Talk:Conjugated linoleic acid/Archive 1

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(No title)
recent research have shown cla to be linked with several negative effects: oxidative stress, inflammation and most severe a reduced sensitivity to insulin (similar to diabetes). I am not very good at editing these pages, so i will just throw the info at the top together with the references, and let someone with more skills edit it into the text at a later time. dan.,  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.217.248.45 (talk) 07:00, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

I added a some to However, experts do not recommend taking CLA supplements. CLA supplements contain high levels of the t10,c12 CLA isomer, which has been linked to multiple side effects.

Because it is ridiculous to say that every expert recommends against taking it. Especially when it just a received approval from the FDA to be added to foods and companies can claim health benefits on the label of whatever its added to. To many wanna be scientists editing these things just because they read one study. Stick to flipping burgers morons and leave the science to the experts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.62.15.201 (talk) 01:43, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

CLAs can be either cis- or trans-fats and the double bonds of CLAs are conjugated and separated by a single bond between them

Conjugated linoleic acid is both a trans fatty acid and a cis fatty acid

I think one of the two sentences need to be changed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.246.200.186 (talk) 10:00, 12 February 2016 (UTC)

Dab page
I'm not sure a disambiguation page is necessary unless the other CLAs are common enough. None of them seems remotely close to conjugated linoleic acid, thus there is little possibility of confusion.

Also, I just signed up so apparently I can't rename the article, but does anyone object to decapitalizing "conjugated linoleic acid"? It should not be capitalized despite the fact that is has an abbreviation composed of the capitalized initials (CLA).

I'm aware that a web search turns up many sites that do capitalize the term but take a look at some actual studies here. You'll note that the heading capitalizes the term but none of the study titles do. http://www.wisc.edu/fri/clarefs.htm

-VQuick

CLA stands for Collective Labour Agreement too. I'm not enough versied in Wiki editing to do the necessary manipulations, nor do i know if the wiki community agrees with Collective Labour Agreement too.

But not to forget Agencies, Bureaus, Schools like:

Copyright Licencing Agency Canadian Library Association Country Land & Business Association Computer Law Association California Library Association CLA Centre de linguistique appliquée de Besançon

and many more. I believe for my part, that a disambiguation is absolutely necessary… but i'm new here ;-)

"Good trans fat"
Isn't this the so-called "good trans fat"? Carolynparrishfan 17:34, 2 December 2005 (UTC)

Number of isomers
The first paragraph states that CLA is a family of eight isomers. The third paragraph says there are two isomers. We need consistency, or an explanation of the discrepancy.

--As stated in paragraph one: "Conjugated linoleic acid...refers to a family of many isomers of linoleic acid"  I believe the third paragraph may be referring to CLA supplements.

Contradiction
Dietary CLA supplementation does not seem to have any adverse effects.

CLA should be taken with food to prevent side effects, including diarrhea, nausea, and stomachache.

These sentences clearly contradict each other, don't they? Aragorn2 18:07, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

Don't know where to put this - but this reader has had incidences when taking 1500 mg of CLA of feeling like his head is in the clouds, or buzzing or slight drunk. Very bizzare feeling from taking CLA and has caused me to stop taking it at points.


 * That would be original research and thus couldn't be part of the article. However, have you seen anything else pertaining to these side-effects online? Frankg 15:17, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Mercola
Is it appropriate to cite Dr. Mercola as a source for this article? His reputation is in serious question. Selling health magnets on his main page?
 * Heh. No, I do not think he is a reputable source.  A verifible and scientific study, yes. Rlove 20:55, 27 May 2006 (UTC)


 * Mercola isn't the real source of the info, so it's not so great to cite him. I have replaced him and one other citation with the original articles involved. --Slashme 21:22, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

Other Positive Health Claims
I've noticed that this article has a few references to positive health benefits of CLA that don't appear to be substantiated. The page referenced in the link for instance claims that CLA "Lowers insulin resistance", whereas the journal articles I can find claim that it can worsen insulin resistance.

Additionally, I can't find an reference for the claim of "overall enhancement of the immune system".

Any thoughts on removing of that link and possibly removing those claims?

Ar-wiki 18:06, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Um, Also, the page says something about "CLA improving breast and colon cancer." Partial Reference for this may be " "Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) is a powerful anticancer agent in a number of tumor model systems;" which is said by this article: Conjugated linoleic acid induces apoptosisnext term of murine mammary tumor cells via Bcl-2 loss Lihui Oua, Clement Ipb, Barbara Lisafelda and Margot M. Ipa, Corresponding Author Contact Information, E-mail The Corresponding Author aDepartment of Pharmacology and Therapeutics, Roswell Park Cancer Institute, Elm and Carlton Streets, Buffalo, NY 14263, USA bDepartment of Chemoprevention, Roswell Park Cancer Institute, Elm and Carlton Streets, Buffalo, NY 14263, USA

Received 15 March 2007. Available online 26 March 2007.

149.4.108.117 13:35, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

This link I found mentions an article on the benefits of a CLA supplement along with a scientific study. http://healthandfitness.sympatico.msn.ca/Supplement+may+help+cut+fat/Home/ContentPosting_50Plus.aspx?isfa=1&newsitemid=e1cdd715-1c77-449f-a78a-37147d20e458&feedname=50_PLUS&show=True&number=3&showbyline=True&subtitle=&detect=&abc=abc

Dietary Sources
I'm thinking of removing the following line and ref as it really doesn't pertain to CLA.

"Some bakers and food producers are substituting palm oil for butter so that they can label their products as trans-fat free."

The preceding line about the CLA's nature as a transfat should be moved to the first paragraph of the article where that topic is discussed.

Any thoughts, complaints? Ar-wiki 23:44, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Contradiction
Early in the article: "in the United States, trans linkages in a conjugated system are not counted as trans fat for the purposes of nutritional regulations and labeling." Later in the article: "Laws restricting trans fats do not distinguish between trans fats formed by partial hydrogenation and naturally occuring CLA." I'm pretty sure the first statement is correct and the second one is false, as far as the US goes. Any idea what's up with this? Frankg 00:25, 10 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The regulatory chemical definition of the FDA for trans fatty acids is "all unsaturated fatty acids that contain one or more isolated (i.e., non-conjugated) double bonds in a trans configuration." So I think you're right. I was going to clean up that section anyway so I'll nip that one too. Ar-wiki 02:44, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

No geometric isomers
I corrected the definition at the beginning of the article. The double bonds have to be conjugated which is not the case in linoleic acid, so they are not geometric isomers. In fact, there are only 4 geometric isomers of linoleic acid (linoleic acid (Z,Z), linoelaidic acid (E,E), and the (E,Z) and (Z,E) variants, which don't have nonsystematic names as far as I know). Icek 20:55, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Number of CLAs
The article currently says "at least 13 are reported". Well, there are 13 trans,trans-isomers if no double bond is allowed at the end of the chain (and one more if it is allowed, but maybe this is not occurring in natural CLAs due to biochemical reasons). There are 39 of them if you include trans,cis- and cis,trans-isomers. I'd like to see a more precise definition of what exactly is a CLA. Icek 01:19, 8 August 2007 (UTC)
 * My understanding is that should be understood as 'at least 13 have been reported in the literature." Many of the possible isomers have not been found in nature. David.Throop 19:31, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

CAS Number
Someone had left the cite for the CAS number as 2420-56-6; but that number comes up emptyhanded at CAS. David.Throop 19:31, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Opening sentence
The opening sentence isn't a sentence!

"Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) to a family of many isomers of linoleic acid (at least 13 are reported), which are found primarily in the meat and dairy products of ruminants." Unfree (talk) 09:53, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

Fifty percent higher?
This statement should be more explicit:

"[M]others consuming mostly organic milk and meat products have about 50 percent higher levels of rumenic acid in their breast milk."

Were they compared to women who ate similar amounts of milk and meat products, but ones which weren't organic? Unfree (talk) 11:30, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Dietary Forms of CLA
Will it be appropriate to mention in the article different dietary CLA forms, such as oil, powder, etc.? I don't think that this is very important, but maybe there's a point in mentioning this. J.D. (talk) 19:27, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Cheese
More details about cheese would be a plus. —  C M B J  00:04, 15 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Check out this research by Institut National de la Recherche Agronomique called Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) : Effect of processing on CLA in cheese and the impact of CLA on the arachidonic acid metabolism. They covered lots of aspects on cheese production. Hope this will be useful. J.D. (talk) 13:30, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Conjugation and "Isomerization"?
The header paragraph contains the word "conjugated", and the word wikilinks here: Conjugated_fatty_acid. That article is a stub with no explanation of what "conjugation" means in this context. There is another Wikipedia article here: Conjugated_system - which appears to have a much better explanation of what conjugation" is in CLA. However, I know little about this topic, and don't want to change the wikilink without knowing if I'm correct. Would one of you with some expert knowledge respond here and change the wililink if appropriate? And if that's not correct not, please comment here as well... and maybe link to something with a better explanation than the CFA article?

Also, I've heard the terms "Isomerized" and "Isomerization", and my question is: when people use those terms, are they actually talking (generally) about conjugation? i.e. is "Isomerization" an improper term for chemical conjugation? A less precise term? A lay term? A synonym?

thanks Tzf (talk) 18:02, 4 August 2011 (UTC)


 * In this case, the "conjugated" is not an adjective per se, as in "big house" or "small car", but a historical disambiguation term from the fatty acid linoleic acid, a different compound where the double bonds are physically located elsewhere in the molecule. This name arose because both have 18 carbons and two double bonds, but are position isomers, not identical compounds. The conjugation is the main physical effect of this difference - when adjacent, the double bonds are conjugated. (Historically, determination of empirical formulas and analytic ozonolysis and halogenation reactions were done to distinguish between compounds; the 18 carbons and the two double bonds are detected identically for both compounds. However, the conjugation gives them different ultraviolet peak positions, the delocalized conjugated system absorbing at longer wavelengths.) Isomerization is not a synonym for conjugation, it is any reaction where isomers interconvert. --vuo (talk) 22:11, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Moved from article
I have removed the following list of references from the article because they were simply appended to the end of the article and were not being used to support specific article content. Since they may be useful for further improvement of the article, I have moved them here. -- Ed (Edgar181) 20:29, 17 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Review
 * Review
 * Review
 * Review
 * Review
 * Bauman D. E., Corl B. A., Baumgard L. H., Griinari J. M. Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) and the dairy cow // In Recent Advances in Animal Nutrition / Ed. P. C. Garnsworthy, J. Wiseman; Nottingham Univ. Press. – Nottingham, UK, 2001 – P. 221–250.
 * Harefoot C. G., Hazlewood G. P. Lipid metabolism in the rumen / In: Hobson P. N., Stewart C. S. (Eds.), The Rumen Microbial Ecosystem, second ed. Blackie Academic, London, 1999. – P. 382–426.
 * Review
 * Review
 * Review
 * Review
 * Bauman D. E., Corl B. A., Baumgard L. H., Griinari J. M. Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) and the dairy cow // In Recent Advances in Animal Nutrition / Ed. P. C. Garnsworthy, J. Wiseman; Nottingham Univ. Press. – Nottingham, UK, 2001 – P. 221–250.
 * Harefoot C. G., Hazlewood G. P. Lipid metabolism in the rumen / In: Hobson P. N., Stewart C. S. (Eds.), The Rumen Microbial Ecosystem, second ed. Blackie Academic, London, 1999. – P. 382–426.
 * Review
 * Bauman D. E., Corl B. A., Baumgard L. H., Griinari J. M. Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) and the dairy cow // In Recent Advances in Animal Nutrition / Ed. P. C. Garnsworthy, J. Wiseman; Nottingham Univ. Press. – Nottingham, UK, 2001 – P. 221–250.
 * Harefoot C. G., Hazlewood G. P. Lipid metabolism in the rumen / In: Hobson P. N., Stewart C. S. (Eds.), The Rumen Microbial Ecosystem, second ed. Blackie Academic, London, 1999. – P. 382–426.
 * Bauman D. E., Corl B. A., Baumgard L. H., Griinari J. M. Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) and the dairy cow // In Recent Advances in Animal Nutrition / Ed. P. C. Garnsworthy, J. Wiseman; Nottingham Univ. Press. – Nottingham, UK, 2001 – P. 221–250.
 * Harefoot C. G., Hazlewood G. P. Lipid metabolism in the rumen / In: Hobson P. N., Stewart C. S. (Eds.), The Rumen Microbial Ecosystem, second ed. Blackie Academic, London, 1999. – P. 382–426.
 * Bauman D. E., Corl B. A., Baumgard L. H., Griinari J. M. Conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) and the dairy cow // In Recent Advances in Animal Nutrition / Ed. P. C. Garnsworthy, J. Wiseman; Nottingham Univ. Press. – Nottingham, UK, 2001 – P. 221–250.
 * Harefoot C. G., Hazlewood G. P. Lipid metabolism in the rumen / In: Hobson P. N., Stewart C. S. (Eds.), The Rumen Microbial Ecosystem, second ed. Blackie Academic, London, 1999. – P. 382–426.

Bias
I agree that many subjects of this article contain bias. The author's personal view is often added in this article (for example on the paragraph that refers to the risk of breast cancer). In fact, an extended research on Pubmed shows that there is controversy about CLA's effects on body weight reduction. Also there is a controversy about some adverse effects such as fatty liver (liver steatosis) and also about insulin resistance. Other information is omitted here, such as a study showing beneficial effects on Crohn's disease and also a case of fulminant hepatic (liver) failure caused by a supplement containing CLA! I suggest that a Cochrane review will make things more clear. 688dim (talk) 20:19, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Where is the reference about the reduction of DHA and its complications
....the t10,c12 CLA reduced the DHA content of heart tissue by 25%, while in the spleen, DHA content rose, and AA fell. Where is the reference? I found no related study on Pubmed.

....DHA is an omega-3 fatty acid important to cardiovascular health, and the dramatic reduction of DHA in heart tissue can have serious health consequences. Is this a personal opinion? In fact a change in the ratio of omega - 3 fatty acids (such as DHA) to omega - 6 fatty acids (such as linoleic acid) has considered by some studies that may affect health and mortality, however a specific study should be added in this article. 688dim (talk) 20:23, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

Text misrepresents sources
This article clearly misrepresents the content of cited studies. For instance the statement "has no long-term effect on body composition" is supported by a study which showed that CLA did change body composition in statistically significant ways. Rather bizarre, and very dishonest. Issue313 (talk) 00:38, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 12:10, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

Another excellent article ... it would be nice if it could be in a section for "Further Reading" or ...
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4429457/

"Pros and cons of CLA consumption: an insight from clinical evidences"

Sailas Benjamin, corresponding author Priji Prakasan, Sajith Sreedharan, Andre-Denis G Wright, and Friedrich Spener

Immensely thorough review of the literature. It agrees with the current article, e.g.: "As far as human consumption of CLA is concerned, a definite conclusion for safety and efficacy has not been reached yet. At this context, we strongly recommend the need for more precise and well-designed long-term intervention studies with" ... etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.176.132.203 (talk) 04:36, 1 February 2019 (UTC)