Talk:Cotton-top tamarin/GA2

GA Review
The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.''

Reviewer: Zad68 (talk · contribs) 04:24, 7 March 2013 (UTC)

Continuing the failed GA1 was determined to be questionable, maybe bordering on problematic, so we're going to move to working here on the GA2 area.

Status = PASSED
Impressions after first read-through: what a tremendous improvement. Not a lot to pick on with the prose, so it'll be investigating the sourcing and making sure the article content is reflecting the sources accurately. 03:44, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

Sourcing review complete, see notes below. 04:06, 10 March 2013 (UTC)

Jack, I'm leaning a little harder on you than might be done for other reviews because I'm sure you've got your eye on FA for this article, and I'm sure you can respond to the requests/suggestions. 19:43, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

All items addressed, happy to pass it for GA! Congratulations, nice work. 17:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)

Lead

 * but no reason it couldn't be a bit longer and provide more detail, in my opinion

Behavior

 * Oddly, total care - "Oddly" sounds like editorializing, consider removing
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Still, evidence indicates - "Still" sounds like editorializing, consider changing
 * This is actually what it says in the paper. It was hypothesised but evidence actually indicates it doesn't have an effect. Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * it is unclear whether the cotton-top tamarin acts solely using judgements on reinforcement history. - it would be nice if a source were provided
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 17:02, 12 March 2013 (UTC)


 * This cost-benefit evaluation better equips cotton-top tamarins to form cohesive living units with kin and with foreign tamarins. - it would be nice if a source were provided
 * Removed possible WP:OR. Jack (talk) 17:02, 12 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Some of these forced evictions from the group may also involve spite. Specifically, in evicting subordinate females, a dominant female may be releasing her daughters from the group and putting them in high-risk of predation, while simultaneously losing the cooperative breeding benefit those females would offer when in the group. - it would be nice if a source were provided
 * Removed possible WP:OR. Jack (talk) 17:02, 12 March 2013 (UTC)


 * in high-risk of predation - consider "at high risk of predation"
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Though aggression can occur within groups... - the paragraph starting with this is in the Spite section, are we still talking about spite here? It looks like the subject has switched to response to territorial threats -- ADDING: Can this be fixed by simply changing the section name from Spite to Aggression
 * Renamed to Spite and aggression. Spite is important in the altruism discussion. Jack (talk) 17:02, 12 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Researchers say its repertoire... - consider "Researchers describe its repertoire of 38 distinct sounds as ususually sophisticated..."
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Using this range of vocalizations - needs a comma after
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * emotionality - consider "emotion" or "mood"
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Interestingly, infants are thought to imitate adult speakers - "interestingly" sounds like editorializing, consider removing
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * calling, when in the presence of infants - remove ", when"
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * While it is unclear whether infants are shadowing the calling behavior of adults or if they are comprehending danger remains unclear - "unclear" twice and not grammatically correct, please fix, maybe "Whether infants are shadowing the calling behavior of adults or they are comprehending danger remains unclear."
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * It also performs seemingly altruistic alarm calls - consider "It is also used for"
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * differences in individual's alarm calls. - do you mean "differences in individuals' alarm calls."?
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Despite this research indicating that food calls may be informative - can this single-sentence paragraph be combined with the paragraph before it?
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:21, 12 March 2013 (UTC)

Conservation status

 * and the cotton-top hass - hass -> has
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:06, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * under Appendix I banning - "Appendix I" is a redlink, will it reasonably ever be an article distinct from CITES?
 * ✅ Jack (talk) 12:06, 12 March 2013 (UTC)

Sourcing

 * I'm concerned about what appears to be taking a primary study and generalizing the finding. For example, a primary study of say 20 tamarins in captivity and making a general statement about tamarin behavior.  In some places in the article this appears to be being handled in a way that I'd expect, like "some studies indicate that cotton-top tamarins have the psychological capacity to participate in reciprocally mediated altruism" sourced to a primary study, I'd like you to review to make sure results of individual primary studies aren't being used to make general statements.  I saw that in GA1 and want to make sure it's really fixed.  Or, if it should be OK to do that, explain it to me.
 * Primary sources are allowed when used carefully, and so long as there is WP:NOR. I've tried to introduce secondary sources to all the really general statements, otherwise in the subsections of Communication and Social systems there are primary sources and I believe the text follows their findings accurately and without interpretation. Jack (talk) 18:59, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Other comments on problems with the references:
 * Savage et al., 1988 and Heistermann et al., 1989 For this one and Heistermann, I can only see the abstracts, and they both talk about scents but I don't see the word pheromones, which the article uses. Is that OK? — pheromones are just chemicals that trigger a behavioural response, i.e. the scents they are talking about are pheromones.
 * Washabaugh et al., 2002 I do not see (at least in the abstract) support for article content "and paternal experience with previous infants appears to better prepare infants for social behavior in their first few months of life". — will have a look into this, source isn't exactly saying what text says.
 * marking with a red X until fixed
 * ✅ It now follows the article more closely. Jack (talk) 13:11, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Hauser et al., 2009 Source used in support of idea of mutualism, but mutualism doesn't appear to be mentioned in source. — from the paper: First, identifying cooperators requires an ability to recognize the partner's motivations—do they incur a cost in order to cooperate (altruism) or do they only cooperate when they also benefit (mutualism). The paper, which mentions mutualism four times in relation to cotton-top tamarins, shows from previous experiments that cotton-top tamarins are in the latter camp.
 * Thanks, that was exactly what was needed as I don't think I had access to the full paper
 * Clutton-Brock & Parker, 1995 Possible WP:SYNTH problem with Clutton-Brock? — this is a secondary source reviewing primary literature.
 * Hammerstein, 2003 This document does not mention cotton-top tamarins. — true but I think the article is worded so that it doesn't need to mention them in the source. This reference is backing up the sentence: researchers believe that repeated interactions in a cooperative society ... can heighten the chances that an individual will designate behavioral punishments to others in its group.
 * Current article wording is Further, in captivity these primates are not observed to increase altruistic behavior with fellow primates who are committed fully to cooperation. Based on this, researchers believe that repeated interactions in a cooperative society like that of the cotton-top tamarin can heighten the chances that an individual will designate behavioral punishments to others in its group., trouble is "like that of the cotton-top tamarin", is found in Clutton-Brock but isn't found in Hammerstein. Can this be fixed by simply dropping this phrase?  I'm not going to require a change for GA here but it might need to either be changed or defended at WP:FAC, it's up to you.
 * ✅ I've added another sentence to separate the statements. Jack (talk) 15:41, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Hammerstein, 2003 This document does not mention cotton-top tamarins. — true but I think the article is worded so that it doesn't need to mention them in the source. This reference is backing up the sentence: researchers believe that repeated interactions in a cooperative society ... can heighten the chances that an individual will designate behavioral punishments to others in its group.
 * Current article wording is Further, in captivity these primates are not observed to increase altruistic behavior with fellow primates who are committed fully to cooperation. Based on this, researchers believe that repeated interactions in a cooperative society like that of the cotton-top tamarin can heighten the chances that an individual will designate behavioral punishments to others in its group., trouble is "like that of the cotton-top tamarin", is found in Clutton-Brock but isn't found in Hammerstein. Can this be fixed by simply dropping this phrase?  I'm not going to require a change for GA here but it might need to either be changed or defended at WP:FAC, it's up to you.
 * ✅ I've added another sentence to separate the statements. Jack (talk) 15:41, 12 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Some format and duplicates to fix.
 * ✅ Formatting issues including ISBNs and citation bot errors. Jack (talk) 18:59, 11 March 2013 (UTC
 * super

In this table:
 * Source lists the source as cited in the article
 * Seems WP:RS? means, "Does this source appear to meet WP:RS for reliable sourcing?"
 * Use OK? means, is the source used appropriately in the article? For the review, a few selected sources will be spot-checked to ensure they aren't plagiarized and support the article content.   indicates the source was not spot-checked.
 * Notes will summarize problems found and what needs to be done to fix them