Talk:Decades: World Tour/Archive 1

Infobox picture
Do you think that it could be possible to add the North America 2018 poster for the 'Decades: World Tour' at the top of the infobox? The North America poster looks like this: http://nightwish.com/en/news/2017/06/170906-decades/NW_decades_NA.jpg If used, someone should ensure that the fair use argument can be done. HorrorLover555 (talk) 22:40, 18 July 2017 (UTC)


 * I think it makes sense, and to use the same fair use argument as done on the previous one Endless Forms Most Beautiful World Tour. NWWT (talk) 10:10, 27 March 2018 (UTC)


 * Uploaded and added the poster to the article. Uploaded using the same fair use argument as done on the previous tour: Endless Forms Most Beautiful World Tour --NWWT (talk) 03:11, 28 March 2018 (UTC)

NWWT
This is the message i send to user NWWT:

"Hello, i'm the one whose editions you reverted on the Decades page, and should know i'll put them back. You called them "vandalism", and that's absurd. #I deleted no info, and added more, talking about where the tour would go, what's indeed relevant, and you just scratched them off. Reasons?
 * 1) About the support act, in north america there was NO support act, so it's not not announced, there was "none", see the diference?
 * 2) About the legs, the summer concerts and the proper european tour are completed different things, so they must not be put together, the term "Summer Concerts" is traditional for tour pages.

I'll put these exactly same messages on the talk page on the article, to see if anyone else has thoughts about it. But wikipedia pages don't belong to anyone, so stop editing as it belonged to you. If you feel like replying me, feel free to do it. Thanks from Brazil."

Revertions should not be done at random and we can't just call things "vandalism" with no reasons, as far as i know the word has a very distinctive meaning. Does anyone think the changes i've made are bad for the article, tell me why in here, we'll discuss it and find a middle term. Remembering that that's the way things should be done here. Thanks Rodrigo71 (talk) 21:59, 8 April 2018 (UTC)


 *  Reply -Doesn't it make sense to put in {n/a} if there is no support act for the North American leg? HorrorLover555 (talk) 17:01, 10 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Not announced means we don't know what band supported, but in North America NO support band was used. It's different from some future dates, like in Tallinn, Bucharest and others; with these, no support act has been announced so far, but it might be soon. That's the difference. Rodrigo71 (talk) 19:27, 10 April 2018 (UTC)


 *  Reply - i have to agree with - and i'll add a few notes:
 * 1) I disagree with -'s edit, there is no justification for calling it "vandalism" without explanation.
 * 2) About N/A, I agree with -, it means "Not Available" and not "Not Announced" therefore it N/A is the right term to use and not "No support act". This is standard pretty much on all tour pages on EnWiki. I don't know how it is on the Brazilain Wiki but this is what N/A means on EnWiki. I will revert it back to -'s edit.
 * 3) Your claim on your last edit: "A nine months tour, it will be restricted to the Americas, North and South, and Europe with both headlining shows and festival appearances" is unfortunately misleading, because we don't know yet if the shows are restricted to those regions and encyclopedia claims cannot be based on assumptions by what has been announced so far by the band. Once the tour is over those details can be finalized, or if we have concrete official announcements from the band saying that. So far we don't have such official info, and to make it clear maybe they will announce the first ever tour in Africa? I will revert that.
 * 4) I am European and have personally been to many summer festivals as well, and with that point of view in mind, here are some reasons why the changes you made won't be valid on this tour: 1) The dates of this tour in Europe are co-mingled, meaning you have some dates that are festival dates and some are actually Nightwish arena dates and not really festivals (festivals are Wacken etc. however Laulurinne Autodrome, Baltic Princess Cruise and Tampere Stadium just as a few examples are not festivals, they are Nigthwish arena shows similar to the show in Sao Paulo as a good example (it is not a festival or summer concert how you call the others, it is an arena show headlined by Nightwish with or without a support act). 2) The dates used on tours on EnWiki are chronological according to the dates, and not grouped by show types of shows, so we cant really start creating tons of section when they go back and forth betwen festivals and arena shows, so when the show types are co-mingled there is no choice to do do the following by taking all that into consideration,  and I will be renaming that section to "Europe/Festivals" as it has been on the last tour as well (not "summer concerts" because that's not what it is) and will mark the individual festivals as (festivals) as it has been on older edits to distinguish the festivals from the regular Nightwish concerts where they are not part of festivals.
 * 5) Remember Wikipedia is a source of data for many visitors and not just seasoned editors, and following a chronological standardized ordering of dates (as it has been done repeatedly) helps the average joe and jane to understand the schedule and buy tickets accordingly.
 * 6) I don't know why you removed the show on Dec 15 in Finland? it is a legitimate show since its listed on the Nightwish tour date list on their website. I will add it back + the other date on Dec 14 as listed on the website
 * 7) Please don't take it personally, we all do our best to have proper data out for the readers of Wikipedia. let's not turn this into a back and forth edit game for no reason, the reader who reads the info needs to have accurate data and this is the top priority. Respectfully, :) Bohbye (talk) 05:38, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
 *  2nd Reply - I see now you threatened - with a block on his talk page. '(Second warning about Decades: World Tour article. Before you get a temporary block for arbitrary editions, read the discussion page of the article and talk about it. Thanks. Rodrigo71 (talk) 14:08, 10 April 2018 (UTC)).' I bring it up because this is not supposed to be taken personal. The edits I made are well explained and are factual, and so are - edits that make sense as well given the above. Do not feel threatened by edits. Wiki is not a place of threats. Edits are made according to factual data as it is known by the time of the edit and i am calling for calm de-escalation. Respectfully, Bohbye (talk) 06:22, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Ok -, you came here and explained all of this, but - and - only reversed everything without a single word of explanation, as any other edition mattered. THAT'S wrong, don't you think. We all should discuss together wether and edition is valid or not. Rodrigo71 (talk) 20:58, 11 April 2018 (UTC)
 * As i said above -, It was not ok, and at this point, I think it's best to move on and positively contribute to the benefit of the readers of Wikipedia. Respectfully, Bohbye (talk) 01:28, 12 April 2018 (UTC)

Notable and unique setlist firsts table
I’m leaning towards removing Wish I Had An Angel and Amaranth from that table and I’ll explain my thoughts. A table like this, if it starts listing items that are not as notable and ‘’’unique’’’ is risking the entire table to be removed as WP:FANCRUFT, but keeping it in check by listing true firsts like songs that have been performed the first time ever by this lineup (Floor and Marco), new songs like Elvenjig, and hopefully later on the tour songs they never performed live before, that will allow the table to stay and show the unique songs on this tour. Separately there is already a list on this page of all of the songs performed throughout the tour so this table will list more than it was it starts duplicating the effort. Why not list Élan and the Greatest Show On earth? Please let me know your thoughts on this. Pinging - - Cheers, Bohbye (talk) 05:50, 23 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Reply: Hmmmmm... not really sure. I'm thinking of reverting Wish I Had an Angel, but keeping Amaranth because it was added to the setlist in the second last show of the North American tour. But if it doesn't work out, you could possibly remove the unique setlist firsts table. Of course, don't remove the Sample Setlist or the songs performed on the tour. :) HorrorLover555 (talk) 05:54, 24 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Reply: Just went again what the band said before the tour "The band will have a very special setlist for the tour, featuring rarely heard material from the earlier era, and excitingly for both band and fans, they will revisit the old songs with some new twists", so it seems more appropriate to keep the songs that are really unique to this tour, which are the ones first ever performed by Floor / Marco / Troy and not ones they already performed with the same members on prior tours such as Wish I Had An Angel and Amaranth. Struggling with it lol first world problems :) --Bohbye (talk) 08:36, 24 April 2018 (UTC)
 * Reply: I've thought it over, and after an eye on the setlist firsts table, you are right that it would be more appropriate for the songs that weren't in prior performances, and I am heavily considered removing those marked prior. Your thoughts? HorrorLover555 (talk) 21:34, 23 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Reply: I see you already removed it. Perfect. --Bohbye (talk) 21:05, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

Box office
OK, where do all those boxscore informations come from? They all seem very fake, and diverges from informations given by the band themselves, like a sold out show in NYC, and there's nothing on the only source provided. I'd like some clarifications. Thank you. Rodrigo71 (talk) 20:21, 31 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Reply: The boxscore information are from Billboard.com, a section of the website which shows by numbers how much money they grossed on tour or how many people attended the show. :) It doesn't exactly state if a show sold out or not, so I guess a discussion can be put in place if the box office section should stay or not. What do you think on all this? HorrorLover555 (talk) 01:05, 1 February 2019 (UTC)

I'm familiar with the source page, but the thing is, these informations can't be found in there. Are you able to provide any other source for them, otherwise i really don't see the point of keeping them. Rodrigo71 (talk) 15:39, 1 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Reply:Point taken, since the website updates every week or so, so I don't believe there is much of a point in having the box office score chart. It seems justified to also remove the box office charts in the Endless Forms Most Beautiful and Dark Passion Play tour pages as well, since they seem unsourced as well. In the end, I don't believe I have any other sources to provide for it other than what had been given before. We can agree to a compromise on removing it. HorrorLover555 (talk) 18:42, 1 February 2019 (UTC)