Talk:Dark Side of the Moon (disambiguation)

What does "dark" mean?
The article currently claims that "dark side of the moon" refers "to the lunar hemisphere that is not currently lit by the sun. It is not the same as the far side of the Moon, the side that is permanently turned away from the Earth." This seems wrong to me. Specifically, I think it's a revisionist spin on the phrase by people who are unfamiliar with the use of the word "dark" to mean "hidden" or "unknown". Until the 1960s, nobody had ever seen the far side of the moon. So it was dark, in that sense.

I'm not going to edit the article to say this, though, because I don't have a citation for it. I notice that there's no citation for the current interpretation. I'll add a fact tag. Hopefully somebody can come up with a reliable source either way. — Preceding unsigned comment added by TypoBoy (talk • contribs) 21:18, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I too would be suspicious of any claim that the phrase "dark side of the moon" as conventionally used refers to the part of the moon which is instantaneously unlit; however, like you, I've been unable to find any material on this. Ché (talk) 20:14, 18 August 2011 (UTC)


 * I agree with this. This article is fundamentally wrong, I'm afraid. I think I'll fix it.  james gibbon  15:03, 25 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Three new moons have passed. Some other researcher can perhaps do better, but my searches for the phrase "dark side of the moon" has found only (1) references to the Pink Floyd album and (2) self-conscious uses of the phrase in a world where there is a famous Pink Floyd album by that name. In other words, people are either talking about the album or punning on its name. Before we can decide whether pre-Floyd uses of the phrase meant dark as in hidden or dark as in unlit, we must find pre-Floyd uses of the phrase. Anybody?


 * Does this phrase even merit a Wikipedia article? It doesn't seem to have much of a life outside the Pink Floyd world. TypoBoy (talk) 18:19, 13 September 2011 (UTC)


 * As a disambiguation page, does this really need a whole paragraph on hemispheres of the moon? Surely that text should be on the relevant moon page, and linked under an "astronomy" disambiguation heading. Ethorad (talk) 13:33, 17 January 2014 (UTC)


 * Ignore my comment above, the odd paragraph has now gone and it's back to looking more like a disambiguation page, thanks Frze. Ethorad (talk) 10:10, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

I've done some Google Books searches for the phrase. Firstly, the term was in wide-enough use before Pink Floyd that several books in the early 20th century used it as their title. As far as the meaning, I, too, was under the impression that the "dark side" meant the "far side", and I have searched throughout Google's pre-Floyd archive attempting to find support for this position. Instead I must conclude that this is actually a recent interpretation and that the original meaning was "the portion of the moon not illuminated by the sun".

Astronomy of the satellites of the earth, Jupiter and Saturn:... (1727) p.77: "In New Moons the illuminated Side of the Earth is fully turn'd towards the Moon, and will therefore at that time illuminate the dark Side of the Moon, and then the Lunarians will have a full Earth, as we in a similar Position have a full Moon." / p.80 "...they will appear in one Right Line, and the Moon's dark Side will then be towards the Earth..."

An introduction to natural philosophy (1787) p.157: "the enlightened side of the Earth will have the same figure, when seen from the Moon, as the dark side of the Moon would exhibit if it could be seen at the same instant from the Earth. Thus, when the Moon is invisible, or near the conjunction, the Earth is in opposition, and presents a full luminous face to the Moon; and on the contrary, when the Moon is at the full, or opposite the Sun, it must be on the dark side of the Earth, which consequently then becomes invisible. Near the beginning of the first or end of the last quarter, the dark side of the Moon is rendered visible by the full Earth shining on it, but is scarcely so luminous as the Moon when eclipsed."

A mathematical and philosophical dictionary...: Volume 2 (1795) uses invisible side of the moon to describe the far side, dark part in a quotation, and dark/enlightened side when discussing a possible satellite of Venus: p.25 "LIBRATION, of the Moon, is an apparent irregularity in her motion, by which she seems to librate, or waver, about her own axis, one while towards the east, and again another while towards the west. ... it happens that some of those parts, which were before visible, set and hide themselves in the hinder or invisible side of the moon, and afterwards return and appear again on the nearer or visible side." / p.123 "Mr. Herschel has particularly observed several eruptions of the lunar volcanos, the last of which he gives an account of in the Philos. Trans. for 1787. April 19, 10h. 36m. sidereal time, I perceived, says he, three volcanos in different places of the dark part of the new Moon." / p.649: "And indeed it must be acknowledged, that Venus may have a satellite, though it is difficult for us to see it. Its enlightened side can never be fully turned towards us, but when Venus is beyond the sun; in which cafe Venus herself appears little bigger than an ordinary star, and therefore her satellite may be too small to be perceived at such a distance. When she is between us and the sun, her moon has its dark side turned towards us; and when Venus is at her greatest elongation, there is but half the enlightened side of the moon turned toward us, and even then it may be too far distant to be seen by us."

A new treatise on the use of the globes, and practical astronomy... (1812) p.342: "On March 7, 1794, a few minutes before 8 o'clock in the evening, a bright spot was observed, with the naked eye, on the dark side of the moon, by Mr. Wilkins, an eminent architect of Norwich; he conjectured that he saw it about five minutes."

Thomas Dick ca. 1823, discussing Herschel's volcanoes and reflected Earth-light. "Certain luminous spots, which have been occasionally seen on the dark side of the moon, seem to demonstrate that fire exists in this planet. ... The Moon always presents the same face to us; which proves that she revolves round her axis in the same time that she revolves round the earth. As this orb derives its light from the sun, and reflects a portion of it upon the earth, so the earth performs the same office to the moon. A spectator on the lunar surface would behold the earth, like a luminous orb, suspended in the vault of heaven, presenting a surface about 15 times larger than the moon does to us, and appearing sometimes gibbous, sometimes horned, and at other times with a round full face. The light which the earth reflects upon the dark side of the moon may be distinctly perceived by a common telescope, from three to six or eight days after the change."

Monthly notices of the Royal Astronomical Society: Volume 43 (1883) p.334: "Venus' dark side is therefore visible not by fluorescence of the sea, nor by auroral light, but simply by the same causes as those that make the Moon's dark side visible."

Occasionally dark face of the moon was used with the same meaning: "Often, about the time of new moon, when the dark face of the Moon would not properly be seen at all, we may perceive it shining faintly with Earthshine, the light of the full-earth, which the Earth gets from the Sun, and throws back, or reflects, upon the Moon, as the Moon, when full, reflects its light upon the Earth."

I think the article should be changed to note that the "far side" idea is a misinterpretation. The fact tag is from six months ago and no one has added any material to support it, nor can I find any... though I haven't tried wading through the post-1970s books. Msgohan (talk) 00:16, 4 December 2011 (UTC)


 * The same side of the Moon always points towards the Earth therefore the 'dark side of the Moon' changes with the Earth and the Moon's position in their orbit around the Sun, whereas 'the far side of the Moon' does not, it always being the side of the Moon furthest from the Earth. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.55.42 (talk) 15:29, 8 March 2019 (UTC)
 * In Doctor Who, The Space Museum, Episode 1, first aired Apr 24, 1965, we find the phrase "dark side of the moon" shortly after folks leave the Tardis. "I've always associated extinction with extreme cold. You know, something like the dark side of the moon." -Ian Chesterson, one of three companions.
 * Hpfeil (talk) 01:36, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Is "dark side of the moon" a lexical unit?
Does the phrase "dark side of the moon" warrant a Wikipedia article?

The answer depends in part, on whether the phrase is a lexical unit (or lexical item; see https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/lexical_item). In other words, is the meaning of the phrase anything but the composition of the meanings of the individual words?

Wikipedia doesn't have an article named red automobile, because there's already an article named automobile and one named red, and a "red automobile" is simply that item in that color. You could imagine a case in which "red automobile" came to have a common metaphorical meaning, or a case in which a famous artist created a work by that name. The extra freight that "red automobile" would then carry would warrant an article.

There is dissent over the meaning of the word "dark". (Does it mean "not illuminated", or "unknown"?) But there appears to be complete agreement that, whatever "dark" means, the "dark side of the moon" is the side of the moon which is dark.

This article should be deleted. TypoBoy (talk) 15:16, 12 February 2012 (UTC)
 * The "article" is tagged as a disambig page so I don't think it should be deleted. Msgohan (talk) 20:21, 13 February 2012 (UTC)

dark side of the moon
where would a good place to find info on the dark side of the moon? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Andziabula (talk • contribs) 16:16, 26 April 2012 (UTC)

/Have we ever been to the dark side of the moon?
j — Preceding unsigned comment added by Andziabula (talk • contribs) 16:18, 26 April 2012 (UTC)

Can humans surive on the farside of the moon?
Andziabula (talk) 17:06, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

J. Taylor
Why is the entry "Carolina in My Mind" (the James Taylor song) included in the See also section? I do not see the connection. Can someone enlighten me? Thanks. Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 07:23, 6 August 2015 (UTC)
 * I guess i know the lyrics less well than i imagined; the target article says a line goes "Still i'm on" followed by the phrase. I've rewritten the entry to read
 * "Carolina in My Mind"§Addiction, reflection in lyric of James Taylor's situation
 * but i'm "not married to it". However, do keep in mind that the function of the Dab page is not to enlighten JAS or other editors about why they are bemused by a Dab entry. It is rather, in this case, to aid readers of WP who are bemused by the lyric, or who recall only the moon fragment and want to know the context or the whole song. --Jerzy•t 08:50, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

Planetshine
I've treated "in astronomy" as redundant, and replaced the dreadful syntax "phenomenon ... occurs when". --Jerzy•t 08:50, 2 September 2015 (UTC)

Requested move 26 January 2019

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved to Dark Side of the Moon (disambiguation). ErikHaugen (talk &#124; contribs) 19:00, 7 February 2019 (UTC)

Dark side of the Moon → Dark Side of the Moon – Aside the far side of the Moon, everything here refers to a title. © Tb hotch ™ (en-2.5). 01:33, 26 January 2019 (UTC) --Relisting.  SITH   (talk)   23:35, 3 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Support. The current title should be . 94.21.204.175 (talk) 13:33, 26 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Support Rreagan007 (talk) 20:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose. Dark Side of the Moon already exists as a WP:PRIMARYREDIRECT to The Dark Side of the Moon (stable since 2006). No indication that that is no longer the primary topic. Alternate move: move to Dark Side of the Moon (disambiguation). -- JHunterJ (talk) 13:47, 1 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose and support alternate move per JHunterJ. Dekimasu よ! 20:22, 1 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Oppose per JHunterJ. Support his alternative move as well.  Calidum   19:07, 2 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Alternative move per JHunterJ. —BarrelProof (talk) 01:27, 7 February 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Missing under literature:
I noticed while looking for the book "the dark side of the moon" by Zoe Zajdlerowa (https://catalogue.nla.gov.au/Record/1068921) that this is not included under the subheading of literature. 157.193.240.241 (talk) 13:27, 6 June 2023 (UTC)