Talk:Clone trooper/Archive 1

article
um, I don't know if anybody noticed but this article needs to be fixed. e.g. clone commandos redirect to clone troopers even though they have their own article. RC-0722 17:28, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Number of Clones
What is the source for the claim that *1* clone was produced *per millenia*? Nothing appears to support this in the films or in the novelizations of the films.

Look---either there's a source for the claim or it's fan fiction. Which is it?

EpII refers to a number of "units" being ready, does it not? How do we know that units = battalions?


 * The Kaminoans meant M,ilitary units, not individual clones, when they said units.

Energy shields and superhuman strength?
Do Clone Troopers have energy shields and superhuman strength?--Ed Telerionus 14:24, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Uh...no. --Kross 14:52, Apr 24, 2005 (UTC)


 * Are the Clone Troopers much more powerful than their Stormtrooper successors?--Ed Telerionus 02:20, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Possibly, after all they are clones trained and bred like skilled fighters, while stormtroopers are clones of diffrent human recruits. -- Riffsyphon1024 05:39, Apr 30, 2005 (UTC)


 * Then are there some types of Specialized Stormtroopers that are much more powerful than their Clone Trooper predecessors? -- Ed Telerionus 29 June 2005 21:39 (UTC)


 * In Republic Commando, the clone commandos have energy shields and are pretty damn strong. But that might just be a gameplay element.-LtNOWIS 02:23, 7 May 2005 (UTC)


 * Well, the clone commandos are given a different class of armor, called Katarn class, and they are specially trained to be stronger, faster and more creative then their brothers.

-- If the films are any evidence, Storm Troopers are just mass produced soldiers with less of an emphasis on quality (The storm troopers couldn't shoot R2 or C-3PO as they crossed through the middle of a firefight). --12.180.165.2 18:56, 7 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, there are mountains of evidence in games, novels, and the movies that Storm Troopers are NOT clones and that they are standard recruits, as recruits are cheaper and it is easier and faster to raise an army. As for superhuman abilities the clones have soem senses like sight genetically altered, they also have higher metabolisms to process higher ammounts of drugs and such when they are injured. They also heal faster than normal humans.

i saw on wookiepedia the star wars wiki that they did do that and commander cody would have SACRIFICED a WHOLE storm trooper platoon just for one of his own.and in star wars battlefront 2 the kaminoans rebeled against the empire so i guessed they stopped using clones as a result of this--Pokemon30 (talk) 21:50, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Clone trooper suits
"not a single clone trooper suit was ever built for either film." Is this true, there were occasions where their faces were shown, surely they must have created a real suit for the actor? pomegranate 01:05, May 25, 2005 (UTC)


 * Not necessarily. They digitally add the actor's head onto a computer-generated body. When you see clone faces, the clones don't move too much, so it wouldn't have been too hard.

the only one was for ccommander cody played by the same guy who played jango fett - User:Halo 31887

they probably did digital images for certain scenes that look like real images so thats why they did the head thing that your talking about so they didnt throw away money for suits like they did in the originals for the stormtroopers.--Pokemon30 (talk) 21:50, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Topics to Merge
I'm confident that the useful segments of Clone commando could be merged into this article. --SparqMan 06:51, 31 July 2005 (UTC) That jango fett guy is tamuerra morrison and he played the voices for clones and jango —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mckillen46 (talk • contribs) 18:50, 26 December 2007 (UTC)

Merge status
What is the status of the merge with Imperial stormtrooper? – Mipadi 01:24, 28 November 2005 (UTC)


 * I seriously doubt that Stormtroopers are clones (except for a few that survived from the days of the Clone Wars and are still young enough to be on active duty), as the troopers in the original trilogy were all different heights, and spoke with different voiced. The clones all sounded identical to Jango Fett.  Also there was a need to create the original clone army in secret, a need that no longer applies once the Empire is established.  Cloning is good for the former situaition, but also expensive.


 * Also, if all the Original Trilogy stormtroopers are all clones of various heroes of the Empire, why are htey all such awful shots? It seems to me that the more plausable explanation that they are simply conscripts, with inferior equipment and training to their clone predecessors, relying on sheer weight of numbers to make up for lack of skill.  I think the storm trooper and the clone trooper articles should be kept seperate.


 * Stormtroopers in reality are crack shoots and rarely missed there targets but in the movies they suck cause imagine if Luke got killed on the Death Star? Its stereotypical "bad guys can't shoot to save their own lives" AKA Stormtrooper School of Shooting. Plus these movies were made in the 70's and 80's
 * Stormtroopers are a mix of clones and recruits
 * But yeah the articles should not merge Lord Wolfwood 02:34, 5 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I feel these articles should remain separate. It is accepted as canon that the Empire's stormtroopers are indeed the direct "descendents" of the Old Republic's clone troopers—meaning they serve essentially the same function and mostly originate from cloned sources.  Nevertheless, these still merit separate articles because they are really two distinct types of soldiers, from different fictional eras.  There are too many differences to justify a merge. IMHO, of course. Datameister 06:02, 5 December 2005 (UTC)


 * The clones under the 501st are the only clones from the Old Republic to survive till at least the battle of Hoth. Also Luke Skywalker and Wedge Antilles did find a lone clonetrooper in one of Dark Horses comics which one I don't remember. And he never got word of Order 66 so he instantly recognized Luke as a Jedi General. Lord Wolfwood 14:50, 5 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Clone Troopers and Storm Troopers are one in the same.
 * Clone Troopers are Pre- Empire and Stromtoopers are Empire.
 * Clone Troopers are Clones and Storm Troopers are (with the exception of during early transition) mostly recriuted Non-Clones.
 * Clone Troopers became Storm Troopers!
 * Therefore these articles should indeed be merged. StephenHecht 18:01, 10 December 2005 (EST)


 * Since the consensus seems to be to not merge (a decision with which I agree), I am going to remove the merge notices. – Mipadi 00:22, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

In the book Dark Lord: the Rise of Darth Vader there is reference made to the necessity of recuiting soldiers to replace the clones who were ageing at an accelerated rate. Perhaps as a result of their rapid production through growth enhancers or specific genetic engineering. From the Emperor's point of view they were a disposable force, they served their purpose. Though these guys were so brainwashed they could probably be ordered to shoot themselves.

Clone Commanders
The section on Ranks mentions that the Clone Commanders were created to have more individuality and individual thought than normal troopers. But I was under the impression that apart from the ARCs, the Commanders were taken from the ranks of the normal troopers after their tendencies for beneficial individuality were spotted. In many cases, the Kaminoans simply removed any clones who were different. Is this sentence refering to the ARCs or the commanders that Alpha trained? it seems at least slightly off, but I'm not sure if and how it should be changed.

At first the Kaminoans practiced a ruthless quality control on the clone batches, but then Jango Fett stepped in and put a stop to that (at the urging of Kal Skirata) because the clones were in effect Mandalorians and no one was gonna just flush a Mandalorian away.

Also, the Clone Commander section shares this assumption that they were created differently. I was lead to beleive from my sources and Karen Traviss' work that they weren't, but simply trained diffrently, like the Republic Commandos.

There is actually little hard evidence as to where the commanders come from, though things do lean more towards the explanation that the commanders are simply given different training - at least at first, it would follow and make sense that as the war progressed, the cream rose to the top.

Also as a note- in the Background section, third paragraph, it seems to be infering to the old misconseption that clones are bred without most emotions or are geneticaly programed, even though it says higher up in the paragraph that they were merely genetically altered for certain traits, not hardwired to obey orders. Even the low ranking troopers have a full range of emotion, as demonstrated by trooper Corr in Triple Zero. And also, aren't there mentions of CTs disobeying Order 66? I'm not sure if they are confirmed. Also, weren't the Republic Commandos simply taken from the normal stock at birth and moved to Commando training? I'm sorry for my rambling, I'm very passionate about this subject.

Anyone?

--Kandosii 02:23, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, some commandos did disobey the order, this was covered in Darth Vader - Rise of a Dark Lord.


 * I don't really have an opinion on this particular change, but one thing to keep in mind as you make changes is the fact that there are various levels of Star Wars canon. Statements made in books do not have the same weight as the movies, and if there is even the appearance of a disagreement, the movies win. For example, the clones in the movies are extremely unemotional. They give and receive orders without emotion, they commit murder without emotion, and they die without emotion. Since the book you cite may seem to contradict that notion, you might have problems with that, because the movies win. Kafziel 13:58, 21 March 2006 (UTC)

Incorrect, though this was the case once, it isn't anymore. Nowadays ANYTHING you create officially for the Star Wars Universe has to be vetted through Lucasfilm, and if it passes, it's as true as anything else.

- The first guy is right. just because they show no emotion in battle doesn't mean they aren't capable of it. They don't show emotion in the feild because it gets inthe way,above all they are trained to do their job to the best of thier abilities.

Where did anyone get the idea that they show no emotion in battle? Go back to Episode III when the 501st Troopers were fighting Zett Jukasa outside the temple. You can hear the troopers exclaiming emotionally on a number of occasions.

-The first guy IS right. The book he refers to was, like nearly all published Star Wars books, looked over by LucasFilm represenatives (Note the plural word) and is, when published, an official part of the universe. To date, I beleive there has only been one discrepency with book-movie/book-book accuracy, which was incredibly minor.

Clone Trooper Survival
-I think several dozen clones, survived after the clone wars. Some maybe even went against the empire, because they felt that the republic had been penetrated by the separtists, in order to gain control over them. I believe some may have teamed up together to form a resistance, and maybe a few served in the rebel alliance. On the rebellion of Kamino battle, it explains that several rogue Kaminoan clone masters created a second clone army to fight against the galactic empire, which showed that none of the rogue clone masters and their clone Anti-imperial troopers survived and all died and not one of them survived. Now, I don't believe that. I think a few clones, did survive, and some perhaps escaped Kamino, and started a new life, elsewhere on a distant planet. A few Kaminoans may have in fact, escaped along with their clones. Some clone troopers in the empire maybe have turned and joined a certain rebellion against the empire, or may have just quit being a republic solider and they just ran away and did their own thing for the next 20 years. By any case, I believe some clone troopers are indeed alive, and some though old, still must be trying to fight the empire, teaching a few others, how to do the job. Somewhere along the line, a few clone troopers would have eventually gain a certain indepedence for themselves, enableing them to turn against the empire, and think for themselves to what they feel is truely right. I know the clone commandos were the ones, high suceessful in thinking independenly for themselves, which is why they didn't kill their jedi commanders. I believe the Jango Fett clones, were discovered a certain someone, and that someone, used different cloneing technology, to clone more Fett clones, in order to fight against the empire. I know the Fett clones are alive and that even though lots of them are serving the evil Galactic empire, under the rule of Emperor Palpatine ( whom I would love to take him out and put him down for good, had I been in the Star wars series ), I would have used the Fett clones, to fight against the empire in order to make sure that the empire was destoryed, and the new democratic system: the New Republic, started off again. Somewhere in the galaxy, a few Fett clones are indeed alive, and I believe they still know, how to get their jobs, right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!--Natldsbluedelta353 05:47, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Uhhh... thanks for the fan fiction. --12.180.165.2 15:30, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Ok let me start here, first of all not several dozen but a few survived and by that I mean not obey order 66, and yes they did against the Empire. A hundred or so ARC troopers defended several jedi against several thousand Imperial storm troopers and not suprisingly they managed to fend off against the storm troopers until the storm troopers were merely 200+Jdkoqdnwi (talk) 15:27, 3 March 2015 (UTC)Jdkoqdnwi

Clone Trooper Population
- I believe the Kaminoans created for the 3 million clones before, during, and after the clone wars. Forget that, " 200,000 units ready with a million more well under the way, " stuff that Lama Su told and explained to Obi-wan Kenobi. Man, I don't believe in what Lama Su said about how many clones they had made over the last 10 years. With that kind of cloning technolgy that the Kaminoans had and created, I bet those Kaminoan clone masters could have clone several billion clones, by the end of 10 years. However, I am aware that the Kaminoans had to deveolp the right and accurate physical training, mental personality, and pyshci for the clones to be fully prepared to fight for the Galactic Republic. Still, by all the Kaminoan hatcheries info I've seen and read in the movies and archives, and with several other Kaminoan cities across the Kaminoan water planet, I still think if all the cloning facilites on Kamino, had all worked together and begun cloning, training, and preparing more Jango Fett clones for the Republic, by the end of 10 years, the Republic would have surely had a clone army, that could match the Separtists droid army, which numbered in quadtrillons. I'm also aware that the Kaminoans terminated all the Fett clones, that didn't agree or followed the procedures, orders, or standards that the Kaminoans employed upon them. If I were there, I would take care of these disobedient clones and make them my own personal unit. I would show the Kaminoans new ways on how we treat and train the clones, so that the clone troopers would be better than they already are. The clones of Fett clones, numbered in millions or perhaps billions. After the clone wars, the Kaminoans were opressed, due to Palpatine's " racial bias " against non-human beings. This forced the Kaminoans to bred a new clone army of Fett clones, an army that would take arms against their clone brethern serving in the empire. However, these new Fett clones, would lose, when Boba Fett led the imperial stormtroopers of Fett clones in a grand scale attack on Tipoca City, eliminating the rogue clones ( which to me, I disagree that all the rogue clones all died off, and that some still remained alive or either escaped or died ). If I was there, I would convince the Kaminoans to ship a few million clones to several distant planets, so that other organizations, such as the " alliance to restore the republic, " or just the rebel alliance, could use the newly formed Fett clone(s) army, to fight against the empire also. With rogue Fett clones created to fight against the empire, and scattered across the galaxy, it would be difficult for the empire to track down and eliminate " all " of the new Fett clones. I would also tell the Kaminoans, to evacuate their homeworld, and take their cloneing technology, and flee to a distant, uncharted planet, whom the empire will never find, so that way, they would be able to clone more Fett clones, that would be able to fight against the empire for the next 20 years ( that is if genetic clone DNA material of Jango Fett, doesn't degrade or fail in the next 20 years, happens ). Basically, I think their were billions of Fett clones during the Clone wars, and still, a few of them, are still alive and well. Its sad the Kaminoans didn't create more Fett clones, to fight against the help. The newly formed clone army would have really helped the rebel alliance a lot, instead of using real good people, who would die from the empire's imperial stormtroopers, whom most of them, were also made up of millions or billions of clones themselves.--Natldsbluedelta353 05:45, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

- You are rigth to believe that there are alot of clones the statement "200,000 units ready with a million more well under way" The kaminoan meant militray units (battallions, regiments or whatever), not individual clones themselves, so you are rigth to believe that there are more than 3 million clones. I would think there are several hundred Million clones, if not a few billion. Though since they are far superior to droids (training, physical cunning and equipment)They are more than a match for the droid armies in the quadrillions.

well if you think about it boba fett is clone aswell so there are still clones around —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.221.159.211 (talk) 13:14, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

Sadistic
Why is this article in the category of fictional sadists? The clone troopers don't seem to sadistic to me. User:SuperCooper

Disregard Battlefront II story elements.
All elements from the Battlefront II videogame shoudl be disregarded as the battlefront II story IS a WHAT IF (alternate reality) story. Examples include: 1.Saying that Stormtroopers are Clones. there are mountains of proof in novels, movies, and videogames that suggest, or just flat out say that StormTroopers are nothing more than mere recruits, as recruits are cheaper and faster.This also fits with the Quantity>Quality policy of the Empire.

2.Implying that the Jango Fett template was phased out steadily after the clone wars, the empire would have no time to do this, and the Empire didn't recover reliable Cloning technology until after the Battle of Yavin.

3.Using the 501st way to much, to the point where, realistically, they would have been wiped out simply from being deployed in batlle so much.

More evidence to dicredit the story line of Battlefront II is that NO clonetrooper would live to see the end of the Galactic Civil War (or at least fight in it.), as they age twice as fast as humans do. The Narator of the Story is a clone and he narrates from the Battle of Geonosis up until the point where the rebellion is defeated.

- Answer to #3: It is thought that the Kaminoans continued to replenish the supplies with more Clones, and more than likely put them with the different legions/regimates/etc. And is it really that unlikely that at least SOME of the Clones would have supplied all those battles?

Answer to #2: The game really doesn't say that...

Answer to #1: Actually, it's a mix of both, with 'TONS OF EVIDENCE' from the books and movies. Evidence? There were bound to be many Clone Troopers left after the war, so why would the Empire waste them? Also, we all have seen the evidence that there were recruits as well. There's evidence in the books, and some in Empisode III, but I'm not going to waste my time.

This is actually true because when emperor palpatine established the Galactic Empire- wich was right after order 66. More proof on that is they had so many clones to throw around they were able to burn the jedi temple down and destroy any and all remeaning separatist leaders that still had operational droid armies. There were so may extra clones that thay just mixed them in with the storm trooper corps.Jdkoqdnwi (talk) 15:33, 3 March 2015 (UTC)

Heavy Troopers
Is there a separate divion of heavy troopers (like in SW Battlefront 2) because if there is I see no mention of them here. - Doc711

no ther eisn't battlefront two is not canon--Manwithbrisk 18:30, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

-There's really no mention of a seperate 'division' of heavy troopers in Battlefront II anyway.

Omega Squad???
Omega squad Redirected Here, despite the words Omega Sqaud not even being mentioned in this article, the only connection to Omega squad that i can find is Atin, I don't know how to fix this so if someone else could do it i would be grateful, also does anyone know if Omega Squad has it own article? if not i would be happy to contribute toward it - Derob ecnirp (talk) 20:26, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Commander Neyo.jpg
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BetacommandBot (talk) 20:13, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Armor Color
If i remember correctly i belive that using color to signify rank was phased put when the Mark 2 armor was created inbetween Episode 2 and 3.Scoutshook (talk) 22:22, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

too in-universe
This article is way way too in-universe and needs to be cleaned up. --Allemandtando (talk) 13:30, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

agree
"Ko Sai, had desergeants, named Kal Skirata, stepped in and took the six child Nulls" -- wha? Feldercarb (talk) 20:46, 17 June 2012 (UTC)

Human or Animal
Why are they considered animals? |Star Wars says that they are humans, and they look like humans, so why are they considered aminals here? 75.27.36.231 (talk) 22:02, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Redundant to Mandalorian
Since the Clone Troopers of "Attack of the Clones" are all Clones of one Mandalorian and share the Mandalorian culture, as well, these two articles should be merged. This would help both articles, since Mandalorian lacks real world referencing about the history and this article is poorly filled with information. --Trac3R (talk) 16:14, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Add better images
An image from the movie Attack of the clones is needed to show it's significance on the story. And a pic of Jango Fett too, to explain he's the original host.-Taeyebaar (talk) 12:48, 15 July 2013 (UTC)