Talk:Daf Yomi

Definition of daf
I have a question as a non-Jewish person that could help clarify the page -- the article repeatedly refers to "learning" a daf, and I'm not clear exactly on what that means. Does it just mean read? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.30.86.205 (talk) 14:32, 22 April 2016 (UTC)


 * You are right, for some reason the definition of the term was listed as a ref. I have removed the ref tag to show the definition in the lead. Thanks -  Galatz Talk  19:47, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

Mishna Verurah
Please, it's Mishnah Berurah. Pedantism not allowed. 21:43, 6 July 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2604:2000:9085:B800:E426:2CF0:C863:8AAE (talk)

Criticism of Daf Yomi
This article is not written from a neutral point of view, in violation of Wikipedia policies. Instead, it is written from an Ashkenazi Orthodox Jewish point of view. Most Jewish people in the world are not Orthodox Jews; and there are many Jewish ethnic groups that are not Ashkenazi. Ashkenazi Jews are Eastern European - but there are also Maghrebi (North African) Jews; Sephardic Jews (Spain and Portuguese), and Mizrachi Jews (from the middle-east/Arab nations.) In particular, this article needs an explanation of the criticism aimed at Daf Yomi. There are pedagogical reasons why many Jewish rabbis and Talmud teachers are unhappy with this program. See for instance. Orthodox by Design: Judaism, Print Politics, and the ArtScroll Revolution, pages 198-199. By Jeremy Stolow
 * Nothing wrong with adding criticism, however you first of all need a WP:RS to support your claims. Second the only place something like that should be is not in the lead. -  Galatz Talk  14:40, 31 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Read that post again. They mentioned a book by Jeremy Stolow and even the exact pages. That and the article Fintor linked to should be a good start. --109.40.131.2 (talk) 13:25, 22 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Interesting article: The Wrong Way to Study the Talmud “Does speed-reading a double page in Aramaic and Hebrew every day actually constitute serious Jewish learning?” Fintor (talk) 11:44, 3 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that one! --109.40.131.2 (talk) 13:25, 22 March 2021 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://archive.is/20130415041722/http://www.jta.org/news/article/1999/11/30/12522/Celebrationofdaily to http://www.jta.org/news/article/1999/11/30/12522/Celebrationofdaily
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20120625103239/http://www.nesivos.com/index.php/siyum-hashas-lublin-2 to http://www.nesivos.com/index.php/siyum-hashas-lublin-2/
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When was Shekalim changed
The article states that " (For the first cycle, there were only 2,702 pages of Talmud on the schedule; later leading Rabbis increased it to 2,711,[18] changing the edition used for Tractate Shekalim, taken from the Jerusalem Talmud, to one with more pages.)" The source cited is "Shlomi, B. 'The Historic First Siyum HaShas'. Hamodia Magazine, 10 May 2012, pp. 12–13."

For years I had believed this to mean that only the first cycle had 2,702 and that the change was made for the second Siyum. After I re-read this statement today, I realized that the wording could also mean that the change was made at some unspecified point after the first cycle and I tried to see which was correct. While I could find many mentions of the change from 2,702 to 2,711 pages being related to the version used of Shekalim (Tractate), I couldn't find anything to confirm the precise timing. So I had an idea and figured out a way to possibly deduce the timing: just calculate the number of days between each Siyum. Much to my surprise, it seems that the old Shekalim was in place for the first several cycles, well past the first cycle. Here's my data:


 * 0 - September 11, 1923 (start of first cycle)
 * 1 - (Mon) February 2, 1931 --> 2,701 (which is one day short, because there was no Siyum 0)
 * 2 - (Mon) June 27, 1938 --> 2,702
 * 3 - (Mon) November 19, 1945 --> 2,702
 * 4 - (Mon) April 13, 1953 --> 2,702
 * 5 - (Tue) September 5, 1960 --> 2,702
 * 6 - (Mon) January 30, 1968 --> 2,703
 * 7 - (Mon) June 23, 1975 --> 2,701
 * 8 - (Sun) November 14, 1982 --> 2,701
 * 9 - (Thu) April 26, 1990 --> 2,720
 * 10 - (Sun) September 28, 1997 --> 2,712
 * 11 - (Tue) March 1, 2005 --> 2,711
 * 12- (Wed) August 1, 2012 --> 2,710
 * 13- (Sat) January 4, 2020 --> 2,712

Note that when I refer to Siyum N, I mean Cycle N, which is the one that took place from the day after Siyum N-1 to the day of Siyum N.

There are some trivial variations (probably based on the Siyum date falling on Shabbat), but it's clear that Siyums 1 to 7 where made based on a 2,702-page cycle, while Siyums 10 to 13 had a 2,711-page cycle. Siyum 9 was 2,720 days, which seems rather odd but could be an adjustment made to catch up and perhaps the change in Shekalim was made for Siyum 8, but it could have been done in time for Siyum 9. Note that 2,702 is divisible by 7, so it's no surprise that six of the first eight Siyums were on Monday, while the other two were either a day before (Siyum 8) or a day after (Siyum 5).

This source provides an introduction to Shekalim and cites the shift from a 13-daf version to the current 22-daf in use today, This source states that "Incidentally, this phenomenon explains the mysterious "lengthening" of the Dafyomi cycle in the eighth cycle (which began in June of 1975/5735). Rav Meir Shapiro's original calendar was tailored to a 13-Daf-long Maseches Shekalim. When that edition became uncommon, the cycle was changed to accommodate the 22-Daf version of the Vilna edition, effectively lengthening the Dafyomi cycle from 2702 days to 2711 days."

That source is extremely useful, but I'm still not sure when Shekalim was changed? It certainly wasn't after the first Siyum, but was it for Siyum 8 or Siyum 9? What's the story with the 2,720 days for Siyum 9?

Any thoughts on pinning down the timing? I ping, , , , and , who are active editors among those who have edited the article and are responsible for the majority of the edits and content of the two articles. Alansohn (talk) 02:54, 7 January 2021 (UTC)
 * See https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/headlines-breaking-stories/501896/the-slavuta-shas.html, which says 1975 after the 7th cycle. I have changed the article accordingly. Dovidroth (talk) 15:49, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

Non-Ashkenazi Daf Yomi?
It is obvious to anyone who has read this article that the idea comes from Ashkenazi Jews, but yet I have to ask. Are there any Daf Yomi classes led by Yemenite, Sephardi, or other non-Ashkenazi Jews? All sites (including this article′s link section) and YouTube lessons I found imply there aren′t, but maybe I just missed something. Does anybody know better? --109.40.131.2 (talk) 13:25, 22 March 2021 (UTC)