Talk:Culture of Sweden/Archive 1

Swedes=Elves?
the part in the music section about how swedish people are comparable to elves seems sort of strange, especially considering many readers will not pick up on the reference to elves (tolkien's elves), because people often associates elves with the tiny 'Keebler Elf' type. It also sounds pretty dumb.

Bergman
"Ingmar Bergman, whose father was a harsh vicar, had his share of the dogmatic protestantism which outlined Sweden in the 19th century. His life was filled with shame and deceptions and a dreary sense of lonely void. What better designates the artist? He made an impact on the world with his gloomy film and the Swedish nature which is very pretty sometimes." (emphasis mine)

The wording in this part is fairly odd but the bold part really takes the prize, perhaps it needs to be reworded? --81.236.13.188 16:16, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

-Wow! This one had a golden raspberry waiting for it. if there were one for film criticism. Honestly, the simplistic equation of Bishop Vergerus and other harsh people with Bergman's father and so on seems very widespread, you see it all the time on the forums relating to Bergman on imdb. I'll be making a few references in apppropriate places to point out that Bergman's dramatizations, while masterful, are also the grandchildren of Strindberg and Ibsen (Vergerus is a pretty obvious descendant of Rev. Brand in Ibsen's play).

There should also be some outline of the style and character of Swedish moviemaking after Bergman.Strausszek October 2, 2006

I'd like to see this article describe life in Sweden the way the Culture of the United States describes life in the US.

--142.163.130.240 20:27, 10 August 2005 (UTC)

Yes agreed. The current article gives little real feeling of Sweden. I will try to work on this article.--BrorMartin 21:31, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

We need to write more more more about Swedish literature, poetry and painting.

--Fred-Chess 13:04, 19 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Rinkeby Swedish is not a pidgin, if you would go by the definition in the Wikipedia article, it's got more in common with street Ebonics or Spanglish than it has with true pidgins. If you're talk about rap songs by The Latin Kings, Ken Ring, Advance Patrol etc, which is what most people in Sweden think about when they hear the word, they neither have "rudimentary grammar" (though it could be argued it is "simpler" than Standard Swedish) nor "restricted vocabulary". I'd say it could be a sociolect, code switching, register (sociolinguistics), dialect, slang vernacular etc, but not a true pidgin, especially since many speakers often know Swedish better than the languages it's been mixed up with, due to living in the Swedish culture. Opinions about the exact definition may differ, though...

Music
The section on music is in serious need of editing. For one thing, music is definitely not Sweden's largest export product - whoever wrote this has absolutely no knowledge of economics. -User:Julian

Absolutely correct criticism. Swedish music export has at times been the third highest in the world, and likely exceptional per capita, but nowhere near to being the number one source of exports. In addition, not mentioning Birgit Nilsson among the opera singers is outrageous. --Johan L 23:12, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

drinking history
should put this somewhere soon, or a portion of it...

Very stringent liquor laws have been in force in Sweden as well as Norway for many years. With a few exceptions, the provisions of the law correspond exactly to those in force in some of the New England States. Parishes may prohibit the sale of spirits entirely, or according to the vote of the people limit its sale to one or two establishments, which are required to pay either a high fixed license, or to turn in to the public treasury all profits over five per cent. This last is the system which prevails in many of the Swedish towns, and particularly in the large cities, under the name of the Göteborg, or Gothenburg system, so called from having been first tried in the town of that name. The plan consists essentially in the letting out of the liquor stores by time local authorities, usually to a company, which undertakes to pay over all proceeds to the authorities, after deducting the five per cent. interest for itself. The special purpose of the Gothenburg system is to take away from the retail liquor seller all temptation to “make custom” by encouraging drunkenness; but there seems to be some question whether the plan works as well as it is expected to, even when combined with such further restrictive regulations as the requirement that in certain cases the customer shall eat before he drinks, or a limitation in the amount of liquor to be sold to one person. But wine, beer, and porter are usually not included in these restrictions; and though private stills are not prohibited, private drinking is not controlled. The Gothenburg system does not, therefore, prevent or abolish time evil; but it is nevertheless a wholesome check upon intemperance. The parishes around Siljan Lake have suffered greatly in past times from the prevalemice of intoxication and no one of them is a liberal license system in vogue.

As may have been gathered from preceding pages, the chief recreation and entertainment of the Dalecarlians is churchgoing. Open - air meetings and parish


 * From "Dalecarlia", Harper's new monthly magazine. Volume 67, Issue 401, October 1883. p. 681

Fred-Chess 04:08, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

Some Comments
I read this on a whim. This article at times appears that it was written by some Swedish tourist board or pro-Sweden advocacy group, lol. I am sure Swedish culture is wonderful, but this article seems pretty biased if you ask me. For instance, the blanket statement that Swedish literature is, "active and vibrant," is very subjective, unreferenced, and pretty much a cliche. Comparing Swedes to elves is plain silly. The tone of the article as introduced by the first sentence is too relaxed and not factual enough.

Another poster had a very good idea; using the same format as the author of the American culture entry would be very beneficial. co94 March 22, 2006

What about computers and internet? Is it popular in that country? How many ppl use it? And... ADSL or another connection type? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.9.80.247 (talk) 02:13, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

Not very 'Jante'
Whatever happened to the Swedish idea of we are no better than anyone else? This article is absurdly nationalistic. The description of racial characteristics is pushing it, and the general claims about film, literature, etc., are by in large exagerrations. There is hardly a mention of classical music, painting, poetry, and other forms of artistic expression. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.13.249.98 (talk • contribs) 18 April 2006.
 * I agree. Terrible article. Claiming that swedish music is defined by a " a melodic happy-music of purity and innocence" is based on a biased selection error, and is not true to my own perception of who we are (indeed, I would argue that swedes in general are quite a bit more somber than most culture). The swedish music that has been internationally successful is positive, because that is the kind of music that tends to become successful. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Victronizor (talk • contribs) 9 May 2006.
 * Agree. Awful quality overall. --Johan L 23:14, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

I love this article--71.236.169.89 06:50, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

Architecture
There also should be nolted, that the houses on the countryside are extremely(!) uniform. (I dont know if this is right for the whole of sweden, but around stockholm it's extreme. All the houses are same style. they look nice indeed, but it's extreme how standardized they are. --217.162.144.131

Non-intellectual?
The first line here states that Swedish culture is "non-intellectual". Ouch, is that fair? I'm a non-Swede, but I'd be pretty annoyed if that was the wikipedia comment on my country!

Fair use rationale for Image:The Seventh Seal poster.png
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If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 06:44, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:7sealpost.jpg
Image:7sealpost.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 08:13, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Why the fuck is this circlejerk wankfest of an article allowed to exist
delete imo
 * If a concept is interesting, it's better trying to improve it. 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 01:33, 5 November 2008 (UTC)
 * It badly needs to be replaced, or rewritten from top to bottom.Strausszek (talk) 10:41, 9 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Apparently somebody took pity on the inane state it was in back in 2006/07 but this still isn't a good or balanced article.Strausszek (talk) 03:04, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

On the issue of serfdom
Regarding:

"Sweden never had serfdom and peasant smallholders traditionally had a greater say in the nation's affairs than in virtually any other Western country."

From my experience of having lived and worked in Sweden this is pure moonshine. First, about serfdom {defined as sharecropping by landless peasants}. It wasn't outlawed in Sweden until 1945. As to peasants having had a "greater say", forget it. The state kept a firm grip on the peasantry for centuries through the Swedish Lutheran Church {of which I am a member in good standing}. Right up through the beginning of the 20th century monthly church attendance, regardless of how remote your parish church might have been was mandatory. IIRC, there was a fine for non-compliance and it went on your parish record. Priests kept records on the inhabitants of their parish and had, if you wanted a passport, to give you a clean bill of moral and legal health before it would be issued by Stockholm. Not to put too fine a point on it, the Swedish Lutheran Church filled pretty much the same role as the KGB did in the old Soviet Union.

Most people are unaware as well that beheading with an axe for capital crimes was only abolished at the beginning of the 20th century.

Please don't take any of this as criticism of either Sweden or the Swedish people who I respect and admire greatly. What it does tell you is that the 20th century saw an awesome social revolution, the more amazing for being pretty much though not totally bloodless, that gives us the society we see today. Plaasjaapie (talk) 03:06, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Social control doesn't equate serfdom or slavery. Would you rank the mandatory reciting of the pledge of allegiance in U.S. schools as a remnant of slavery or "thought control" because it requires pupils and students to express their faith in America and in a certain set of values (including belief in a personal God)? Lots of countries have made, in practice, demands on its citizens to attend church unless they had very specific reasons not to. Besides, by the later 19th century in Sweden the church had no legal or policiary power to enforce attendance. Which is why free denominations, Pentecostalist, Methodist, Salvation Army and others, began sprouting.

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Very poor article still
Despite complaints for over 10 years now, this is still a very bad article, riddled with unsourced praise of Sweden by Swedes, and devoid of an extensive amount of information that would/could/should be highly relevant. I've tried today to point out and adjust a few of the problems especially in the lede. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 12:17, 22 September 2017 (UTC)

Recent IP edits
I support recent edits by IP user 90.227.13.232 which removed unsourced pro-Swedish propaganda in rather gross violation of WP:NPOV. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 23:19, 7 February 2018 (UTC)
 * SergeWoodzing, you habe done a good clean up here. Thanks. (Shellback is also Swedish and agreat song writer, but we can not write them all... I was his teacher some times. So I just wanted to say that because Im proud to see him here) Adville (talk) 19:28, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
 * By me and by at least one English Wikipedia administrator, you have been asked never to "ping" me, and I have also asked you never to mention me at all, anywhere, if not needed. It was not needed here. Try depersonalizing your article talk page comments. Everything is much more constructive on article talk pages if we depersonalize them as much as we can, and on English Wikipedia, where we have these excellent guidelines, people are much more used to depersonalized entries on article talk pages than on Swedish Wikipedia. Example:
 * The recent clean-up here was good. (Shellback is also Swedish and agreat song writer, but we can not write them all... I was his teacher some times. So I just wanted to say that because Im proud to see him here)
 * - if you had worded your comment like that; I would have been able to fully appreciate it. I still wouldn't have thanked you here (for reasons given) but you can be sure I would have thanked you through edit history. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 19:43, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
 * No comments. No need to say when someone does something good. Do not worry that was last time I tell you, which is a pity cos you do much good too. Adville (talk) 20:14, 9 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Again, I recommend sincerely: try depersonalizing your article talk page comments. I have learned how to do that and I try very hard to stick to the guideline's "comment on content, not on contributors". I think everyone who learns it likes it, and I honestly think you would too. We don't need to know, on talk pages, who does what to an article as long as what's done is constructive. --SergeWoodzing (talk) 20:35, 9 February 2018 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 13:06, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Anders Zorn - Självporträtt i rött (1915).jpg