of enciphering is public key cryptography, which does not require an exchange of the key used to encode the message. It uses an asymmetric cipher, where the key for encoding the message is different than the key needed to decode the message. An example of this is RSA, which uses an algorithm to calculate the key.


 * Symmetric ciphers are still in use today; they just involve different methods than in the past. One example is the block cipher, which involves bits (binary digits) and a mathematical formula to encode the text. Encryption today has become more complicated and mathematical, which, as a result, makes messages harder to decipher. Now, instead of being done by hand, most ciphers are computerized. This makes them more efficient and easier to create, but harder to crack. Ciphers have come far since Caeser shifts and Vigenère squares. As times evolve, so do ciphers.

First, an article about classical ciphers is not the place to discuss public key cryptography. Furthermore, the text is not precise. E.g., RSA still needs a key exchange it just this key exchange does no longer have to be secret. The claim that RSA uses an algorithm doesn't say much. Every cipher uses some algorithm. Equally empty are the claims modern symmetric ciphers are different than classical ciphers or that block ciphers use bits. Just because ciphers are complicated and mathematical does not imply that the are necessarily hard to decipher. 85.3.246.238 (talk) 22:31, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

Napoleon's ciphers
The sentence "Many classical ciphers were used by well-respected people, such as Julius Caesar and Napoleon, who created their own ciphers" raises more questions than it answers.

Which ciphers did Caesar create? (Would this article be improved by an explicit link to the Caesar cipher article?)

Which ciphers did Napoleon create? (Is this perhaps an allusion to the "Army of Portugal Code" and the "Great Paris Code" (based on the "Great Cipher"), both mentioned in our George Scovell article? My understanding is that Napoleon may have promoted both ciphers, in the same way that Lord Playfair promoted the Playfair cipher, but it seems unlikely to me that Napoleon created either cipher).

--DavidCary (talk) 16:25, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

New Classical Cipher
Hi,

There is a newly discovered classical cipher that you may be interested in. Please see the following link.

http://ctext.org/discuss.pl?if=en&thread=2610624

W. K. Choy (talk) 16:39, 30 September 2016 (UTC)

The classical cipher that I referred to earlier is encrypted in the Shuowen Jiezi, a Chinese etymological dictionary that was compiled c.100AD. Therefore, the encrypted ciphertext message is 1,900 years old.

This is the very tip of the iceberg. There is an amazing cipher language that western scholars are not aware of. This cipher language is classical Chinese. The sinologists David Moser said, "Here's a secret that sinologists won't tell you: A passage in classical Chinese can be understood only if you already know what the passage says in the first place." (David Moser, 'Why Chinese Is So Damn Hard', http://pinyin.info/readings/texts/moser.html )  David Moser is saying that sinologists do not understand classical Chinese!

Everyone who understands modern (vernacular) Chinese, including sinologists and over 1 billion Chinese people, is taught to read the externalised value of a Chinese character. But a Chinese character is a compound of multiple logographs, each of which means something. When all these logographs are read, you will arrive at the plaintext contained within a Chinese character. The problem is that these sub-component logographs are either not read, not read properly, or cannot be read because one or more sub-comonent logographs have been encrypted.

An entire cipher language exists. Mind boggling but true. This cipher language awaits the attention of cryptologists or cryptographers.

Please feel free to contact me for further details.

W. K. Choy (talk) 06:55, 3 October 2016 (UTC)