Talk:Cyclone Jasmine

Merge?
The article is very MH heavy, but it doesn't establish any sort of importance or notability. It just says the storm caused some winds on Vanuatu that caused "some damage". No mentions of deaths, quantifiable damage, whatnot. --♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 19:47, 28 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Why was this merged without consensus? I reverted the merge per WP:BRD. After a huge fight on IRC, that including argument on both sides that were IMO invalid. In all, it appears that the storm was notable, and can be expanded, but now that it is merged, I don't see any point in it coming back. I have three main concerns.

1) WPTC needs to work around these issues, during the glory days on the project that is what we did and it worked. We need to continue about it, and when such a debate must occur, we need to be rational and stay on topic (which I thought we went a little off topic today about other bad WP articles).

2) I don't want merging to be the lazy way out of expanding an article, which leads to basis and freaky discussions on both sides. For one, we should focus on what the storm did, not whether or not an article sucks. We've been doing a good job the past year or so on this until like a few weeks ago, maybe because even most bad articles do list the death/damage total and not much else (i.e. actual damage).

3) IMO don't merge any article without on-wiki discussion. Merging is a controversial process at WPTC, so the odds of one being without objection are somewhat slim.

Back to Jasmine, I belive the storm is notable to get an article, so this storm should never drum up any other major issues. YE  Pacific   Hurricane  21:39, 3 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Please to explain to me how a storm that killed one person and caused flooding and downed some power lines is notable. Even if we tried our best to keep this article, it would be extremely MH-weighted. TropicalAnalystwx13 (talk) 21:53, 3 June 2012 (UTC)
 * That is more than enough. Most TC's, in particular in the EPAC and SPAC, do not do that and would satisfy WP:N. And what's wrong with an MH wieghted article, thousands of articles on WP are like that, most of their info is in one section. YE  Pacific   Hurricane  22:06, 3 June 2012 (UTC)

First of all YE, there was no consensus to keep the article. There were no objections, so it was merged. It wasn't controversial, and no content was lost. It doesn't matter if the article can be expanded (and it's more likely an article will be expanded if it is merged, see Hurricane Charley (1986), Hurricane Barbara (1953), and Cyclone Alby). An article is judged how it currently is before it is merged. It's not being lazy, it's simply moving the content from one poorly-done article to another area. We should certainly be focusing on the article. If someone feels like making it a good article, they can, but no one had done so. It wasn't controversial, it was simply procedural. --♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 01:28, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * If three people objected on IRC and one person reverted the first merge, then yes it was controversial. I don't think if an article was merged, people would be more likely to expand it, there are many instances where a proposed merger was saved (i.e. Hurricane Katia (2011), Hurricane Danielle (2010), Hurricane Hernan (1996). My point was that merging should be done if there are no ways to improve the article. Hink, are there any other articles that you feel are in the same boat as this? YE  Pacific   Hurricane  14:11, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * We don't operate based on IRC, and yes, per the examples I gave, if a storm is truly notable enough, it would get an article regardless and it'd end up being better. It's well known in the project that articles that are newly-made get a lot of work on them, and are typically of better quality than an existing start-class article. Merging this article improves Wikipedia - it adds some more content to the main article, and it eliminates a stub-class article. ♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 14:27, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * As long as bad articles on fairly notable storms (like Hurricane Tina (1992) or Hurricane Adrian (1999)) do not get merged, I am happy. YE  Pacific   Hurricane  14:48, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, I wouldn't compare Adrian to Jasmine. Adrian is well-sourced and has a lot of info, both in the MH and in the Impact section. ♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 14:56, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Hurricane Debby (1988) may be a better compariosn, then. Anyway, I think it is sate to call this issue . YE  Pacific   Hurricane  22:07, 4 June 2012 (UTC)

Todo?
I thought the article was close to A-class, but Jason Rees said it was nowhere close. What does it need then? ♫ Hurricanehink ( talk ) 15:28, 18 January 2013 (UTC)
 * It needs to flow better and have the numerous mistakes corrected, it also needs to note when it became a cat 3 STC since thats more important than a 2. It also needs to note when it moved in and out of te tropics (TCWC Wellingtons AOR).Jason Rees (talk) 15:34, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

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