Talk:Croft-on-Tees

Born and bred
The sentence The 1861 Epsom Derby winner Kettledrum was born at Croft in 1858 was changed to ... was bred at ... with edit summary "animals are bred". Actually, animals are both bred and born. Breeding is when you put the sire to the dam and they mate; birth is when the live animal appears. These obviously do not have to be in the same town. However I don;t see a reliable source cited for either event. Cusop Dingle (talk) 07:28, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * added the reference which I used for the Kettledrum article: sorry it's a book. I used "born" rather than bred as I thought it would be clearer for the general reader. I get told off for using too many specialist terms and I sometimes over-compensate. In terms of Racehorses "bred" is used for the place a horse was born (or foaled) regardless of the where the conception took place: see for example Pont l'Eveque (horse) who was conceived in France but is always considered British bred because he was born there. It's also the case that the horse's official "breeder" is whoever owns the mare at the time of birth, regardless of whether they had anything to do with arranging the mating (covering): see Pinza. Tigerboy1966 (talk) 10:04, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I think "born" is a perfectly good word for the birth of a foal. Cusop Dingle (talk) 12:09, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Re "born" or "bred" - I'm not particularly exercised over this, so revert if there is a strong feeling against "bred". I feel that "born" is a tad sentimental for an encyclopedia when referring to animals, and that not-so-specialist term "bred" is understood by the average non-specialist reader to be synonymous with "born". As a general point, when we see "born and bred" it would be something different again, implying that "bred" could be "where brought up", which might be different place to birth. Interesting. Acabashi (talk) 15:51, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * "born" is a tad sentimental for an encyclopedia when referring to animals. Would "animals" include Homo Sapiens?. And yes it is very odd that "bred" has become a synonym for "brought up". I would usually always bow to usage, but in this case a useful distinction appears to have been lost. I suspect that this results from a misunderstanding of working class British English usage by ignorant University types. Tigerboy1966 (talk) 16:22, 26 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Did that last sentence add anything to the discussion? I ask as one of those "ignorant University types".  Cusop Dingle (talk) 16:45, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 12:27, 29 April 2016 (UTC)