Talk:Crime in Victoria

Creation and merges
As per discussions on the Crime in Australia page and old Crime in Melbourne (now a redirect) pages, this page was created in order to better reflect state crime statistics, police service for the state, etc. It all needs updating and improvement, and more will be added to the Melbourne section over time. See discussions and full history on the Crime in Melbourne redirect and the Crime in Australia pages. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 06:30, 7 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Apex (gang) (now a redirect) was merged into this article as well earlier today. See discussion on that talk page. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 01:32, 10 February 2019 (UTC)

Merger proposal
As part of the previous proposal and clean-up, it is now proposed that Apex (gang) be merged into this article (as Crime in Melbourne no longer exists), probably under the Melbourne section. But first that article needs a major trim. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 06:42, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

archived
I've archived the old talk the page as the content is now completley different & has been reorganised Agnte 14:05, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

Gangland Killings
shouldnt this mention carl williams or tony mokbel? i just noticed it barely mentions organised crime at all.

Hmm something about the CBD, especially around Burke street. 166.205.137.161 (talk) 04:50, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

yes
There should definitely be a lot more on the gangland war - there was over 30 murders!

Ethikos (talk) 13:03, 12 March 2009 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Louisecharmianfaulkner.jpg
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BetacommandBot 22:57, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

"Recent Times"
I have deleted everything within the heading "Recent Times", because the entire section was made up. Cyril Washbrook (talk) 09:26, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

As have I. --A Bothan Spy 10:07, 14 April 2008 (UTC)


 * The same user seems to have come back a couple of times now to restore the fake section. I've reverted it again. Cyril Washbrook (talk) 09:52, 18 April 2008 (UTC)
 * It's back, I will delete it again, anyone able to block 220.236.198.42 from editing? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.58.120.11 (talk) 01:16, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Someone keeps reverting it, please keep an eye out as it's pure fiction (speaking as someone who lives in Melbourne) Adonai-aus- (talk) 00:14, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

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crime
where i the more crime in melbourne. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.246.72.124 (talk) 05:16, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

whitewash
This article seems to imply that melbourne is pretty safe, but it's way too dangerous at night, there's no go zones all over the place. 58.161.69.53 (talk) 14:42, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Your comment does not appear to be in the spirit of editing Wikipedia. If you wish to make a contention like this, you would need very strong source material, which I believe I can safely say, does not exist, because as the article demonstrates, Melbourne is a very safe city.--203.206.164.182 (talk) 11:58, 19 December 2018 (UTC)

Just a note on the update of the homicide figure
The homicide statistic provided in the source material is 167 total homicides for the State of Victoria, for 2014, or 144 for the source here; https://www.crimestatistics.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/embridge_cache/emshare/original/public/2018/09/b0/79227e133/Crime%20Statistics%20Victoria%20-%20year%20ending%20June%202018.pdf

This gives a homicide rate of 2.4-2.8 for the state. The CNN article claims a 'murder' rate of 3.1 for the year, but this is clearly incorrect, as murders only account for around half the homicides in the Victorian courts.--203.206.164.182 (talk) 11:56, 19 December 2018 (UTC)


 * As far as I can see, the rate given on p.12 in the cited source is 2.9% (and some of the other figures don't correlate either); however, this is all out of date information now and I'll be updating it with later stats when I have time, with the citation to match. There's no point in providing figures that vary from the source cited, without providing a new citation. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 08:04, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

Proposed merge and general improvement
This page has a lot wrong with it and I intend to review it along with all of the other Crime in Australia-related articles... but as a first step proposing to merge Apex (gang), which I don't believe meets WP:N and needs trimming of a lot of the unnecessary detail. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 06:58, 26 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support, the page is neglected and all over the shop. Bacondrum (talk) 07:35, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Okay Bacondrum - the first stage of this merge is complete. Most of the material in the old Melbourne article actually relates to the whole state anyway, but Crime in Victoria is very out of date (more discussion there). Laterthanyouthink (talk) 06:19, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

Comment on new page changes
Hi. I didn't realise that you had started working on this page and I started doing some rearranging a short while ago, which I think got lost, but no matter. I'm busy working on several other projects at the moment, so I'll let you get on with this one. With getting rid of the Apex article, we lost some categories, which may want to be considered/discussed again once work is finished. FYI I'll copy and paste here:African Australian; Anti-immigration politics in Oceania; Crime in Melbourne; Ethnic groups in Australia; Racism in Australia; White nationalism in Australia.

Just one additional comment: I don't think that those individual crimes need to be given such prominence with high-level headings - and directions to the main articles need to be given using the template. Crime in Victoria should be an overview, not a list of individual crimes. And I think they were all in Melbourne, so all under the Melbourne heading?

Anyway, I'll come back to it another time, when you've completed your changes. Cheers. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 01:47, 10 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Yes, indeed I've been stuffing around. I'll give it a crack and we can whittle it down as we go. I've added some of the worst massacres of Aboriginal Victorians as it seems right to mention something of these horrific crimes. Bacondrum (talk) 02:19, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * It's getting into shape slowly. Good one about the Aboriginal massacres - I had had that in mind (and will include others in the other states eventually). But maybe put Melbourne below that section? And if all of those on the list under section 4 actually refer to things that happened in greater Melbourne, then maybe that heading should become a sub-heading under it? (I don't know what if anything may be added for anywhere else in Victoria, but I'm just looking at keeping it logical!). Laterthanyouthink (talk) 05:55, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Hey filled out the lede and added a section about mafia in the Mallee (section needs work still). Moved the Melbourne section to head the notable crime and figures section. Feels like a more complete articel now, needs a fair bit of work and I'm sure my work needs plenty of editing still...I was thinking a section on the increasing rural drug use would be a good addition.

Gave it a serious crack, I'm gonna leave it alone for a while now. Bacondrum (talk) 02:00, 11 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I can't shift my focus now - too much else on the go (and could be a while yet) - but I had a quick look. Well done, it's shaping up nicely! Laterthanyouthink (talk) 06:28, 11 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I came across this article the other day - could be a useful source (apart from the stats themselves cited in it) and I don't think used as yet. (Still busy on other things, although have got a couple of the other state crime mergers done in between.) Laterthanyouthink (talk) 07:43, 19 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Nice one, I'll give it a proper read when I get some time. Looks very useful indeed. Bacondrum (talk) 21:36, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Infobox Crime Statistics numbers
Not sure what the consensus of wikipedia is, but the infobox for crime in victoria is using numbers from CSA - https://www.crimestatistics.vic.gov.au/crime-statistics/latest-victorian-crime-data/recorded-offences-2 general categories rather than the individual sections

Per Infobox (prior to my edits)

Crime rates* (2019)

Violent crimes

Homicide	3.3

Rape	219.4

Robbery	48.0

The table in the main article correctly titles the sections eg "Homicide and related offences " and "Sexual offences" in reality the 2019 data was ( https://www.crimestatistics.vic.gov.au/crime-statistics/latest-victorian-crime-data/recorded-offences-2 - Section T1 Per 100k )

The actual statistical breakdown for 2019 is as follows

A10 Homicide and related offences per 100k - (total 2.8) - no idea where the 3.3 came from


 * A11 Murder - .7


 * A12 Attempted murder - .4


 * A14 Manslaughter & A13 Accessory/ conspiracy to murder - .2


 * A15 Driving causing death - 1.4

A30 Sexual Offences - Total 203.8 (again i cant see where the 219.4 figure came from)


 * A31 Rape - 63.7


 * A32 Indecent assault - 100.8


 * A33 Incest - 7.1


 * A34 Sexual offences against children - 24.1


 * A39 Other sexual offences - 8.1

As such im going to edit the infobox to reflect the A31 stats for Rapes, and in order to be cautious on homicides insert the correct stat for 2019 A10 Homicide and related officers number of 2.8, however it would be worth working out which of those offence subcategories actually fall into the wikipedia definition of "homicide" to create a standard going forward - the main article seems to be https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate which would then exclude, manslaughter, attempted murder (which i think should be excluded for sure) and driving causing death (which is more or less vehicular manslaughter in victorian law)

2403:5801:10B7:0:B58A:EC3D:DDE5:C9E1 (talk) 08:28, 21 June 2022 (UTC)