Talk:Control of cities during the Syrian civil war/Archive 24

Stop vandalising Tabqa around
The airbase is NOT under regime siege. Is under full IS control, yes, some clashes maybe around according to SOHR, put SOHR reports clashes around many places, such as Deir Ez-Zor Airport, put you don't put it under siege, so why to put Tabqa? It's not under any siege, regime lost all of Raqqa for now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 179.179.152.147 (talk) 02:59, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

I will be removed the red circle if nobody post sources here in next hours --Pototo1 (talk) 05:48, 27 August 2014 (UTC)
 * SOHR said that clashes around al-Tabaqa military airport.source Hanibal911 (talk) 06:48, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

--Removed: flamebaiting


 * Can't say I disagree.. Boredwhytekid (talk) 12:18, 27 August 2014 (UTC)
 * So essentially, ban everyone who does not agree with what you say the first time you say it. Yes, that will get us closer to an unbiased map. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:30A:C01B:89F0:4C1F:A767:8E14:8CED (talk) 20:12, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...Syrian-soldiers-in-latest-brutal-killing.html

Fleeing soldiers from Tabqa airbase are marched in the desert and executed en masse...

Map shows the regime besieging Tabqa...

Fleeing soldiers...mass execution...besieging Tabqa...

Something is wrong with this picture... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 20:46, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Jaba, Tel Krum and Al Ruach in Quneitra under Government control
Source is here: http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/184549#.VABh0mPDV4F

Jaba coordinates: http://wikimapia.org/3133169/Jaba Tel Krum coordinates: http://wikimapia.org/30805600/bs/Tel-Krum Al Ruach coordinates: Can't identify this one Thanks --79.97.182.2 (talk) 11:47, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

why Flitah change to red to contested ?
sources or it go to red again in next hours --Pototo1 (talk) 19:05, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

via https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/575180572590285, Falita is contested and stop reverting edits with reliable sources.Alhanuty (talk) 02:50, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
 * But SOHR partly biased in the rebels side and no one from another reliable sources not said that clashes in this city. And it can be was only hit and run atack because even SOHR more not said about clashes inside city of Flita. Also on 23 August SOHR reported that clashes in the city Talbisa but we not change him to contested because SOHR more not said about clashes in this city. I also didnt find reports about clashes in the city Flita in the reports on the site SOHR Hanibal911 (talk) 05:31, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

still SOHR is reliable,and the masdar is a very pro pro-regime source and shouldn't be used and is eqivialant to SANA,and Paolowalter better stop using it.Alhanuty (talk) 15:36, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Al-masdar is a reliable source. You cannot just go around labeling sources as you like because they do not fit your "agenda". Al-Masdar reports have been reliable and they report of the losses of both sides. And no, SOHR is not reliable. The man who runs it has openly declared his hate for the regime. How can we trust such a person to deliver real news.

Then using the same logic change Tasil to green ya manyak. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 08:10, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

Al-Mari'iyah
I also think Al-Mari'iyah must be under the control of ISIS by now because ISIS is beginning to siege the Deir Ezzor airport. https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/574903665951309 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wethrman2 (talk • contribs) 16:55, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Stop distorting the facts because SOHR only said about clashes around Der-Ezzor military airport. So for now moment this village should remain marked as contested. Hanibal911 (talk) 17:22, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

Ayyash
Ayyash is contested. Assad is battling ISIS for it, according to the Syrian Observatory. https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/575759959199013 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wethrman2 (talk • contribs) 16:43, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

You need something more information too poor.

At least 9 sources and two visual evidences confirm Ayyash is under Army control sources from July 2014 = Source 1 (Official Syrian Government)Source 2Source 3Source 4Source 5Source 6Source 7Source 8Source 9Visual confirmation 1Visual confirmation 2 --Pototo1 (talk) 18:48, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

Can someone strip Pototo of his editing privileges? He is deceivingly using regime sources to make/revert/oppose edits. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 13:20, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Sure thing. While I'm at it, I will also remove the editing privileges of anyone who doesn't agree with me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:30A:C01B:89F0:ECBD:9174:D5B:7880 (talk) 15:20, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

Umm Sharshouh Mistake and Qanitara changes
I think it was problem in situation of Um Sharshouh because Syrian Prespective oppsed that this city was under the control of SAA from 28 August and the clashes happened in round of this city.

http://www.syrianperspective.com/2014/08/isis-crushed-in-homs-scores-of-terrorists-killed-at-maryamayn.html According to this source these villages are under the control of SAA :Tal Al-Kuroom, Al-Rawaadhi, Jibbaa

http://www.syrianperspective.com/2014/08/syrian-army-kos-terrorists-in-qunaytra.html I know that this source is ProGovernment but must of it's news are true.MZarif (talk) 18:15, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
 * We are not allowed to use Syrian Perspective for a few reasons: 1. The site operator openly declares his friendliness towards the government. 2. He refers to rebels as "rats" and "terrorists".3. He has the Syrian Flag boldly emblazoned on his website to remove all doubt about where his loyalty lies. However, feel free to use SOHR for any changes on the map. They are a reliable source because,1. The site operator openly declares his friendliness towards the rebels. 2. He refers to rebels as "martyrs" and "heroes".3. He has the Opposition Flag boldly emblazoned on his website to remove all doubt about where his loyalty lies.

SOHR is pro Opposition they used the word "Regime" and "Fighters" regime us a word used by anti government sources.

Anyway the official source for army gains is SANA or Syrian TV Channels --Pototo1 (talk) 02:17, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

The map
The map is extremely big (at least in Chrome) - maybe box it? Christian75 (talk) 08:52, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

Why Al Kafat contexted in rural Hama?
It's deep under army held area on Hama insurgents are on north Hama

There is the map https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BwWhnb8IQAEwtCM.jpg

If you no showing here source / Visual evidence it must be back to red again --Pototo1 (talk) 14:26, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

Sources for put Any ad Dananir contexted in Homs
Any source or information about this place ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pototo1 (talk • contribs) 14:47, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

Jaza'a and surrounding villages
Jaza'a and surrounding villages are put on black, but KUrdish sources claim to hold the town. http://en.firatnews.com/news/news/ypg-4-gang-members-killed-in-jazaa.htm Should be put on contested. M.Burri (talk) 14:39, 26 August 2014 (UTC)

Jaza'a is held by Islamic State, they posted the photo set of their conquest and the failed results of a Kurdish attempt to retake it. https://justpaste.it/ja7im_pkk All these dead soldiers showed up in YPG films said to have been taken while recapturing Jaza'a, as you can see they died and failed.Tgoll774 (talk) 10:53, 1 September 2014 (UTC)

Tell Brak to blue
https://pietervanostaeyen.files.wordpress.com/2014/09/2000px-syria6.png

This pro-opposition map(which is neutral in a area with only YPG/IS)says the town in held by a local tribe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 177.204.92.34 (talk) 22:16, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Tasil and Hamidiyeh (Golan)
Can Hamidiyeh go to contested: http://live.aljazeera.com/Event/Syria_Live_Blog

-- No. AlJazeera is pro-rebel a cannot be used. Nevertheless, I found similar statements elsewhere (SOHE I guess). Hamidiyeh should get a green ring around.Paolowalter (talk) 22:07, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Also, back to the Tasil-case again. In the last days there have been several updates of this map along the lines: 'if there is no actual report of fighting anoymore, revert this contested city to red'. Tasil should - following this line of thought - go to green. There are no reports of fighting anymore, and it is deep inside rebel held territory. So: green. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 21:18, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
 * "Can Hamidiyeh go to contested", your source says clashes around the town, not in it, so no. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:30A:C01B:89F0:4C1F:A767:8E14:8CED (talk) 22:00, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Aljazeera English is very reliable.Alhanuty (talk) 02:30, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Jordan border
Some pro gov sources including visual evidences claim the Army cut some Supply Lines between Jordan, Quneitra. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N05Wh9sBWhk http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13930611000772 --Pototo1 (talk) 13:52, 2 September 2014 (UTC) -- It is not clear which modifications you are requiring. In any case it is a pro-gov source and the change would be relevant for the Daraa map.Paolowalter (talk) 22:07, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Pro-gov source cannot be used for government gains and YouTube videos cannot be used as a source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 20:53, 2 September 2014 (UTC) It's not you tube this is the official Syrian TV report --Pototo1 (talk) 02:34, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Oh it's a SANA report? Sorry man I thought you were using a pro-regime biased source, go ahead and make the change. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 08:00, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

North Hama
According to this Pro-opposition map, al-Safsafiyah should go just red, and maybe Kafr Rumah to green since there are no clashes there, I highly doubt regime would bomb their own soldiers including Marat Numan. DuckZz (talk) 09:22, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Halfaya
According to documnet sy. Severe clashes occur between the Syrian army and al-Nusra Front in south Halfaya town .Halfaya should contested. source: https://www.facebook.com/documents.sy/posts/795285273867564176.42.115.40 (talk) 11:36, 3 September 2014 (UTC) --There are many reports about clashes South of Halfaya. There may be an issues of translations between 'South of Halfaya' (outside the city) and 'South Halfaya' (in the city). Better wait more robust sources. Paolowalter (talk) 13:29, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Jisr ash-Sghigour
I have read some articles about the tensions between Nusra and the SRF/Hazm in Idlib. I stumbled upun multiple articles from neutral sources claiming that Jishr ash-Shigur is held by Jabhat al-Nusra since three weeks. Checkpoints south of the city remain in SAA hands.

Note: Al-Arabiya says that "Ariha and Idlib are SAA controlled", it doesn't mention Jisr ash-Shigur (a major city) as SAA held anymore.
 * AP/Yahoo source: http://news.yahoo.com/infighting-split-emerges-among-syrian-rebels-172309665.html
 * Zaman source: http://www.todayszaman.com/son-dakika_al-qaeda-group-seizes-syrian-town-on-turkish-border_353777.html
 * Al-Arabiya News source: http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/middle-east/2014/05/25/Syria-s-Nusra-Front-targets-army-with-four-suicide-bombings-.html

Note: on closer inspection, Ishtabraq is south of the main highway, and south of Jisr ash-Shigur. It was previously though that rebels did not operate in that area. They can only advance there if they have indeed taken over Jisr ash-Shigur.
 * Syrian Observer note on clashes in a Alawite village close to Jisr ash-Shigur: http://syrianobserver.com/News/News/Rebels+Attack+Military+Bases+in+Maarat+alNuman
 * Wikimapia: http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=35.804519&lon=36.313248&z=14&m=b

This should mean: Jisr ash-Shigur to green with a red ring, Ayn al-Suda to full green. Checkpoints and army bases south of Jisr ash-Shigur along the hihgway stay red, no green circle since there's no report of serious clashes there. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 09:27, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

-- Hardly ever read something more meaningless. Your sources are either outdated, or biased or irrelevant. We cannot draw conclusions on some place from figtingh elesewhere. Any change of status in Jisr ash-Shigur would be trumpetted by rebels, we would not miss it. No change.Paolowalter (talk) 13:29, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Wishful thinking! if rebels conquered Jisr Ash-Shugur we would have heard about barrel bombings in the city, that would be at least an indication. Hasan Rizvanbegovic (talk) 14:56, 3 September 2014 (UTC)


 * We'll have to keep an eye on it. Generally I agree with Pao and Hasan - there would have been more coveraged/reports of SAA bombarding the town if it had fallen. The yahoo link is interesting though, in that it states Jisr al Shughour was taken, but I haven't been able to locate any corroborating sources, or even the alleged claim by SOHR director. ISW and other sources attest to the ongoing fighting around the city http://iswsyria.blogspot.com/2014/07/rebel-operations-in-idlib-province.html. Boredwhytekid (talk) 15:32, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

deSyracuse and pietervanostaeyen
Once again I would like to invite all rational editors to IMMEDIATELY REVERT ANY EDITS THAT ARE MADE BASED EXCLUSIVELY ON MAPS CREATED BY RANDOM INDIVIDUALS. Absolutely preposterous. It is a farce to use these as primary sources. Boredwhytekid (talk) 19:20, 3 September 2014 (UTC)
 * This map from pro opposition source And many editors have agreed to use the data from the pro government map to display success by rebels and vice versa. So stop hysterical and unfounded accusations. Hanibal911 (talk) 19:50, 3 September 2014 (UTC)
 * If you had issues with these maps, you should have spoken out WAY before now. These maps have been in use on Wikipedia for a while now. Now it appears as though you are trying to stop regime gains acknowledged by these sources. Besides, in order to "IMMEDIATELY REVERT ANY EDITS THAT ARE MADE BASED EXCLUSIVELY ON MAPS CREATED BY RANDOM INDIVIDUALS", you would need a community agreement that these sources that you named are in fact unreliable on all fronts.

I have brought this up multiple times over the course of months. Anyone can create a map online. Are these individuals' maps or major media maps? Why do we assume these individuals' maps are more accurate than ours? Why are they classified pro-op? Do they have access to information that we do not? There are tons of editors on this page who scour the web for information about the Syria conflict daily - why are we assuming the editors of these random maps are somehow "in the know" about gov't or rebel advances that we, collectively, find no other data on anywhere on the web? BTW - I'm of the same opinion about syrianperspective maps.. it's not a partisan thing.. it's a, it makes no sense to overturn edits based on major media reports simply because one random individual's map shows a different color, thing. Boredwhytekid (talk) 20:06, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

It's amazing how illogical Hanibal's reasoning is here, and how obvious he is being about his pro-regime bias at this point. Boredwhytekid was not discussing whether or not deSyracuse claims to be pro-opp or not, since any random idiot can go online and claim to be whatever he wants. He's discussing the fact that WE HAVE NO IDEA WHO THIS GUY IS, WHAT HIS SOURCES ARE, AND ON WHAT BASIS HE IS MAKING HIS MAPS. Sources have to be RELIABLE, you can't use them just because you want to push your bias on the map. I can go make a website now, claim to be pro-regime, and create a map showing all of Damascus in rebel hands. It doesn't work that way, and anyone with half a brain who is trying to make an objective map will see what the problem is here. We can't even make a 100% accurate, very old, and well known change (Tasil to green) because of how overbearing the pro-regime bias is on this map.

Eib in Daraa under insurgent control what is your source?
Eib in Daraa is on map under insurgent control but it look in too deep Army held territories what is the source who you used to put that on green? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pototo1 (talk • contribs) 02:28, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

See the discussion on Suwayda province. Multiple sources given for several small towns in the hands of Beduin rebels and Jabhat al-Nusra fighters. --84.24.43.183 (talk) 07:44, 2 September 2014 (UTC) guest
 * : Maybe this sourceHanibal911 (talk) 07:47, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Tasil in Daraa contested what is your source? Tasil in Daraa is on map under contested control but it look too deep Rebel held territories what is the source you used to put that on contested? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 08:34, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Sarcasm aside, Pototo al Assad, the reason why Daraa looks wonky is because it and Quneitra province are ridiculously inaccurate because you and other editors are POV-pushing and ruining the map. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 08:37, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

The pro Opposition SOHR is who made on this map the 95% of the changes I'm not who make Tasil on conflict but it's close to Nawa who is partiality under Army control --Pototo1 (talk) 13:00, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Yeaaa Daraa and Quneitra have been outdated for months. Good luck barking up that tree though. I spent over a month pushing to show the rebel presence on the Lebanese border, in the Assal al-Ward and Ras al Maara area - and it was shot down, reverted constantly, despite near daily reports of conflict in the area, until syrianperspective published a map acknowledging the rebel presence. Boredwhytekid (talk) 19:36, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Zabadani is point and case. Government hasn't controlled it in over a year - on our map here, it was red until barely a month ago. Boredwhytekid (talk) 19:37, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
 * What the heck are you talking about. At the conclusion of the Qalamoun offensives, literally tens of sources declared that the rebels had surrendered in Zabadani. I am not sure why it is even contested on our map to begin with. It is clearly government held territory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:30A:C01B:89F0:4C1F:A767:8E14:8CED (talk) 19:43, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

Exactly the point. The Qalamoun offensive still hasn't ended - take a peak at SANA, or SOHR, or whatever source you please. "Rebels surrendered in Zabadani" was eagerly interpreted as "Rebels surrendered Zabadani" - meanwhile, SANA continued (continues) to report "cleansing terrorist dens in Zabadani" and the like, and SOHR continued (continues) to report barrel bombing and street fighting in the city. Yet it went red and those reports were ignored for quite some time. Boredwhytekid (talk) 20:13, 2 September 2014 (UTC)
 * http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/security/2014/08/latest-updates-from-the-ground.html .. http://syriatimes.sy/index.php/news/local/14041-syrian-arab-army-kills-al-nusra-front-ringleader-in-zabadani-outside-damascus-destroys-large-number-of-terrorists-cars-outside-lattakia .. Did you even try to research the situation in Zabadani before you typed nonsense?

Look at you linking a .sy source and then talking about nonsense. Pototo go ahead and change Eib, you're right it's too deep in regime territory, and on that same note, change Nubl and Zahraa in Aleppo to green - they are way too deep in rebel territory to be regime held. Oh and Kefraya and Fu'ah. What about western Deir Ezzor city? That's super deep in IS territory, change that to black as well. Abu al Duhur air base? That's WAY DEEP in rebel territory, and we haven't heard news about that place in a while. Change it to green.

Idiot. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.184.67.215 (talk) 20:48, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

lol nice. I only posted a .sy to demonstrate the diversity of sources that support Zabadani's contested status

This anti government map showing this place in Daraa under Army control http://umap.openstreetmap.fr/fr/map/desyracuse-syria-civil-war-8-august-2014_14181#12/32.9472/36.3774 --Pototo1 (talk) 21:47, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

YPG captured Jazaa
YPG captured Jazaa according to documents sy. source: https://www.facebook.com/documents.sy/posts/793896884006403176.33.113.206 (talk) 10:01, 31 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Another source is here . Updating. EllsworthSK (talk) 16:57, 31 August 2014 (UTC)

That source is actually pro-Syrian Government site. nad since YPG and government proxy. that information might be mere a propaganda. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.208.239.127 (talk) 21:17, 1 September 2014 (UTC)

https://justpaste.it/ja7im_pkk Jazaa'ah is under IS control.Tgoll774 (talk) 01:40, 2 September 2014 (UTC)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeHVdHCy7pQ

Video uploaded yesterday showing YPG control over Jazaa.

190.67.157.13 (talk) 13:13, 3 September 2014 (UTC)

Video was posted the 31st of August, check reverse video search and the commander speaking on it is dead and in the IS photo release from the same day. IS still has the town and YPG was forced back to prepare for an expected IS offensive from Tall Hamis. Just paste it has deleted the original content but I have the PDF saved. But have no way to paste it onto this page, if you know how to do so, please tell me and I'll plug it in.Tgoll774 (talk) 14:59, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Red green yellow or black circle around the town or village
Let's not clutter up the map and we will put a circle around the city only in the case if the city is besieged by so how often we put a circle on the basis of the reports of fighting near the city or in its vicinity. But we can not be sure exactly that the clashes were continuing, and maybe it is just had an attack and retreat. Circle can be installed around the city or village if for a long time we have a message that there clashes continued around these citys or villages. So that often on the map is set circle around the town or village but clashes around this settlement maybe has long been ended and this not right. Hanibal911 (talk) 09:02, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

-- We should consider removing the ring alltogether. They are of little use and generate a lot of discussion. Furthermore they are positioned almost at random. Let's just remove them. Paolowalter (talk) 20:28, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Contested and Besieged towns - Revert to solid color after a month or two of no information from any source
I have been a lurker to this page for a couple of years and I have a thought. Why not have a "Time date bomb" to cities that have a contested or besieged symbol on them. Say the cities or villages revert back to a solid color .... agreed to by the group ...... after a certain amount of time of not getting any info about fighting in the area. Active fighting gets press, lack of active fighting does not get any press. SO if the fighting has moved on the besieged and or contested symbology stays on the map forever. You can always reactivate the active symbol is fighting returns.

-- Because sometimes (e.g. Nawa) the city is actually split in two even of there is no fighting for a protracted amount of time. The other problems is that for small villages, quoted only occasionally, it is not clear who controls the town after the fighting. In any case, in general, barring the first case above (of actual splitting of the town), we shoudl revert to the old color after some time without reported fighting. Paolowalter (talk) 20:28, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

That is a good point about the split control. Then I propose that active fighting be delineated by an active contested symbol and split control with little to no fighting be delineated by a static contested symbol.

Tasil and Jasim in Daraa contested: what is your source?
Can somebody show me a valid source from the past two months or so that indicates protracted fighting in the towns of Tasil and Jasim in Daraa province? I can't find any, so that makes this map inaccurate... --84.31.204.195 (talk) 14:41, 4 September 2014 (UTC) PolarBear
 * I agree that we need note the city Jasim in Dara province under rebel control because no one from reliable sources not said that this city still contested. Because also the map from the pro government source in late May showed that this city under control by rebels. But if someone else has a source confirming that the city is challenged he need provide this source. Hanibal911 (talk) 18:59, 4 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I turned Jasim contested based on SOHR news, I do not know how the situation changed since.Paolowalter (talk) 20:43, 4 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Also the status of Shayck Miskin as contested. It used to be red but sometimes there are claims that bombs are thrown on the city and pro-gov map shows a pocket rebel controlled on the northern outskirt. I'd turn it red with a green little dot on the north side.Paolowalter (talk) 21:06, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Paolowalter, that is complete nonsense. Shayk Miskin is a rebel held but besieged town, cut off from Ibbta in the south (minus some tunnels or back roads) by a string of army bases. Nawa is splitt in half between the rebels and the SAA. Jasim and Tasil are both under complete rebel control, but subjected to severe shelling because they are supply lines to rebels fighting around Nawa and Inkhil. Also, the rules of this map are very clear: if rebels hold even one building of a town, it is as a matter of fact contested. SOHR never said there was fighting in Jasim, only fighting on the outskirts ... which means propably the two hills southeast of the city that are under SAA control and used to shell the city and Nawa. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 21:22, 4 September 2014 (UTC)

Red Towns deleted from Hasakah province why ?
We used before a pro insurgent source https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/562706100504399 for draw these towns the discussion is here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Cities_and_towns_during_the_Syrian_Civil_War/Archive_21#SAA_advancing_in_Hasakah

Why it was deleted

Incorrect location or a new vandalism case ?--Pototo1 (talk) 11:02, 24 August 2014 (UTC)


 * See Talk:Cities and towns during the Syrian Civil War/Archive 22 Tradedia talk 01:38, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Suwayda is a big city put it more bigger
Suwayda is too small on map it's more bigger if you see that on google earth is more big than Idlib --Pototo1 (talk) 02:10, 31 August 2014 (UTC)
 * city sizes are based on 2004 census (last available census) so As-Suwayda size was correct & consistent with the other cities (for eg, manbij is more populous than As-Suwayda). According to 2004 census, Idlib (=98,791) is larger than Suwayda (=73,641). All city dots were sized a long time ago based on precise standards, so no need to change them anymore. Tradedia talk 01:38, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Bteich Checkpoint
Bteich checkpoint should be green. It was recaptured by the regime on August 28th, but now appears to have been retaken by the rebels according to sources. For example:

http://eaworldview.com/2014/09/syria-daily-continuing-regime-assault-jobar-damascus/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Darkknight30 (talk • contribs) 13:02, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

SOHR is consistently reporting clashes around Bteich. Maybe there's a case to mark it contested, but having it red with green ring essentially symbolizes the same thing. In any case, no pro-rebel edit will be made exclusively based on eaworldview. Boredwhytekid (talk) 13:26, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

I see your point and would accept contested. I don't see evidence that the regime is firmly in control of the checkpoint. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Darkknight30 (talk • contribs) 13:31, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Indeed. Unfortunately however, since the last confirmed report of "who controlled it" said it was SAA controlled, and no source specifically stated that fighting is IN the checkpoint, there really isn't an ice cube's chance in heck of having it changed to contested. I'm not shooting you down or anything, just saying, the opposition to that proposal will be insurmountable until further sources are provided. Boredwhytekid (talk) 14:01, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Jobar
according to pro-Government source, Jobar is under opposition full control.

2.88.63.55 (talk) 13:19, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Not really. You have the northeast section around the mosque area which has been captured by the SAA. EkoGraf (talk) 14:34, 5 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Yeaa. It usually plays out that I'm the default advocate for showing rebel gains, because no one else plays the part, which is unfortunate, but I'm 100% with EkoGraf on this one. Boredwhytekid (talk) 17:24, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Heteta al-Jersh
Government forces captured Heteta al-Jersh. Please add it to the map. I think its near Zabadin in the Qalamoun area but not sure. EkoGraf (talk) 01:49, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
 * It is in Easternm Ghouta, east of Maliha, north of Zebdeen. is name in wikimapia is Hatita Al Jarsh. It is located in the Damascus map. I have already asked to update the map.Paolowalter (talk) 07:24, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

sohr says saa capture Heteta al jersh: https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/579212688853740 Heteta al jersh location: http://wikimapia.org/#lang=tr&lat=33.490408&lon=36.390324&z=14&m=b&gz=0;363880920;334853258;17166;119538;219726;126696;243759;41518;24890;0;0;122401;100421;123117 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.155.233.226 (talk) 07:25, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

And we should change darayya: https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/579305658844443195.155.233.226 (talk) 08:46, 6 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Too early. Negotiations are underway. The source just presents the requests of the rebels. At the moment there is only a ceasefire. We will follow the evolution of the discussion between rebels and government.Paolowalter (talk) 10:05, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Quneitra province
This section is mainly for changes in this region as clashes intensified between insurgents and Syrian Army. My first suggestion is to change the status of Tel Krum, shown here as a town/village, but actually it's just a checkpoint, as you can see on wikimap. Also new rebel map for this region, use for government advances, althought the map is much different than here.DuckZz (talk) 22:22, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

There are TV reports from the situation in Quneitra https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OThKX-j_XFQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldD5jCET8LU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHcHB76aXqs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VF0mgT63a34 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMX5xEmzG4Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GsyMuG3K9s nothing especial basically seems insurgents are attacking the province in direction from Israeli with a bit Israeli artillery support Held territories Army send the troops from Damascus this is not the first time when this happens anyway --Pototo1 (talk) 12:40, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Mashara, Quneitra
The first thing I saw were pro-rebel tweets saying rebels took control of this village, and then SOHR wrote that Syrian jets are targeting this village. Tweet1 Seized weapons Syrian Airstrikes

109.175.65.25 (talk) 20:39, 5 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Contested. EkoGraf (talk) 01:50, 6 September 2014 (UTC)


 * According to https://www.facebook.com/documents.sy/posts/797385220324236 SAA gaining ground in Mashara.Paolowalter (talk) 19:22, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Template:Syrian and Iraqi insurgency detailed map
I've just set up Template:Syrian and Iraqi insurgency detailed map. It shares its points with Module:Syrian Civil War detailed map and Module:Iraqi insurgency detailed map, so any changes to either of those will also update it automatically. Jackmcbarn (talk) 00:41, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

Deir Ez Zor contryside
SOHR reported that the rebels took control of many villages after clashes against ISIS https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/536128479828828 waiting for more sources FS1991

Khalfatli
According to SOHR, this border town is currently controlled by ISIS. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10152562069038115

IS in Damascus Pocket
According to AP -citing SOHR- the IS controls parts of Damascus pocket. They are now in "Al-Hajar Al-Aswad, Tadamon and Qadam in southern Damascus" https://uk.news.yahoo.com/syria-rebels-press-offensive-against-jihadists-near-damascus-110556227.html To have an accurate map of greater Damascus, should the Damascus map be altered for part of the green pocket to be black? It is fascinating to see this map develop and how much input people have put into it.

map changes
The map may soon need to add a new color. See news here on major split occurring within rebel ranks: http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/middle-east/10301860/Syrian-insurgents-seize-3-towns

Eastern Gouta
IS controls Mesraba in Eastern Gouta but I cannot see it on Damascus map — Preceding http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/870192.shtml

Tabqa Airbase is IS held
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/jihadists-enter-syria-military-airport-first-time-ngo-110006692.html#EXpo0d1

SANA also confirmed it. SOHR confirmed it. International media confirmed it. All free-lancer reporters on twitter reported it. The base is IS held (unfortunetly) It was already black and you changed it to red for some reason, not put it back to black.

http://www.almasdarnews.com/article/islamic-state-captures-tabqa-airbase-last-government-stronghold-ar-raqqa/ Stop vandalising it, it's IS not regime held. Also, this pro-regime website claims this ends all SAA presence in Raqqa, so all red towns need to be changed to black.

Daara central prison
For some reason, it was excluded from the map. http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2014/Mar-19/250704-syria-army-fighting-for-control-of-krak-fort-official.ashx#axzz2uAA4pFGD It was taken in March.

http://wikimapia.org/#lang=pt&lat=32.597879&lon=36.166477&z=15&m=b

Here is it's location. Put it there as a rebel held facility(just like Aleppo Central Prison).

Tell Mahl in Hama to red, what is the source?
In Hama the town of Tell Mahl had been green until yesterday. Suddenly today it is red. No source is given. So, what is your source? If there is none, revert it to green. Thank you :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 11:59, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

most recent map from Hama https://twitter.com/PetoLucem/status/505988237777969152/photo/1 --Pototo1 (talk) 12:11, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, revert to green. Reason: using pro-Gov Twitter source to show army gains. That is not possibly, as you yourself have often claimed based on pro-opposition maps showing a rebel advance. Revert to green please until neutral source indicates that change is certain.--84.24.43.183 (talk) 14:48, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

The map is outdated (August 31) but is the most recent who I know at the moment (I'm not very active on that now). --Pototo1 (talk) 17:46, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Still: pro-gov map cannot be used to show SAA advances. This map is a Syria Perspective map, pro-gov. Just like maps from Arab Chronicle are not used to show pro-rebel advances. So, green until a neutral source is provided... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 19:27, 6 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Source here Hanibal911 (talk) 19:37, 6 September 2014 (UTC)

Ah of course, no actual confirmation of the change so the deSyracuse trick is back to make an uncorroborated, untrue, pro-regime advance. Good job slimy editors. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.112.86.30 (talk) 17:00, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

Quneitra
Mainstream Israeli news says rebels seized the old city http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4565454,00.html / http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Jabhat-Al-Nusra-unlikely-to-target-Israel-soon-senior-army-officer-says-374271

Mainstream (right wing) US news says SAA is bombing Quneitra http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2014/09/01/islamist-rebels-syrian-forces-clash-near-golan-heights/

Random news reports rebels seized the old city http://www.jns.org/news-briefs/2014/8/29/new-video-surfaces-of-syrian-jihadists-seizing-golan-heights-border-crossing#.VAmp3E9OXOE=

Mind you the Israeli sources don't prefer Nusra to the SAA, so it's as unbiased as we're going to get. Not to mention that they can literally see it. Boredwhytekid (talk) 13:11, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

The reliablity of Israeli sources, mostly the IDF in this case, is questionable. The reality on the ground is that you have the IDF shelling SAA positions even when it was the rebels who shot at them and plus you got Israeli hospitals taking care of injured rebel fighters. Just based on this it makes enough of a case to consider Israel/Israeli sources biased towards the SAA. EkoGraf (talk) 14:30, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

That's a broad generalization. Israel has treated FSA and SRF fighters, yes, but not Nusra members - who constitute the predominant force in Quneitra as of late. The IDF and Israeli news are as anti-Nusra as they are anti-SAA. Boredwhytekid (talk) 14:46, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Jews and Al Qaeda / FSA is the same scum. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.210.253.209 (talk) 16:22, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

How constructive. Boredwhytekid (talk) 17:21, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Is true they are in same side. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.210.253.209 (talk) 17:43, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * But on 1 September another source reported that clashes resumed in area where the militants have wrested control of a key frontier crossing and it was not clear whether the Syrian army had managed to retake control of the Quneitra crossing.Al Akhbar Hanibal911 (talk) 18:22, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

That source does not talk about Quneitra's old city, so it has no relevance at all to this topic. Boredwhytekid (talk) 18:27, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

Al Akhbar is a Hezbollah media outlet...pretty sure you know that Habibal...keep up the good work slimy. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.112.86.30 (talk) 17:04, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

Rebels take over Brigade 90 in quneitra.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg71nHy7u5k — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.135.37.49 (talk) 14:06, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Pro opposition video from YouTube this not reliable source need confirmation from reliable source. Hanibal911 (talk) 14:14, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

Not true, and here's why. a) According to pro-rebel map, rebels are to far away from that base, they haven't even taken Jaba town. b) According to pro-rebel map, rebels have reached Nabi al Sakr, there you have two smaller checkpoints with weapons, some of them do belong to the brigade 90, but it's not the "brigade 90 army base", that one is much larger. So the location of this base is probably here.

As for all, we need some neutral or at least "obvious" rebel sources, can't see much going on twitter.DuckZz (talk) 14:23, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

Saw this video from Al Jazeera about Quneitra and Golan situation, at 2:40 they said rebels have taken the city of Um Batinah and are not attacking Tell Krom. Also pro-rebel map shows this city deep behind rebel lines.DuckZz (talk) 14:52, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

More sources for rebel gains in Qunaitra (with extensive video evidence):
 * https://malcolmxtreme.wordpress.com/tag/majduliyah/ (Ayn al-Basha, Majduliyah). Ayn al-Basha should be Ayn Ayshaa on our map
 * http://eaworldview.com/2014/09/syria-daily-insurgent-offensive-southwest/ (Majduliyah hospital in town taken by rebels, backs source 1)

This source backs claims that rebels control towns and hills around the crossing, that are shown contested on this map. The article can also be seen as supporting sources mentioned above by rebel gains around Majduliyah (several hills there, look it up on Google Maps).
 * http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/syria-rebels-advance-near-golan-heights-1954231684
 * http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2014/Sep-07/269839-syria-rebels-advance-near-israeli-occupied-golan-heights.ashx#axzz3Ce4zFpee

So that means:
 * Quinaitra and Qathaniyah to green
 * Majduliyah to green
 * Ayn Ashaa to green (or maybe contested)

I am unsure about Rasm al-Shayd and Rasm al Kharrar. It seems to me those two small towns west of Naba al-Sakhr should be green, as this is a logical supply route. Also, rebels are already fighting further north, as shown on this map. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.31.204.195 (talk) 15:57, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Eaworldview and Today in Syria this is pro opposition sources and cant be used to display by rebel advances. And rebels captured only Quneitra old city but not taken new city Quneitra. And Daily Star or Middle East eye not said that rebel captured city Majduliyah and Ayn Ashaa. And not need invent information or provide pro opposition sources but you only need provide confirmation of your data from reliable sources. Hanibal911 (talk) 18:04, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

New source on Qunaitra in rebel hands: http://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/nation-world/world/article/Islamists-advance-against-Syrian-forces-in-5737106.php This must be the new city, since there are no hills near the old city. So: green. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 18:11, 7 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Your source only said that Islamists advance against Syrian forces in Quneitra. Source meant that Islamists advance against Syrian forces in Quneitra province but not in the city Al Quneitra. They taken the Quneitra border crossing and old city Quneitra .Khaleej TimesHanibal911 (talk) 18:24, 7 September 2014 (UTC)

You are more cleary biased every day, you know that? This is the text of the news source: ''Fighting has raged in the province since August, when rebels and the Al Qaeda-affiliated Al Nusra Front took control of a border post. “Rebels have since taken control of hills overlooking the border post, as well as several villages nearby, (after battles that killed) a large number of troops on both sides,” Syrian Observatory for Human Rights director Rami Abdel Rahman said Sunday.''

So, we check wikimapia for the border post location: http://wikimapia.org/#lang=en&lat=33.133886&lon=35.874310&z=14&m=b Do you see any other towns nearby then Qunaitra and Qahtaniyah? I don't. Also, Twitter source with video conforming the roundabout east of Qunaitra has already been taken by rebels. Second, if both towns around the crossing are contested, how could rebels ever take the crossing? Surely they didn't come from Israel, so at least one of the two towns was already under rebel control prior to the attack. Hundreds of fighters don't just pop up in the Golan Heights.

Video report from Mamtinah by rebel fighters: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njuBwqZ0Sb0 Five minutes of video with very clear buildings and streets that can be checked through Wikimapia or Google Earth. You can easily trace the entire village. Proof enough? Of course not, since this is a pro-opposition source. But I bet ... as soon as a report arrises concerning a town under SAA attack it's made contested or colored with a red ring. To obvious ....

Yet another source for Qunaitra and Qathaniyah to green: http://live.aljazeera.com/Event/Syria_Live_Blog/126047900 :) --84.24.43.183 (talk) 12:11, 8 September 2014 (UTC) PolarBore
 * Your Source only reported that Syrian rebels have made fresh advances near the Israeli-occupied Golan Heights in Quneitra province. And said that rebels have taken control of hills overlooking the border post, as well as several villages nearby, after battles that killed a large number of troops on both sides," Syrian Observatory for Human Rights director Rami Abdel Rahman said Sunday. But not said that rebels captured new city Quneitra or village Qahtaniyah.

We cant change the status of the town or village based only on assumptions. Need more data that clearly tell which the village or city captured by rebels and if you provide such information, I immediately note it on the map. Hanibal911 (talk) 12:34, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Come on ... Jezus ... look it up on the maps. There are only two towns near Qunaitra crossing: Qunaitra city and Qathaniyah. No other towns. Compare that with dozens of HQ videos of the fighting itself, and the conclussion should be obvious to everyone ... except maybe this map makers :) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.24.43.183 (talk) 14:30, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Talbiseh
SOHR reported that clashes took place between regime forces and Islamic battalions in the western side of city Talbisa.SOHR Hanibal911 (talk) 17:59, 5 September 2014 (UTC)


 * That post says "clashes took place between regime forces and Islamic battalions in the western side of Talbisa city". You JUST TODAY reverted a green ring around Salamayn based off of this SOHR post https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/578906808884328 that says "Violent clashes took place yesterday night between the regime forces and the Islamic battalions in the southwest of al Sanamin town" - you said, and I quote, "SOHR said that there were clashes east of the city but the source said that the collision is near the town". Boredwhytekid (talk) 18:47, 5 September 2014 (UTC)


 * No need to compare! The difference is that in the case of the city Al Sanamayn SOHR said that violent clashes took place yesterday night between the regime forces and the Islamic battalions in the southwest of al Sanamin town and in Samlin.here But in the case of the city Talbiseh SOHR said that clashes took place between regime forces and Islamic battalions in the western side of Talbisa city.here But even now I do not insist that the city should be marked as contested. Hanibal911 (talk) 18:30, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

So, what's your point? Boredwhytekid (talk) 18:32, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * I just added information on the talk page to we tracked the situation in the city. Hanibal911 (talk) 18:46, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

I see. You have to admit, it's a bit duplicitous though - the red circle went up around Talbiseh based on an SOHR post that used THE EXACT SAME LANGUAGE https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/548848095223533 "clashes against the regular forces in the western side of Talbisa". Yet SOHR reports the same about Salamayn and... nada. Boredwhytekid (talk) 18:52, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Hey guy now you refuse to understand that you are not right. And a red circle around the city Talbisa was raised as a compromise because SOHR also reported about clashes in the city but we have agreed to this compromise because except SOHR no longer one of the reliable sources not reported about clashes in this city. And two big differences when the source said about clashes in the southwest of town and if source said that the clashes in the southern part of the city. Hanibal911 (talk) 19:06, 5 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Also, I suggest in the future used to edit only the information which was taken directly from site SOHR but not from the page in Facebook. Hanibal911 (talk) 19:16, 5 September 2014 (UTC)


 * (: you read into it whatever you want. When it's Talbisa, a gov't advance, "in the southern part of the city" is enough to make an edit. When it was Halfaya, a rebel advance, day after obstinate day you refused to use SOHR reports of the SAA bombing and shelling the city https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/573047822803560, https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/573384699436539. All I'm saying is let's try to avoid the Halfaya mistake - where we ignored reports of clashes so long that we missed the entire contested stage and ended up switching it straight from red to green. Boredwhytekid (talk) 19:22, 5 September 2014 (UTC)

my opinion is that hanibal is great guy. he always take some time before changes something. i don't believe that some of you have courage to attack him. from start he was objective and always listen two sides. it is not his problem because assad is gain and gain more teritories. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 37.122.168.24 (talk) 18:43, 8 September 2014 (UTC)

Ain M'neen
This place (marked as red on the map as Manin) just above the Damascus map went on truce according to http://eldorar.com/node/59187http://eldorar.com/node/59187http://eldorar.com/node/59187. Apparently there was a rebel presence non registered. But apparently they agreed to leave, so we can retain it red. Paolowalter (talk) 07:50, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Agree 92.44.169.34 (talk) 07:56, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Serghaya, in rebel or government hands? or contested?
Are we sure if Serghaya (north of al-Zabadani) is contested or under the government, or under rebel hands as indicated on the map? http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2014/09/zabadani-syria-regime-bomb-opposition-rebels.html See URL above, it looks at the bloody fighting (including gov barrel bombing) in Zabadani. and that extremist groups such as Nursa are involved. It indicates government forces are being brought from Serghava to reinforce the govs attacks on al-Zabadani. It states: "supportive military troops brought by the army via Serghaya [north of Zabadani] to support its positions amid continuous shelling coming from the checkpoints surrounding Zabadani." Wouldn't that indicate that Serghava is either under siege itself, contested, or under gov control? If I am wrong, apologies.

Source say zabadani under siege.Ain hawr should red too92.44.169.34 (talk) 08:40, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 9 September 2014
Eib and Kuraym al Janubi at the same position.

87.117.178.100 (talk) 11:02, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Cannolis (talk) 01:58, 24 September 2014 (UTC)

Extensive parts from Al-Zabadani are under army control
May be I'm outdated but I think the army controlled extensive parts from Al-Zabadani town in fact according by pro Opposition Labrosse maps basically the Entire Al-Zabadani town except very small places on North east of it was under Army control --Pototo1 (talk) 11:17, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Apparently we were somehow wrong. Zabadani is divided, therefore contested. On the other hand from http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2014/09/zabadani-syria-regime-bomb-opposition-rebels.html we have a clear picture of the status. On the other hand Bloudan should go red (probably a skirmish was reported) and also Ain hawr and Serghaya (less obvious, only indirect evidence).Paolowalter (talk) 12:22, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

That city is divided and the SAA is besieging it - What do you guys think about marking Zabadani contested, with a red ring around it? Boredwhytekid (talk) 12:52, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Umm Batinah
Earlier SOHR reported about clashes on Tell Krom, still held by the Syrian army. Now SOHR reports that towns of Mashara (rebel held), Nabe Al Sher (rebel held) and Um Batinah are being bombarded, so maybe this town should go green instead of contested as it's too far away from Tall Krom mountain. You can see the distance on this pro-rebel map.Tall Krom can go just red. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DuckZz (talk • contribs) 10:40, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Also pro opposition source confirmed that rebels still not taken the new city Al Quneitra they are now only aiming for city Al Quneitra. So we need marked him for red dot and put green circle around. www.syriadirect.org/rss/1546-new-update-9-9-14 Hanibal911 (talk) 13:32, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Khattab and Rahbet Khattab army base
According to alalam and NDF offical page saa recapture Khattab and Rahbet Khattab army base but I think we need to wait pro opp. source https://www.facebook.com/alalamarabic/posts/788910577812426 https://www.facebook.com/National.Defence.Forces.NDF/photos/a.434975923224445.97932.434107746644596/721610901227611/?type=1 https://www.facebook.com/National.Defence.Forces.NDF/photos/a.434975923224445.97932.434107746644596/721614414560593/?type=192.44.169.34 (talk) 10:59, 9 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Another source (http://slabnews.com/article/113740)

saa recapture rahbet khattab army base to according to sohr http://www.syriahr.com/index.php?option=com_news&nid=23188&Itemid=2&task=displaynews92.44.169.34 (talk) 12:24, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Maybe my Arabic is just a bit rusty - but, can someone please show me exactly where this link http://syriahr.com/index.php?option=com_news&nid=23188&Itemid=2&task=displaynews#.VA7vBPnHeCN, which has been used to edit Khattab and Rahbet Khattab, mentions either of them? Boredwhytekid (talk) 12:45, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

yes92.44.169.34 (talk) 13:20, 9 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Here pro opposition source confirmed that regime forces backed by fighters from the National Defense took control over Khatab and Rahbat Khatab military base in northwest Hama province from FSA-affiliated rebels and Jabhat a-Nusra. www.syriadirect.org/rss/1546-new-update-9-9-14 Hanibal911 (talk) 13:25, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

I'm not contesting that they both fell to the SAA - it's widely reported and undeniable. Just wondering where that specific source mentioned them Boredwhytekid (talk) 13:26, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Here is another source opposition commander confirms the loss of Khattab .Link is form google but you can read it.Daki122 (talk) 13:27, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

sohr say regime capture khattab - rahbet khttab army base and 2 villages(start with zawr).I think sohr eng will translate in 1-2 hour92.44.169.34 (talk) 13:36, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Since SOHR confirmed that Khittab and Zor al Jadid which are west of Qomhana were taken by government forces, I think it would be correct to change Qomhana to a red icon without besieging by rebels. We won't find in the media that 'the siege of qomhana was lifted' or 'qomhana is not being attacked anymore from the west' but it is something that can be deduced and makes the map more accurate. Hasan Rizvanbegovic (talk) 14:45, 9 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Khattab and Qomhana are separated by a river - taking one does not necessarily roll/threaten the flank of the other, with the exception of an amphibious assault. Besides, reports within the last 24hrs of clashes continuing around Qomhana https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/580388675402808 Boredwhytekid (talk) 14:51, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Shomra?
Can someone locate this town? https://www.facebook.com/syriahroe/posts/580962125345463 Boredwhytekid (talk) 14:22, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Bombardment in the country side of the town so I don't think we should add it as there is no clashes  in the town and it may be only shelling near the Jordanian border against smugglers.Daki122 (talk) 15:32, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Halfaya, Hama
SOHR reports and pro-gov't syrianperspective reports combined were not enough to make Halfaya contested when it was the rebels advancing on the gov't held city. Now Halfaya is rebel held, and has been marked contested based on 1 report from a pro-gov't media outlet.

If/when there is reliable information that Halfaya is contested, there won't be a peep outta me, but c'mon, this is ridiculous. Boredwhytekid (talk) 14:11, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Why Jisr Shugur green for f. sake ?92.44.169.34 (talk) 14:15, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

That.. is also a good question lol Halfaya back to green and Jisr Shugour to red! The map is losing touch with reality.. Boredwhytekid (talk) 14:24, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Agree92.44.169.34 (talk) 14:29, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

I agree with Boredwhytekid. Halfaya green and Jisr Ash Shugur red. No reliable information has emerged that can support any change concerning this topic.Hasan Rizvanbegovic (talk) 14:48, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Not clashes in city Halfaya now government troops continue their advance in the western part of Hama province by moving towards Halfaya, a stronghold of the Syrian Al-Qaeda affiliate the Nusra Front.The Daily Star Hanibal911 (talk) 15:03, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
 * And I also agree with Boredwhytekid in situation about city Jisr Ash Shugur. Here also pro opposition source clear showed that city under army control. Hanibal911 (talk) 15:08, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

I think it's a fair assumption (omg! using a logical assumption in lieu of reports!) that the yahoo report stating Jisr Shughour was rebel held was probably a mistake. Personally I have not been able to locate a single corroborating source - and I imagine that it would have been pretty widely reported. That being said - take note - because, technically speaking, that report is the latest valid source that we possess.. soo.. if we abide to the T by the "rules of the map" instead of using our brains, Jisr Shughour would go green. Boredwhytekid (talk) 16:33, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Jisr Shugur? Are you guys f.ing serious?
Why is jisr shugur green? Only this source say: http://news.yahoo.com/infighting-split-emerges-among-syrian-rebels-172309665.html And I think that is a mistake.Sohr and other pro opp sources never say that rebels capture jisr shugur. Jisr shugur isnt a little village.92.44.169.34 (talk) 07:15, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Obvious vandalism from Alhanuty. Reverted.Paolowalter (talk) 07:50, 9 September 2014 (UTC)


 * If required see the pro-opp map of today http://umap.openstreetmap.fr/fr/map/desyracuse-syria-civil-war-8-september-2014_16140#8/35.704/38.364. Jisr Shugur is red. Paolowalter (talk) 16:54, 9 September 2014 (UTC)

Qunaitra
I want to start a logical discussion in Qunaitra province. As this map shows, it is confirmed that rebels have captured the following areas in the past week:


 * Tell Mall hill
 * Naba al-Sakher
 * Masharah
 * Kafr Nasej
 * Qunaitra crossing

I know that rebels control a LOT more ground than this. Twitter reports, images and video's show rebels in control of at least five more towns, namely:


 * Majduliyah
 * Umm Batinah
 * Mamtinah
 * Al Mal
 * Aqrabah

I know there are no "neutral sources" commenting on this, since the confusion and chaos of the battlefield is still large. So, I want to ask you all from a military perspective: how could rebels possibly take Kafr Nasej without taking towns further west, like Al Mal and Aqrabah? How can rebels take over towns like Naba al-Sakher and Masharah if towns south and west of them are governement controlled? The simple answer is ... they can't. So, as there is proof that these towns are rebel held, we should seriously consider editing this map along a logical line of though. I know this can be seen as a breach of protocal, but there are fewer and fewer neutral reports coming from Syria concerning small towns. The war is simply to complex and dangerous. I suppose we should try as best as we can to make up the situation with logical though along military-strategic lines.

On this region the Insurgents including elements from Al Qaeda are attacking backing by Israeli artillery shelling but you need to link the sources who you have for star to doing the changes who you want to do. --Pototo1 (talk) 20:51, 9 September 2014 (UTC)