Talk:Debra Nails

Deletion
This is one of several pages I have put up for deletion. All of these pages are by the same author (account now deleted), about professors from the same university. While I will assume good faith that it is not the school self-promoting, the fact remains that the only sources for notability on these articles are the professor's own publications and their personal pages on the university's website, which does not meet WP:NOTE. Therefore, I have proposed them for deletion, pending any genuine sources on their notability existing.2601:405:4400:9420:D086:AC36:FF13:3352 (talk) 23:57, 19 March 2021 (UTC)
 * I fail to see how Nails is considered notable. This article should be deleted, as receiving awards, participating in fellowships, and teaching at a higher education institution does not mark a living person as notable. PerpetuityGrat (talk) 00:00, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Receiving awards and academic recognition from major universities does go toward notability, and would belong in a biographical article in any case; but a better indication of notability would come from her publications, and whether they are widely read or cited by scholars. Did you attempt to determine whether this is the case before proposing the article for deletion, or are you simply going by the current state of sourcing in the article?  Generally articles should be deleted when the claims made (including to satisfy notability guidelines) are not verifiable, but verifiability depends on the availability of reliable sources, not on whether they are presently cited in the article.  A good faith effort should be made to determine whether appropriate sources to demonstrate notability exist.  If they do, then the subject is notable, even if the current text of the article and its sources are insufficient to show it.  P Aculeius (talk) 13:43, 20 March 2021 (UTC)
 * On pages 24 and 31 of Essays on Plato's Philosophy (2001), Professor Nails is cited and her conclusions as to scholarly effort to establish a chronology of Plato's works are discussed—the gist of it being that while broad categories of "early", "middle", and "late" works appears valid, more precise dating based on Plato's style is probably not justified due to his tendency to revise his works at a later period.
 * In Who is Phaedrus (2012), Nails' opinion that Plato's work indicates that Phaedrus was involved in the Profanation of the Eleusinian Mysteries, but not the Mutilation of the Herms, is contrasted with the opinions of the scholarly majority and the author's own conclusion.
 * In Crito, a Character Study (2019), Nails is cited for the assertion that Plato offers nothing to support the common portrayal of Socrates' wife, Xanthippe, as a brutal, foul-tempered woman—a portrayal perhaps dependent on unflattering comments by Antisthenes and Lamprocles—and in some respects appears to contradict the common portrayal.
 * Now, my expertise is insufficient to tell me how important these works are, academically-speaking, or whether some of Nails' other contributions are equally or more significant. But my first impression is that these citations establish a presumption of notability as a scholar on Plato—a presumption that would have to be rebutted by showing that they are really quite minor or unimportant.  And if the subject of the article is notable, then some biographical details, including education, academic posts held, professional recognition, etc. would be expected, as long as its importance is not exaggerated.  I also note that Professor Nails has been quoted several times in recent news articles relating to other matters—a scandal involving another member of the university's faculty—although how important or relevant to her biography this is should probably be discussed.  P Aculeius (talk) 14:13, 20 March 2021 (UTC)

NO! ~ Even just Debra Nails' biographical and historical work on Plato and his times qualifies her as notable. Prosopography is *standard reference* in Plato scholarship, both to students and scholars. Anyone who takes the trouble can discovers this by searching for reviews and for the steady stream of current citations of her books and articles. Please do so before proposing anything. BlueMist (talk) 01:44, 23 March 2021 (UTC)