Talk:Dane-zaa

Untitled
Where does the name Tasttine come from? It should probably be Tsattine, but since in any case this looks like a phonetically corrupt anglicization of an Athabascan word (the tt presumably reflects a glottalized /t/), I can't be sure whether this is a typo or a correct rendering of an English mis-hearing. Bill 07:59, 6 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Corrected. kwami (talk) 23:42, 19 November 2008 (UTC)

Currently language-focussed bit-more-than-stub, needs separation for language/people, as well as full writeup. Skookum1 - 9 May 06 [moved from /Comments subpage]

Ethno, language, government split
What is the appropriate name for the languaeg article - Dunneza language or Beaver language - "most widely known" although aboringinal preferences do play into it; the idea is that the ethno/people part of this article gets categorized separately from the language part, and both from the government part; e.g. "FN governments in Alberta" is not appropriate on a page with linguistics info or such, and certain Dunneza governments are in BC and others are in AB. I can do a rough split when I have the energy, but I'd like to get the language-article name right before I start.Skookum1 (talk) 04:15, 6 July 2008 (UTC)

Most common usage? - move/rename
When did this get changed to Danezaa and why? "Dunneza" is easily the most common modern usage, or rather most common p.c. modern usage, as "Beaver (tribe)" is preponderantly more in wide use because of older documents (including in the cites...). In BC Dunneza is also an official name of the tribal organization and the spelling they use.....is this an Alberta spelling, or a "new p.c. ism" like Sin Aikst vs Sinixt? Justifications please, and citations to say why the "Danezaa" spelling - which I've never seen before- should have "bumped" "Dunneza"....Skookum1 (talk) 00:05, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I see the RBMC link uses the "Danezaa" spelling...I wonder if it's used in their sources. Because of the name of the Dunneza First Nation, unless there's a reason to use Danezaa to do with an Albertan usage, "most common usage" should apply, and also the "grandfathering" because of use in an official name (which the RBCM usage is not; that's not authored by the museum only sponsored by it and they're not government anyway, they're actually private enterprise...).  I see there's been no name change, not that I can find a move log for, so I must be mistaken about this title having been Dunneza - which is I note nonetheless found in the text, and of course teh cites.Skookum1 (talk) 04:06, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I note Dunneza language already uses that spelling, which rather predicates that that should be the title.Skookum1 (talk) 04:17, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Oh, that's a redirect to Dunneza which is a redirect to Danezaa.....sigh....Skookum1 (talk) 04:18, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
 * OK, this is in the same line as the Oji-Cree language discussion. Though linguists would prefer "Beaver" as in the case of the ISO-3 code being bea, I think as this is en.wiki and the population is in Canada, the solution of using the Canadian Oxford Dictionary as the basis of the article title would be the least controversial, provided we have all the appropriate redirects. BTW, I see this latest move have created many, double redirects, and the language article redirects and the peoplehood article redirects all come to this article. CJLippert (talk) 04:54, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I can't access the Cdn Oxford online, so wouldn't know what it has. I checked the Canadian Encyclopedia, which I don't consider authoritative in the slightest and quite frankly which I've found has allkinds of egregious errors, and it says:
 * ''Beaver are Athapaskan-speaking people of the PEACE RIVER area of BC and Alberta. They were called Beaver by early explorers, after the name of a local group, the tsa-dunne, and call themselves Dunneza ("real people") in BC or Dene dháa in Alberta. In 1996 there were about 2250 registered Beaver in Canada. Before contact there may have been more than 1000 in an area of about 194 250 km2.
 * In other words, they use Beaver. Now, given that Dunneza seems to be a BC spelling and there's a different one in Alberta, and true to BC-form there's more than one BC spelling (Danezaa - which btw most googles for come up as Dane-zaa with a hyphen) we've got one of those little soups made of chopped orthographies; like Ktunaxa/Kutenai/Kitunahan and the differing spellings of Sto:lo and St'at'imc/Stl'atl'imx and Songish/Songhees/Lekwungen and Sinixt/Sin Aikst we've got a judgement call to make - there's a bunch more of these, like Lekwiltok/Legwildok/Laich-kwil-tach/Yuculta/Euclataws (all theoretically the same word...).  As far as the ISO code thing goes that may be entirely appropriate for the language - note Nlaka'pamux vs Thompson language, Secwepemc vs Shuswap language....can't remember how Skwxwu7mesh vs Squamish language got solved, think it's a compromise ]Skwxweu7mesh language, and in some cases even the people-name is in "the English form" - Okanagan people and Okanagan language as "Siylx" isn't widely known and not used in the media, whereas the others are...so whichever of Dunneza/Danezaa/Dene dhaa gets settled on, the language article can still be Beaver language.  BTW I've been wondering about converting St'at'imcets language to Lillooet language precisely because of the ISO thing, and because of the differing spelling systems; and the fact that the Lower Lillooet refer to the language as Ucwalmicwts as "St'at'imcets" is a place-reference to the area of Lillooet town (and they also use the old Stl'atl'imx spelling).  Not as complicated with Halkomelem and Kwak'wala as both of those terms have become current in regional English.....anyway sorry to ramble, like always, just trying everything on for comparison.  I'll actually poll User:Billposer who's head of the Yinka Dene Language Institute in Vanderhoof and ask for his input.....Skookum1 (talk) 14:34, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

[undent]PS thanks for fixing my typos/dysgraphias; I've gotten sloppy in my old age and my eyes are going at the same time keyboards seem to be getting smaller for my big hands...; I catch most, but not all, sorry you had to correct them....and thanks for your patience with my semi-literacy.Skookum1 (talk) 14:38, 20 November 2008 (UTC)

Your Attention
The page Danezaa is tribe page. But, Danezaa language is not separate. It should be given in a separate page. See Turkish version Danezaca Kmoksy (talk) 04:40, 8 April 2010 (UTC)

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