Talk:Demographics of Haiti/Archive 1

Comment
Literacy: (2003 est.) Definition: Age 15 and over that can read and write Total population: 20 thousand Male: 54.8% Female: 51.2% 

It doesn't say which language that 52.9% is literate in, Creole or French. (anonymous comment)


 * There's a good reason for that. Many Haitians speak some French in addition to kreyol.  Most who go to school are educated in both languages, even though they usually don't end up needing the French in whatever vocation they choose.


 * Because of these factors, the visitor to Haiti will encounter something of a continuum from pure "kreyol ayisyen" through various mixtures (called simply "kreyol" or "kreyol fransesize" -- the original meaning of "creole" was a mixture of French and another language), to pure French for some government business, interaction with foreigners who are uncomfortable with speaking a mixture, professions such as medicine, law, and engineering, and resident ethnic minority communities.


 * Considering the political chaos that has racked Haiti in the last 20 years, it is very likely that the collectors of these statistics lacked the resources to produce a statistically significant separation of the language (or languages) of people's literacy for the entire country. In any case, I doubt they considered it particularly relevant.  Why, you ask, would they think that?


 * Consider, for example, how you would categorize someone who falls into the kreyol fransezize area (which, depending on your definition of literacy, could range from less than 10% to more than 90% of all literate Haitians). Do you have just one "fransezize" category, or do you break it out further?  I have witnessed (and sometimes been party to) numerous conversations between two people who both were proficient in some kind of kreyol fransezize, in which major misunderstandings ocurred, or even mutual unintelligibility!  And if someone speaks only pure Kreyol, but can read some French if asked to do so, are they considered literate in ayisyen, kreyol fransesize, or French -- or two of these, or all three??  For that matter, is kreyol fransesize even a separate language, or is it simply a patois or dialect of either ayisyen and/or French?  You see where this is going?  The correct answer is:  It cannot possibly matter to anything, so why worry about it?


 * Today, with official documents and the vast majority of signage and print media in kreyol, the one statistic that really matters is literacy in kreyol ayisyen, which in some quarters is understood to include dialects of francified kreyol, provided there is not so much French that the typical speaker of ayisyen cannot understand. This particular section of the literate public probably includes all literate people, excepting the smallest handful of ethnic French -- who certainly could learn to read the language just fine, but may choose not to.  (Or in some cases, they may be able to read it just fine, but are not about to admit that fact to a stranger!)


 * Another factor that makes the breakout less relevant is that, 10 years ago, the overall functional literacy rate was closer to 20% than 53%. The Aristide and first Preval administrations mounted a truly, stunningly massive literacy campaign in the 90's and early noughts (00's).  In terms of citizens it touched throughout the country, in both urban and rural areas, it was probably the largest government program of its time.  So the literacy number has been in rapid flux.  Additionally, all of these newly literate people were being taught kreyol ayisyen, so the breakout percentages by language will have also been in flux -- even assuming people agree on what to call a "language" in Haiti.


 * I hope this helps, rather than causing more confusion! Fowler Pierre 13:02, 7 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Due to recent economic crisis and an array of natural disasters like the 2008 Atlantic Hurricane Season and the 2010 Haiti Earthquake, Haitian diaspora communities are expanding in the Americas and European countries. The UN's presence made it easier for Haitian refugees to flee the country (i.e. the US and Canada), esp. the most numerous nationalities in

the United Nations are Chile, Ireland and Greece whom had an interest in Haitian diplomatic relations except for France, the former colonial ruler of the country. + 71.102.7.77 (talk) 09:43, 19 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Has anyone been to Haiti? To suggest an actual white population or even significant non-white population there is laughable...especially with the ethnic breakdown there.  There is a non-insignificant mullato minority, some of which are relatively light skinned, but outside of NGO and UN people, there are basically no significant white, asian, or arab populations aside from a tiny minority involved in business or married to locals.  Haiti is not a multicultural country really - it is 95%+ essentially pure subsaharan african with little white admixture, with a 5% mulltato populaton that forms a significant portion of the elite.  The weight spent on describing the white populatino is comical and all out of proportion to the reality.  It seems as some people like to describe every country as having some sort of substantial white minority - while one would not really talk about the tiny senegal community in japan, or the tiny pacific islander community in Canada.

I found a citation for the Emigration section however when I went to publish the citation it said that it may fall under the category of self-promotion. I didn't write what I cited in the article, but I am new to wiki and am unsure if whoever added that shouldn't have. Just thought I would leave a message hoping a more experienced wiki editor comes along. Baileycraddock (talk) 20:10, 18 October 2020 (UTC)