Talk:Clinker (boat building)

Cotter bolts etc

 * 1) Some said clench and others said clinch. In my experience, clench is the more usual.
 * 2) Cotter bolts have nothing to do with a shipwright or boatbuilder's work. The cotter would work its way out and the whole lot would fall to bits. They were of use where everything stayed still and the same way up: not a description of a boat. There was one instance of cotter bolts being used on shipboard.  I cannot remember where I have seen the reference but I recall that the chain plates of the wooden walls were fastened with bolts secured by having a cotter driven through a slot in the inboard end, the cotter was then bent to prevent it working loose.--Boatbuff (talk) 16:33, 26 June 2008 (UTC)


 * 1) A rivet is clenched at only one end and neither end of a rivet is used with a washer as both ends of a clench bolt were. Also, a rivet is short in relation to its diameter. A clench bolt might easily be 2 feet long and ½" diameter. (RJP 22:47, 13 October 2005 (UTC))


 * 1) The dictionary definition indicates clinch is the accurate, denotative term referred to in this article. Clinch specifically means deforming the end of a rod, whereas clench means holding tightly. I don't deny that some people may have misspelled it in other pages or sources, but I encourage you to improve as you see fit.
 * 2) Pin bolts were described in this section when I corrected some grammar, and cotter bolt was used as a synonym for pin bolt on another page, so I added the alternate name. Not to defend the section, it seemed to me the author here thought it expedient to give a quick history of three different types of bolts, maybe to put clinch bolts in perspective (?), and doesn't say pin bolts are used in boat building. Nonetheless, you make some good points and I agree with your comments.
 * 3) Rivet was used as a synonym for clinch bolt on another page, so I added that phrase here. Even though a clinch bolt has similarities with a rivet, you've clarified basic distinctions. I encourage you to improve the section as you see fit. --Simian, 2005-10-14, 01:28 Z


 * Am pasting the following deleted from article page: My Random House dictionary explains that "clinker," which has several unrelated meanings, came into use in Britain in the 1700s as a variant of "clincher." This referred to the method already mentioned in the article, of holding the strakes together one way or another, such as a nail, partly driven in, then bent over. Although the article states that clinker was primarily British, with lapstrake as the preferred term in this country (USA), the term clinker-built was the preferred term for the rowboats used by life guards along the beaches of the New Jersey shore.

Maybe someone can incorporate it into the article. --Technopat (talk) 21:44, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

Terminology
There are an awful lot of terms on this page which are neither obvious to the average (i.e. non-nautical) reader, nor linked to helpful references. These include: Hog See keelson Stem - link added in main article Boatman (talk) 14:51, 9 March 2010 (UTC) Apron Deadwoods Garboard Lands See the introductory paragraph of the article. Thwart risings Thwart - link added in main article Boatman (talk) 14:51, 9 March 2010 (UTC) </li> <li>Stringer</li> <li>Breast hook</li> <li>Quarter knee</li> <li>Rubbing strake</li> <li>Sheer strake</li> <li>Crutch plate</li> <li>Painter ring</li> <li>Stretcher</li> <li>Stem band</li> <li>Horse</li> <li>Shroud plate</li> <li>Step</li> <li>Toe strap</li></ul>

I'd go through and add a bunch of links (and may do some of them, in fact), but a lot of these are terms which are ambiguous (horse, apron, stem, hog, step especially) and require more research than I have time for at this time. However, since this is a significant form of boatbuilding, it seems that it really should be cleaned up by someone knowledgeable in the field.

Septegram 14:58, 8 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I was right. I tried to add a bunch of links, particularly to the non-ambiguous terms, but to little avail.  My nautical knowledge is extremely limited, and this article is virtually meaningless to me, filled as it is with technical terms without elaboration.  To someone with my level of knowledge of boatbuilding or less, this article will simply be an exercise in frustration.
 * Septegram 15:11, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the great page! Only one suggestion. Would it be possible to add picture of the tools mentioned? (Or links to pages with descriptions & pictures?) I come from Genoa (Italy) where there was a long tradition of boat building, now almost complitely lost! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.16.53.66 (talk) 05:19, 15 July 2008 (UTC)

This looks interesting: McCarthy 2005
Interestingly, it is the only book in the entire US LOC cat that is catalogued with subject=Fasteners--History.

I haven't read it, but decided to point it out here.

— ¾-10 19:55, 9 November 2008 (UTC)

Illustration
Here I have a illustration on commons who describe a Midship section, parts with numbers. Its can help to explane how a wooden boat or ship are build-up from structure. Boatbuilder. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.230.211.136 (talk) 21:54, 28 December 2008 (UTC)

Waterproofing
As someone completely ignorant of boat-building, I came to this article to find out what keeps the water out. Everyone knows that water under pressure will stream through the tiniest crack. So what stops a clinker-built boat from sinking within minutes? I presume the answer is mainly 'caulking', so why is there only one passing mention of caulking in the article?86.181.84.206 (talk) 14:07, 9 March 2010 (UTC)

A In a wooden boat, apart perhaps from the garboard (the strake alongside the keel) you don't caulk clinker planking. The lands (overlaps between adjoning strakes) must be made carefully at the correct angle, which varies constantly anlong its length. The rivets hold the strakes together and the lands should seal themselves when the boat becomes wet in use. If the building job has not been done well enough for this to happen, you are in trouble. In case someone does not know what a strake is; a plank is not quite the same thing as a strake but gives the general idea. Caulking an iron vessel is done quite differently from the method in a wooden one and I suspect that this was done, though I have no direct experience of it. (RJPe (talk) 21:36, 7 October 2010 (UTC))

Incorrect or uncited allegation
The article says "Clinker is the British term, which is also used in Canada and most other countries of the world except the USA, where the method is known as lapstrake." Having grown up around boat builders in the USA and learning about Viking ships in school, I've only ever heard it called clinker-built, never lapstrake. Both Webster's and American Heritage define the term primarily under clinker-built; lapstrake in both cases says something along the lines of "see clinker-built". I'm inclined to believe that the article's assertion that it's known as lapstrake rather than clinker-built in the US isn't just uncited but is (at least most commonly) wrong. SumnerH (talk) 07:42, 10 June 2012 (UTC)

Searching google n-grams in the American English corpus also confirms that clinker is at least as common as lapstrake. Updating the page accordingly since there have been no objections. SumnerH (talk) 22:00, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

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