Talk:Cottaging/Archive 1

Craig
We have full coverage of the Craig arrest in the Larry Craig article. I suggest we limit the material here to a sentence, just like other listed incidents. I'm not sure that creating a list of famous arrests is a worthwhile goal. ·:· Will Beback ·:· 05:50, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

original research tag
I'm removing this as there seems little to no discussion and that tag rather begs the question of what exactly is disputed. If someone objects please post here what needs to be sourced so others can address the concern if you are not. Benji boi 13:18, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

US Bias
Yet again we see the over arching US cultural imperialism on wiki.

This is an article about a UK term but is littered with US and therefore irrelevant references:

tea rooms - completeley irrelevant to this discussion, in fact the use of this term would prevent the rise of the term 'cottaging'

Stonewall riots - again something that happened in the US and supposedly affected the UK. The Wolfenden report was crucial to UK gay rights and gets no mention at all!!

Your point about universities is completely flawed - in the UK (and many other countries) drinking and entry into bars is allowed below 21. Again you state 'facts' which relate solely to the US and fail to mention (or appreciate) that they do not relate to other countries.

I will edit this as much as I can but perhaps someone with more skill could restore an unbiased status to this article 80.6.147.186 (talk) 13:25, 5 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Rather than accusing of some faceless being of being bias it would be more helpful to do as you suggest you're able - contribute constructively to help restore balance. If cottaging is solely a UK term - it's not - we could speak to it's origin and development. If tea rooms were completely irrelevant - they're not - we can still including them to compare/contrast as appropriate. Hard to believe the Stonewall riots haven't impacted all LGBT people, it's one of the key points of LGBT history but we can certainly also focus on others that have had a connection. And the universities age difference, try to address it. "whereas in the UK punters as young as ____ can legally drink" would perhaps help show the cross-cultural differences. Banj e  b oi   09:12, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

I tried Benji but 'someone' seems terribly keen to subsume UK culture into US references. Last time I looked the US was a separate country and the UK was capable of devloping its own cultural references without needing to rely on the US for justification.

Off to re-edit. 80.6.147.186 (talk) 17:32, 6 August 2008 (UTC)

Edited again!80.6.147.186 (talk) 03:43, 15 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Just to be clear this article is both for cottaging and for tea-rooms and as such needs to represent this subject for the whole of the English-speaking population which is not limited to to even just a few countries. The article needs to be expanded and country-specific information can peacefully co-exist. -- Banj e  b oi   07:07, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Benji I agree with the other poster - this article ISN'T about cottaging & tea rooms, it's about cottaging and therefore the US and Stonewall are not relevant. It seems your determination to include US references is clouding your objectivity: you're now changing the brief to suit your hobby horses.

if you're dertermined (and it seems you are) then i think you should create a separate article on tea rooms, include the stonewall and all the other US-specific stuff in that article and recognise that 'English-speaking' does not have to mean 'American'. I apreciate this is dificult for many Americans to comprehend but it is actually how the World works.

As it's currently written the article is slanted, biased and lacking in focus.83.67.126.86 (talk) 01:46, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

Edited again! Please stop trying to place everything in reference to US culture. It is perfectly possible for something to exist in isolation from the US, i know that's a bit of a shock for some of you but not for the rest of the World!.

By all means create your own page to bang on about Stonewall etc but please stop shoe-horning US references into this article. 80.6.147.186 (talk) 21:39, 16 October 2008 (UTC)
 * This article is about both tea-rooms and' cottaging; perhaps we should simply move it to tea-rooms and move the cottaging material to a subsection? I doubt we need to go there but it's certainly an option. There is no need for two small articles about the same phenomena - all the current content can peacefully co-exist. The article needs to be expanded. -- Banj e  b oi   02:13, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

Pleae stop saying gay liberation started with Stonewall - it may be the case IN AMERICA but to claim it to be the case for the whole world is plainly ridiculous. I think the cliams of US Bias are entirely justified. 'English-speaking' does not have to mean 'American' and numerically Americans are in the minority.

Benji you now seem to be altering the brief to suit your hobby horse. 83.67.126.86 (talk) 01:51, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for assuming good faith, I have done nothing but add content and sources to improve this article. The article is about both cottaging and tea-rooms, aka gay sex in public bathrooms. Stonewall, BTW, is considered the modern spark to the gay rights movement and that's what the article states. That is not imperialism it's helping out readers understand why underage gay boys didn't just go to a youth group for LGBT kids. -- Banj e  b oi   06:09, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

UK vs US
I think in this case people might be jumping the gun a little crying UScentricism on Benji. This phenomenon does not exist solely in the UK, therefor the article should first describe the term and then have a section where it states what it is called in various places.72.221.122.42 (talk) 19:57, 7 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you, I also started Tearoom (disambiguation) as there are multiple tea room definitions as well besides tea house. -- Banj e  b oi   06:13, 4 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Someone has also reverted my own emendation of the definition of the word tea-room to the former and frankly ridiculous derivation from gay tea-dances. In what way are tea-dances related to toilets except insofar as both might be used by gay men? A rather more likely derivation is from T-room as a euphemism for "toilet room", much as the term comfort-room still persists in twee usage.
 * Nuttyskin (talk) 16:01, 15 September 2009 (UTC)