Talk:Claytons

Is it widely known or not?
First section, second paragraph, first sentence: The product has not been advertised on television for thirty years (at 2015), yet it remains widely known.

In popular culture section, first sentence: Though the product is largely forgotten...

Which is it? Any references to back either up? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.153.58.175 (talk) 18:53, 21 June 2016 (UTC)

Untitled
Moved from talk:Clayton's

Apostrophe
Does anyone happen to have a bottle or advertising material to confirm whether the name was Claytons or Clayton's? My memory is that there was no apostrophe, but I'm not certain enough about it to move the article. dramatic 10:01, 22 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Your memory is correct, the product name is Claytons without the apostrophe (ref: bottle label), so presumably this article's title should be amended. --Melburnian 11:38, 5 November 2005 (UTC)

Anonymous edit
Since the anon user who posted this abused me on my talk page, I shall archive it here with comments:

EDIT: Claytons has been sold in Australian supermarkets for quite some time, And is usually found in isles containing de-alcoholised wines, superlight beers & Mixers

Commentary: Before deletion I checked the following : I've just repeated this with other keywords likely to be on a claytons page - nothing. The most likely domain names for a re-launched Clayton's product are all registered to other business brands. Only reasonable conclusion: There is zero verification for a re-launch of the product (unless its marketing is even worse than 25 years ago).
 * The only search result on coles.com.au for Clayton, Claytons or Clayton's is a competition winner living in Clayton, Victoria
 * Google image search returns no beverage related images in the top 100 for either Claytons or Clayton's
 * Google.com.au produced no relevant hits in the top 100
 * anzwers.com.au produced no relevant hits in the top 100 results.

Had there been verification that Clayton's had been re-launched (and how closely related any new product was), I would have made the necessary changes: Spelling, grammar, wiki markup, position in article. dramatic 05:15, 3 November 2005 (UTC)


 * I was curious to check this myself, a google search on "Claytons Kola Tonic" shows that this product is available in Australia and Barbados--Melburnian 12:01, 5 November 2005 (UTC)


 * And an analysis of those results (given that the product has no manufacturer's website) makes it clear that it is product of Barbados and is in no way related to the Clayton's product that is the subject of the article. dramatic 09:05, 6 November 2005 (UTC)


 * I have now located the original “Claytons” (not a Claytons Claytons) on the shelf of a local Safeway supermarket in Australia. The labelling of this bottle is visually nearly identical to that of the 1980’s product (which I have) with the additions of the wording “original recipe” and the slogan “the drink you have when you’re not having a drink”. According to the label it is now distributed by Cadbury-Schweppes. The label states "Originally blended and bottled by the Clayton Brothers for the Pure Water Company, Battersea, London in the 1880's" which is similar to a statement regarding “Claytons Kola Tonic” sold in Barbados . The “1980’s” Claytons label says it was “made from African kola nuts and citrus essences”--Melburnian 05:12, 7 November 2005 (UTC)

End of moved material.

I've rewritten the article on the asis of Melburnian's evidence. dramatic 08:18, 10 November 2005 (UTC)

Different Meaning?
Hi all. I'd never heard of Claytons meaning inferior quality. Rather I thought it referred to the same thing but by a different name, usually in political doublespeak. Examples:. But (to my surprise) the majority of uses found on Google fit the "inferior" quality meaning, so I'm prepared to be convinced to remove my addition. Rocksong 05:10, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Actually thinking about it further, the two meanings are kind of opposites: 1. The original meaning in the article is "different thing, same name". 2. The meaning I'd heard of is "same thing, different name". If there's consensus that both uses are in vogue, I'll put words to that effect in the article. Rocksong 06:58, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Well no discussion for or against, so I'm going to edit Rocksong 04:40, 8 March 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't really get this: "Different word, same thing - Claytons may also refer to something essentially the same but going by a different name. So for instance before an election is officially called there is the "Claytons election campaign": the election campaign you're having when you're not having an election campaign." .... Now, to me Claytons only means an inferior copy, a non-genuine item. I have never experienced the above usage, which seems to be implying something unofficial, something that can't be officially named for what it really is even though it serves a hidden purpose. As far as I know, a "Claytons Election Campaign" would be a cheap, shoddy, ineffective one. Incidentally the punchline Jack Thompson delivers in the original ad is the denouement to a joke about a bunch of sheep shearers going to bed in a dormintory. One shearer is struck by a particular urge that he resists and strives to put off for some time, tossing and turning in bed. Eventually he caves in, and does the deed, to which a bloke at the end of the dorm exclaims "Now we can all get some sleep!" Asa01 10:34, 30 August 2006 (UTC)


 * I gave two links to examples of the use "Different word, same thing" in the paragraph above, so the use is not without precedent. I should probably put the links in the article also. If you've never heard it, perhaps it is just an older and/or local to me (South Australian) usage.
 * As for the joke, are you sure it predated the ad? My experience is that a number jokes or stories have been manufactured to fit Jack's punchline. Rocksong 00:25, 31 August 2006 (UTC)
 * Don't know if the joke was a real joke that predated the advert. My recollections come from Jack Thomnpson's response on an interview type program (during the 80s) when he was asked to explain the actual joke. He, however, substituted "taking off his socks" for the more sexual reality of the joke. The way he said it, it sounded like he was recounting a real joke, and he acted as if it was a real joke. Obviously he is only the actor and didn't concoct nor script the advert himself. I checked one of two references to the "Different word, same thing" usage however it was the headline of a news report. Not that strong a reference really (headlines are meant to be quirky and eye catching, not desperately correct and concise) but I guess one could argue either way and I wont be deleting anything. Asa01 04:02, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

I've heard it used mostly to refer to an "inferior substitute", or something represented to be something that it isn't. A "Claytons Election Campaign" actually fits this. It's where an election campaign is actually happening, even when there is officially no campaign - this fits the "represented to be something it isn't". Claytons was a "non-alcholic" tonic that was substituted for Scotch or Bourbon. It's the same as something like Diet Coke being used as a metaphore for something that is "weaker" than the original. It certainly isn't substituting the same thing with a different name!!! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.89.1.33 (talk) 06:45, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

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