Talk:Colt McCoy

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Archive 1

Chruch name
The name of the church McCoy attends had been rendered in title case. However, changed it, citing what is tantamount to doctrine as the reason. I think we should use title case (i.e. "Church of Christ", "University Avenue Church of Christ") for two reasons. First, this is Wikipedia and usage should be based on the common form regardless of church doctrine. Second, this website renders it in title case. I was curious as to how the source rendered it, but the link is dead. I'm reverting the change. →Wordbuilder (talk) 18:55, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

no. 1 game injury
in the game for no. 1 with Bama, the injury to McCoy is a key info ab mccoy needed to be followed in this wiki article... here's to full speedy recovery to finest, athlete and person McCoy - Bama fan willyg 69.121.221.97 (talk) 17:21, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Personal life
Hi, due to the youth of this sports person, it is acceptable for their personal life section to only cover the period before they began their career. However, as they grow older it becomes more important for information on their life outside sport to appear in the article. Please ensure that as the person develops their article does too. For an example of how such a section might look, see Brian Urlacher and for pointers on how to expand and improve such a section, see this guide. Thanks--Jackyd101 (talk) 10:26, 30 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Good idea, thanks! Johntex\talk 00:31, 30 July 2009 (UTC)

I removed a portion of this section dealing with an irrelevant medical condition of one of McCoy's relatives. 74.110.135.89 (talk) 03:23, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

McCoy Sits Out BCS Title Game
Unfortunately Colt McCoy was unable to play in the national championship game because of a stinger in his right shoulder that is believed to probably be nerve damage that didn't show up in the x- rays. Although many believe that The University of Texas would have won the game against Alabama, it is said he was not allowed to go back into the game because his father and trainers did not agree with his willingness to finish the game. In the postgame interview you can truly see his pure regret as he put everything to get his team to that game. Although no one will ever know what would have happened with Colt in the game, "what if's" will haunt the win of the crimison tide forever along with longhorn fans. Calviny (talk) 18:31, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Ala beat Texas in the 64/65 orange bowl with Joe Namath in the replay driving 1 to 2 yards over the goal line into the end zone, but the ref said he didnt score, though the replays proved he did score (no instant replays and reviews were done then as done today). So Tx won that Orange bowl, even though clearly to all, it didn't and with that win, Tx became no. l, even though they clearly were not - so these haunts you refer to are Tx BS esp as it is clear, Ala defense would have beat Tx & McCoy if not this play, then another and the Ala overall team speed is / was esp much greater than Tx. farook omar 69.121.221.97 (talk) 18:49, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

McCoy's height
Why are we going with the B.S. height that his college lists him at, instead of his actual height? Colleges routinely exaggerate the physical properties of their players, height, playing weight, et cetera. Are we waiting for the NFL Combine weigh-in process to get his official height, 6'1? http://www.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/9d8c4d4269.png —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.131.26.130 (talk) 18:43, 18 February 2010 (UTC)
 * That picture shows nothing. Okay, so Bradford is taller. We don't know how much taller, and both are presumably wearing shoes. Not only does his Texas bio say he is 6'3", but his ESPN bio says the same.  Eagles   24/7  (C)  20:40, 18 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Good thing you know what you're talking about. It's not as if Colleges, as I stated, routinely fudge the numbers with players weights and heights. Oh wait, they do. And guess what? Colt McCoy was just officially measured at the NFL Combine at 6-1 and 1/8. Not to mention that picture absolutely does show something, given that a football is a standard size (with minor variations) you can use it to determine scale. Not to mentino using the good old fashioned eye test and common sense. And I was right. Source: http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/longhorns/entries/2010/02/26/heights_and_wei.html

So now we have his height listed as 5’9 in the intro table and 6’1 in the combine table. Which one is correct? Klod (talk) 21:44, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

Number as a Pro
We've had at least three different numbers for McCoy as a Brown, but none of them have a reliable source attached. I would suggest holding off until we get a proper course. Dayewalker (talk) 03:23, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

Degree and College Major?
Mr. McCoy attended the esteemed University of Texas for five years. Nowhere does this article mention his degree or major. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.106.168.45 (talk) 02:30, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

Colt's family
Brad was from Merkle, TX (near Abilene). That's where his parents & grandparents were located during Brad's youth. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.55.110.88 (talk) 18:24, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

Explanation for changing text about McCoy's "wins" record
Though frequently used, "wins" is not an official stat for a QB (or any football player), as there's no set definition. This is usually not a problem, since barring injury, a winning team's starting QB will either play the full game or run up such a lead that credit for the game clearly to him, rather than his backup.

However, given the stat's vague but still narrow definition, it is indisputably the case that McCoy does NOT have the most wins in college D-I history (despite frequent media dissertations to this effect when he finished his college career). That's not to say that we can say with certainty who does have that record. The one thing we can say with relative certainty is that he has the most wins of any quarterback who spent all four seasons playing at the FBS (or Division I-A) level.

To clarify, D-I football encompasses both Division I-A (now called FBS) and Division I-AA (now called FCS). FCS schedules sometimes include more games than FBS programs. When Chad Pennington started his first year at Marshall in 1995, they were an I-AA program (12-3). He was redshirted the next year, and by his redshirt sophomore year, Marshall had transitioned to I-A, and in his final three years as the starting quarterback, he went 10-3, 12-1, and 13-0, totaling 47 wins.

I don't possess a list of QB wins in FCS/I-AA or transition, and frankly, I doubt anyone has put that together. I'm a Senior Researcher at ESPN The Magazine and we put together the list of FBS/I-A wins, and we indeed had McCoy at the top. I do not mean to imply Pennington clearly has the all time D-I QB wins record; he's just a player I was familiar with and was able to tally, and I realized he'd top McCoy if you include his D-IAA freshman year. It's absolutely possible that another QB has a better D-I record, especially if he played at a knockout I-AA program years ago.

Do I need to prove my identity to cite the above? If so, can I do it in a non-public way?

192.234.2.90 (talk) 19:53, 24 May 2011 (UTC)KC

Article length
This article is very lengthy, would probably be good to cut somethings out or split this article IMO--Levineps (talk) 08:42, 4 December 2011 (UTC)


 * That is the same exact thing I was thinking. This article is to long, some sentences are being repeated. It is just a very long article for someone who really hasn't accomplished that much. I would suggest trimming some of the fat off this thing.Zdawg1029 (talk) 21:06, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

winningest

 * As per WP:FORMAL we should use formal terms suitable for an encyclopedia apart from direct quotes. winningest is an informal term, and as such does not have the tone required for wikipedia.
 * also
 * As per MOS:COMMONALITY we should try to use forms of English that are universally understood by all speakers of English. winningest is an American English term, that is not common (or correct) in other forms of English. Of course, we must never change from US to UK (or vice versa) as that would fall foul of MOS:RETAIN and American English will always have priority over all other forms in this article, however victorious is not an exclusive word for one variety of English, it is a universal term and as such is preferred to any term exclusive to one variant of English. Spacecowboy420 (talk) 10:54, 12 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20081025141937/http://www.dallasnews.com:80/sharedcontent/dws/spt/colleges/texas/stories/122406dnspocoltmccoy.2476d0b.html to http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/colleges/texas/stories/122406dnspocoltmccoy.2476d0b.html
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Free agent
Was he a free agent for his entire career? Is he going to be? Paradoctor (talk) 17:44, 24 October 2023 (UTC)


 * take a look at any of nfl player who is not currently on a roster and tell me what it says Bears247 (talk) 19:34, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Please consider that I, like someone from the general WP:AUDIENCE, have no idea what you mean by that. Paradoctor (talk) 19:37, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * all other free agent nfl players do not use “currently” in the lead, or a link that you’ve been including Bears247 (talk) 19:57, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * WP:WHATABOUT. That a mistake is widespread doesn't mean it's ok. MOS:DATED is clear: Terms likely to go out of date need a timeframe attached. Being a free agent is an inherently temporary state, and requires at a minimum an as of, or equivalent. Paradoctor (talk) 20:20, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * please refer to the message on my talk page I just @ you in Bears247 (talk) 20:28, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * is cordially in invited to provide policy-based arguments in favor of his position. I don't think he can, but hey, I'm listening. I'm also inviting contributions from MOS:DATED watchers. Paradoctor (talk) 20:52, 24 October 2023 (UTC)
 * The lede is fine and doesn't need anything added. The lede is currently set to what has been the long standing standard when a player is a free agent. Typically after a year of no workouts (if you're not familiar with what that means in NFL terms basically a tryout) the lede gets updated to reflect them being a former player. If the standard is going to changed, the proper place to have this discussion is WT:NFL.-- Rockchalk 717 02:06, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
 * The lead violates the guideline MOS:DATED. Per WP:LOCALCONSENSUS: Consensus among a limited group of editors, at one place and time, cannot override community consensus on a wider scale. For instance, unless they can convince the broader community that such action is right, participants in a WikiProject cannot decide that some generally accepted policy or guideline does not apply to articles within its scope.
 * More to the point, I couldn't find any discussion of this issue in the project's archives relevant to MOS:DATED, with one exception.
 * , which found unanimous support: This is a simple enough change that will help eliminate the endless "former or free agent" debates and future-proof these infoboxes. (my emphasis) Paradoctor (talk) 02:22, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
 * P.S.: Notified the Wikiproject NFL of this discussion. Paradoctor (talk) 02:31, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
 * It's not even remotely close to a DATED violation, especially since these articles are updated as soon as something changes and you have been provided what the practice is. By that same logic, a team listed violates DATED for players whose contract is about to expire or players on the trading block. Just because there's never been a direct discussion doesn't mean it isn't a standard. A change to the infobox with free agent isn't the same as changing the lede. If we try to apply the same thing to the lede using DATED then that doesn't solve the issue that you're claiming violates DATED because unknown players will go years without being touched still when their career is clearly over. Dated says "Except on pages that are inherently time-sensitive and updated regularly (e.g. the "Current events" portal), terms such as now, today, currently, present, to date, so far, soon, upcoming, ongoing, and recently". None of those are used when a player is a free agent. When a transaction occurs, the paged is updated within minutes. An example, Mecole Hardman was traded last week. The news broke at 12:26 pacific/Arizona time. The page was first updated 14 minutes later, while this update was reverted because it was done before it was officially announced, the point remains. When the trade was officially announced at 4:30 pm, I personally updated it 4:59 pm. Player pages are not subject to DATED because they are updated as news breaks. Same goes when a player retires, is cut, or when they are signed by a new team. Players whose pages are untouched are ones who never sign with anybody who eventually have the page updated to say former player.-- Rockchalk 717 02:59, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Maybe I'm way off base here, if so, I apologize in advance. This going back and forth with myself, Yankees10 and Bears247 is uncalled for. We reached out to Bears247, he eventually responded and we seemed to be getting somewhere. Then no more correspondence and a weekly .. and sneaky may I add, a change to free agency appeared on pages. I can wait in the bushes until the end of time and continue to revert what's done, I live for this. But it's not professional. Someone will say the wrong thing one day and someone will be offended. Honestly, I'm trying to save my own *** here. Being diplomatic only goes so far. Am I alone in this bucket of nonsense? Bringingthewood (talk) 21:15, 25 October 2023 (UTC)
 * @Paradoctor: From this edit, it appears that your preference is for "is currently a free agent" vs. "is a free agent"? However, is implies present tense already, making currently redundant.—Bagumba (talk) 02:32, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
 * That's the reason I remove 'currently' whenever I see it. It's also by many coordinators/assistant coaches etc. I'm sticking with free agent only, not to ruffle more feathers. Bringingthewood (talk) 06:49, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
 * your preference Is not important. All I want is to bring the article in line with MOS:DATED. Personally, I'd remove this guaranteed-to-become dated minor detail from the lead and mention it in the career section, if at all. But that's me. As long as MOS:DATED is satisfied, I'm satisfied. Paradoctor (talk) 19:59, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Arriving from WT:MOSNUM with no knowledge of our NFL articles, can I suggest:
 * @Paradoctor's right that it's good practice to date "is" statements that might become outdated, per MOS:DATED
 * @Rockchalk717's right that there's an exception for articles that are updated regularly, and I'd read that as including suites of articles such as those on NFL players if we can indeed have confidence that status changes are regularly and quickly incorporated into those articles
 * MOS:DATED offers an alternative approach which here might produce became a free agent in August 2023 (is that the right date? I may have misunderstood). That'll remain true for ever, and it's more informative too. Could something like that work? NebY (talk) 20:35, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Adding anything extra is flat unnecessary because they are updated quickly. A player is technically still a free agent if they are actively seeking another team so until they sign with another team saying they are a free agent is still an accurate statement without any identifier being necessary. We just have the "year without a workout" rule to set a timeframe to reflect the player being a former player.-- Rockchalk 717 21:43, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Adding anything extra is flat unnecessary because they are updated quickly.
 * That is flat out wrong. I already pointed it out above, you seem to have missed it:
 * WP:LOCALCONSENSUS: Consensus among a limited group of editors, at one place and time, cannot override community consensus on a wider scale. For instance, unless they can convince the broader community that such action is right, participants in a WikiProject cannot decide that some generally accepted policy or guideline does not apply to articles within its scope. (my emphasis)
 * MOS:DATED makes no exception for articles that are "updated quickly". So, if you want that exception start a discussion at MOS with the goal of changing the guideline. Until and unless that happens, stating "is a free agent" unqualifiedly is in violation of the guideline. Paradoctor (talk) 19:43, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * It's been a few days since you notified the MOS talk page, but there has yet to be consensus for your interpretation. —Bagumba (talk) 22:55, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * There is no interpretation involved. The guideline says Terms likely to go out of date, which "is a free agent" is. It is actually guaranteed to go out of date, because players outlive their careers. It's like stating "is waxing" in the lead of Moon. Paradoctor (talk) 23:54, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * I believe it is a community standard to have lead sentences of living people being written in the present tense, with the expectation that they will receive timely updates. For example, Rishi Sunak's lead sentence reads ...is a British politician who has served as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom... and not is a British politician who has served as became the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom...—Bagumba (talk) 22:54, 26 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks both of you. Small point: that Rishi Sunak article does say has served as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom and Leader of the Conservative Party since 2022 and I think that date's useful, allowing the reader to see how long - or how briefly - he has been PM. Likewise our readers won't necessarily know that a player described on WP as a free agent must have only gone a year without a workout, otherwise we'd call them a former player, so without digging deeper into the article, they've no way to know how long he's been a free agent. Still, I've made my suggestion, you've considered it, and I'll happily back away! NebY (talk) 10:43, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Re: Sunak and most other bios, if we're going to be strict about DATED, the "has served" risks being dated once he's no longer PM, because it's in the present tense, regardless of whether a date is mentioned or not. Barring a community consensus discouraging present tense in all BLP lead sentences, I think "is a free agent" is consistent with other non-NFL bios re: present tense, and is fine. —Bagumba (talk) 11:52, 27 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Oh yes, "has served"/"has been" is often a sign the statement's outdated. But it's fine there and this article's fine. NebY (talk) 12:05, 27 October 2023 (UTC)