Talk:Derby County F.C./Archive 1

Paul Simpson
Should Paul Simpson be included in the promotion to the Premiership? He was the club captain, and ever present and then was dumped on the basis of the clubs sports psychologist belief that promotion was his only motivation and he should be released (which Jim Smith did!) Ianguy 11:36, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Benefit Match
Wasnt the benefit match for Ted McMinn on Monday 1st May 2006? The Attendance record states 2nd May 2006. The possible error is also present in the players personal page. joeflint82 02:52, 15 July 2006 (UTC)


 * It doesn't really matter because it's not the record attendance. That is 33,597 (a full house) for England U21s v Mexico U21s. I don't know whether this or the highest Derby County competitive match should included on the list (as this page is about the club, not the stadium, I guess it should be a Derby match (or possibly even a Derby match at the Baseball Ground)). Either way, it shouldn't be the Ted McMinn testimonal. - Green Tentacle 18:24, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

This Should redirect to Death Cab For Cutie...
DCFC, I mean. Why did it change?


 * I don't know why it was changed, but your point is fair enough. I've converted it into a disambiguation page so it links to both. - Green Tentacle 22:24, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Lewin Nyatanga's nationality
What should Lewin Nyatanga's nationality be listed as? Obviously, he's officially British, but it's normal for UK football articles to be a little more specific. He currently has a Welsh flag next to his name, as he plays for Wales at an international level (qualifying because his mother is Welsh). However, he was born in Burton-on-Trent (England) and has lived there all his life, so he would normally be described as English. Which should it be? - Green Tentacle 22:24, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Its a tricky one, but as he was born in England, he should have the English flag next to his name.

But his dad is Zimbabwean.

Both Michael Johnson and Darren Moore were born in England yet they have Jamaican flags as that is who they have played international football for. This is a football article so players should have their footballing nationality displayed, Wales for Lewin.

Lewin plays for Wales, therefore Welsh is the only realistic option. Toby14483 19:30, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

Colin Murphy
The link on the Derby page goes to the wrong Colin Murphy, some American born in 1980, which consdiering the Derby manager Colin Murphy managed the club in 1976 / 7 is quite a feat !!

The Rams should redirect to the Rams Disambiguation page
Many teams are known as The Rams. Footballrocks41237 20:26, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Andy Garner
Just wondering if anyone can confirm his league stats while at the Rams. This site lists both his Derby and Blackpool stats as being 159 (37). - Dudesleeper · Talk 19:31, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Answer provided here. Thanks. - Dudesleeper · Talk 14:07, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

History Section
After reading comments in the edit summary by Green Tentacle (|here) I agree that we might need to move the history section to a new page, as it is getting fairly long, and maybe even putting potential readers off reading the article. Maybe we could place the current version of the history on the new page History of Derby County F.C., and leave a shorter outline of the history on this page with a link to the new one. This has been done on the featured article Manchester City F.C., and I think it could work here too. What does everyone else think? - Boy1jhn 09:03, 1 August 2007 (UTC)
 * If nobody has any objections to the plan outlined above, I'll go ahead and carry it out tomorrow - Boy1jhn 16:14, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Current Squad
The link for Matthew Richards leads to the Matt Richards that plays for Ipswich, unless we have made a new signing that I don't know about I think this is the wrong player.
 * You're right, I've looked at Matthew Richards profile on the Derby Website (here) and it says he graduated from the Derby academy, meaning the two are different people. I've changed the link. Boy1jhn 11:18, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

web citation.
This article could do with a ref list and a load of citations to help support it. :/ Govvy 16:45, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Directors
Derby have confirmed that Trevor Birch (CEO) is no longer in their empoyment. http://www.dcfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10270~1147537,00.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.69.147.204 (talk) 12:24, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Screwed up Squad
No way Derby has those players. Someone fix that shit up. It's embarrassing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.217.60.11 (talk) 12:32, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Please don't use offensive language. It has been kept for a record of your actions. Derby do have those players, so live with it if your not a Derby fan. Or, if it really is wrong, then either discuss it, or Be Bold and change it, but leave an edit summary - otherwise you may be reverted for vandalism.  Bluegoblin  7   13:33, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Someone, obviously more responsible then yourself fixed the squad up. But earlier, the squad had a bunch of international superstars. Talk is cheap, but there was no way Gomez was the number 10 for Derby. He is at Stuttgart, and I don't think Robinho has ever played at Derby either. I could be wrong though, use your all great patronising insight into the EPL to figure it out. By the way, what you've said has been kept as a record of your actions with Barclays. Derby didn't have those players, live with it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.218.205.80 (talk) 12:34, 28 October 2007 (UTC)


 * No, I agree. Derby didn't have the int'l players, but when I wrote that, there was the proper squad there. And I'm not patronising anything. And, like I said: Be Bold and change it if you have a problem.  Bluegoblin  7   15:40, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Updating Current Squad
Hi, apologies for the ignorance. How do you update the current squad? When I click to edit that section, it just comes up with the code to bring up the squad (ie: Two open squiggly brackets then Derby County current squad then two closing squiggly brackets", but not the squad itself. Do I have to go to another page to edit this? Thanks all. (The change was that Hossam Ghaly has been given squad number 40). Thanks Duncshine (talk) 11:39, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Hi Duncshine. The page is a template, accessible at Derby County current squad, but in the meantime I have made the edit for you.  Bluegoblin  7   11:51, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Shirt Sponsors
Further research suggestion: weren't Derby the first English (British?) club to carry shirt sponsorship - for the carmakers Saab? As I understand it the pre-season team photograph (season?) was taken with the newly-adorned strip, but the sponsors name did not appear during a competitive football match. Could be an amendment to the Shirt Sponsor or history section? --Paulowanchope 12:07, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes you are correct, but the move was quahsed by the football authorities. MnJWalker (talk) 03:20, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

Keeper's defiant gesture to Nazis
As Usual there was plenty to talk about as supporters poured out of football grounds all over Britain on the second Saturday of the 1939-40 season.

Yet the atmosphere on the buses and trams taking fans home for their tea on that sultry afternoon was strangely muted.

The usual post-match chatter about goals scored and chances missed had given way to discussions about much graver concerns.

Germany had just invaded Poland, the Luftwaffe was in the skies over Warsaw and, for the second time in a generation, war appeared inevitable. For once, the result of a football match hardly seemed to matter.

The mood in Derby, where barrage balloons hovered overhead, was no different from any other town or city.

At the Baseball Ground, Jack Nicholas had scored a penalty midway through the second half to give Derby County a 1-0 win over Aston Villa.

The crowd of 8,000 hurried out, pondering the future. As it turned out, they had seen the Rams' last match in the Football League for more than seven years.

The following day, war was declared and the competition closed down for the duration.

The Evening Telegraph commented: "We will see no more football until the whistle blows on the grim conflict on which Britain is now engaged."

If the thoughts of spectators and players were indeed elsewhere, then Nicholas, scorer of the Rams' last pre-war goal, may well have been reflecting on the moment when a Derby County goalkeeper made a brave show of defiance against the Nazis.

Five years earlier, Overseal-born Jack Kirby could not have made his distaste for Adolf Hitler's regime more public.

At the end of the 1933-34 season, the Rams could consider themselves one of the leading sides in the country. They had just finished fourth in the top flight and had reached the fifth round of the FA Cup before going out 1-0 to the legendary team of the era, Arsenal.

The German FA were looking for attractive visitors to make a four-match trip to their country. Derby County were in the top four and their team contained England players Tommy Cooper, Sammy Crooks, Jack Bowers and Errington Keen. The Rams fitted the bill admirably.

By train to Dover and then a cross-Channel steamer to Ostend, the Rams party eventually reached the German border to find a country swathed in the swastika emblem. After Hitler's success in the elections of March 1933, the Nazi State was firmly established.

Dave Holford was a 19-year-old outside-left from Scarborough, excited to be included in the tour party despite his lack of experience.

He recalled: "Everywhere we went, the swastika was flying. If you said 'good morning,' they'd reply with 'heil Hitler.' If you went into a cafe and said 'Good evening', they would respond with 'heil Hitler'. Even then, you could see this was a country preparing for war."

The Rams were scheduled to play four matches, all against various teams styled as a 'German XI'. And it was here that Derby County, one of the strongest teams in England, came to realise the power of German football.

Derby lost 5-0 in Cologne, 5-2 in Frankfurt, 1-0 in Dusseldorf and drew 1-1 in Dortmund.

The Rams lost Cooper and Crooks, who left to play for England in Hungary and Czechoslovakia, but only after the two big defeats. There were no excuses for the Rams coming off second best to some well-organised German teams.

All agreed that, if the football had been hard work, overall the tour had been an enjoyable one. Good hotels and plenty of time to relax and enjoy the scenery were just the ticket after a strenuous English season.

There was, though, one overriding blot on the collective memory.

Just as the England team were obliged to do in Berlin, four years later, the Rams players of 1934 were ordered to give the Nazi salute before each game.

Before he died in 1989, Rams full-back George Collin, who captained the side when Cooper left for England duty, recalled: "We told the manager, George Jobey, that we didn't want to do it. He spoke with the directors, but they said that the British ambassador insisted we must.

"He said that the Foreign Office were afraid of causing an international incident if we refused. It would be a snub to Hitler at a time when international relations were so delicate.

"So we did as we were told. All except our goalkeeper, Jack Kirby, that is. Jack was adamant that he wouldn't give the salute.

"When the time came, he just kept his arm down and almost turned his back on the dignitaries, If anyone noticed, they didn't say anything."

It was a brave gesture by the goalkeeper who went on to play almost 200 games for Derby before moving to Folkestone Town as player-manager. Five years after his defiant stand against the Nazis, all that the Rams party had feared came to pass.

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.189.102.65 (talk) 17:07, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Recent Times
Up to when should recent times become part of the clib's history? I moved the taking over of the club by Peter Gadsby et al to club history as it is now almost 2 years ago and the club has a new board now. I propose that the recent times section should be restricted to events of the current season ie. - it should start with the close season prior to the current campaign.

Also I attempted to improve the opening section of the article by including a brief summary of the clubs grounds, formation and trophies though this was removed and accussed of being repetitive vandalism. I don't see how it is considering that the majority of other Premiership and Championship clubs have such a section and I was merely brining the Derby page inline with this.

thanks AnOrdinaryBoy (talk) 15:24, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The answer is that the section should not exist. It needs condensing to a few sentences and merging into the history section and History article. Currently, the last year or so of the club's history is given as much space as the previous 123! I've tagged it as recentist and I intend to sort it out in due course. Low-level detail on the current and previous season belongs in Derby County F.C. season 2007-08 and Derby County F.C. season 2008-09, not here. Your edits to the lead sound sensible to me and don't seem like vandalism - I'll have a closer look later and let you know what I think. --Jameboy (talk) 12:17, 26 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I've moved the overly detailed accounts of the current and previous seasons into Derby County F.C. season 2008-09 and Derby County F.C. season 2007-08 respectively, and replaced it with a much more succinct version. --Jameboy (talk) 15:21, 30 August 2008 (UTC)

Image copyright problem with Image:Steve Bloomer.jpg
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Notable Players
I have drawn up a list of what I consider to be a fair list of notable Derby County players and put it under the Notable Players section.

- They have all been Player Of The Season - They all won either an FA Cup or Championship medal whilst at the club. - Scored over 100 goals for the club - Made over 300 appearances for the club - Appeared in the Top 100 Rams Players list in Derby County: The Complete Record. I believe these are fair criteria for inclusion, certainly fairer than the inclusion of, say, Frank Stapleton - who is not notable as a Dreby player but rather for his fame as a Man Utd - or Benito Carbone.

AnOrdinaryBoy (talk) 17:08, 23 March 2009 (UTC)

Darren Moore
Darren Moore did NOT win the Jackie Stamps Trophy for the 2007/08 season, he won the club's internal award. The Jackie Stamps Trophy is voted for by the supporters who voted for themselves. Please stop changing it to Darren Moore (I've included a reference to prove that DM did not win it) AnOrdinaryBoy (talk) 11:40, 16 November 2008 (UTC)

Someone has incorrectly changed 07/08 winner back to Darren Moore again. Derby County's own website detials that it was awarded to the fans. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.194.51.129 (talk) 11:55, 27 April 2009 (UTC)

Club Badge
The club still has the same badge but the colours have changed slightly so that it is now just black and white. See DCFC.co.uk hompage http://www.dcfc.co.uk/page/Home/0,,10270,00.html Is the consensus that this should now be changed in the main article and is it ok to upload logos onto Wikipeida or are there copyright issues? Animaly2k2 (talk) 11:34, 22 July 2009 (UTC)

Leicester rivalry
The rivalry with Leicester City stems largely from geographical location rather than any shared history.[41] The rivalry is considered stronger on Leicester's side than Derby's, with Leicester's support seeing Derby as their "traditional" rival, whereas Derby's support view their rivalry with Forest significantly more important.[38]

Haven't Derby and Leicester spent many of the last 20 or 30 seasons in the same division as well as the 1994 play off final?

Also, both clubs consider each other as their secondary rivals. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.150.200.253 (talk) 18:36, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Squad table format
A discussion is being held here on the possibility of rolling out a new squad template. The new template, named football squad player2, differs from the standard squad layout in several ways:
 * It features a sort function
 * Comes in a single column format that can be understood by screen readers.
 * Single column format ensures that low resolution browsers, including mobile devices, do not get part or all of the second column cut off.
 * Single column format ensures less clutter, particularly at lower resolutions, for wide sections such as the Arsenal loan section.
 * It gives nationality its own column; at present flags are featured in a blank, untitled column
 * It complies with Wikipedia's guidance on flag usage.
 * It leaves enough space to add images of current players, an example of which can be seen at Watford F.C.

It is proposed that the new template be added to some of Wikipedia's most high-profile club articles, which might include. To give your thoughts, please read and contribute to the discussion at WikiProject Football.

Regards, Edinburgh   Wanderer  19:39, 24 January 2012 (UTC)

Stadium
Under the stadium section, one paragraph states that the club played at the county ground until 1895, the next paragraph states that the club moved to the baseball ground in 1885... which is it? I am pretty sure it is 1895, but wasn't sure enough to alter it. Alvoram (talk) 00:13, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

never mind, I've gone ahead and changed it.

local rivals
Certainly when I was a kid in Derby in the 50s and 60s, the Chesterfield-Sheffield-Leeds axis seemed, (together with Leicester), more 'close' than the people of the West Midlands. It's probably the good communications (midland main line and M1) and the common 'smoke stack' heritage that does it, as much as any FC rivalries. (Oh, and of course the Danelaw, :-)) Bob aka Linuxlad 12:57, 29 May 2007 (UTC)


 * While I'm not so convinced by Chesterfield (too small) and Sheffield (I'm a Derby ex-pat living there and neither club sees Derby as a local rival), I am in complete agreement with you about the West Midlands clubs not being rivals to Derby. No Derby fan sees them as anything other than another game (there was not mention of the play-off final being a local derby match). There's at least three of us who have reverted the change back, but one anonymous user keeps on putting it back. They also seem to want to downplay the rivalry with Leicester, which, given that some Derby fans see them as bigger rivals than Forest, seems like an odd move. - Green Tentacle 22:13, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

It's simply untrue to state that Leicester fans regard Derby as their traditional rival. Go to any Leicester home game - there's far more anti-Forest stuff than anti-Derby (and recently, more anti-Coventry than Derby as well). The document linked has Forest as Leicester's first rival too. Changing to 'both sides regard their rivalry with Forest as more important.'

82.37.25.44 (talk) 21:56, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Clubs to have competed in every season of the English football league system
'it is one of only ten clubs to have competed in every season of the English football league system'

This needs to be verified and referenced. I couldn't find 2 clubs from the original 12 that had pulled out of the top 4 tiers - accrington was the only one I could find. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.155.121.30 (talk) 01:59, 18 May 2016 (UTC)
 * Stoke failed re-election in 1890 and spent a season outside the League, playing in the Football Alliance, so the claim is true if you take "outside the system" to mean not in the Football League or the modern pyramid. But I can't find a specific reference to the continuity of the ten clubs, so it could be construed as synthesis or OR. Jellyman (talk) 09:51, 18 May 2016 (UTC)

Stadium section
I deleted the table of grounds as it was not only unnecessary but misleading. It summarised information already presented as prose – we only need to summarise either in lead sections or when linking to a separate "main article". The inclusion of capacity figures was contentious – someone just changed that of the Baseball Ground from its final to its peak capacity. Neither is obviously more "correct" than the other to use, but the latter leaves the impression of Derby moving to a smaller ground in 1997, when of course the reverse was true! Jellyman (talk) 14:17, 24 November 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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External links modified
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External links modified (February 2018)
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Proposed merge with Steve Bloomer's Watchin'
I propose that Steve Bloomer's Watchin' be merged into Derby County F.C.. The song is worthy of a mention in the context of the club, but it lacks the level of notability to be worth a stand alone article. The article as it stands has been unsourced for many years. Jellyman (talk) 17:04, 4 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Support Makes a lot of sense, especially as there are no cited sources to this small page. Please go ahead and make the merge. Nick Moyes (talk) 12:00, 18 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Support I agree. Basnoordwijk (talk) 07:33, 22 October 2017 (UTC)
 * Oppose AlexRover (talk) 11:42, 18 February 2018 (UTC)I strongly disagree with this merger.
 * Oppose It's embarrassing, it really is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.148.155.239 (talk) 17:17, 9 May 2018 (UTC)
 * SupportThe song is not a notable football song in the way "You'll Never Walk Alone Is". Additionally, the Steve Bloomer's Watching article, as it stands, is hardly impartially written. Alan Jones (talk) 15:49, 18 May 2018 (JST)
 * Oppose The song deserves a seperate page. A merge with the DCFC page doesn't provide reliable content that readers want. --Eddemyed (talk) 17:07, 31 May 2018 (UTC)

Regarding Vandalism
I think the article needs to be semi-protected, the vandalism by IPs is getting ridiculous. James-the-Charizard (talk) 18:04, 16 January 2019 (UTC)

Origin of the Rams nickname
It would be nice if the article explained the origin of The Rams' nickname. From what I've found http://vitaminq.blogspot.com/2005_05_01_vitaminq_archive.html and http://www.ilkcam.com/2002/020310/Derby%20Ram.html it is because men from Derby served in the 1st Battalion Worcestershire and Sherwood Foresters Regiment, whose mascot is the ram. I haven't checked up on how reliable these sources are though, so I haven't added it to the article. KeithD 13:01, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Are you aware of the old folk-song 'The Wonderful Derby Ram'? (see your second ref.) It's probably pagan-fertility rite in origin?? Bob aka Linuxlad 13:00, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

A match programme from West Ham United (1970s I believe) that I used to possess claimed that the nickname was related to a ram belonging to a local member of the gentry that fell down a well. MnJWalker (talk) 03:16, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

"Additionally, the club also adopted the song "The Derby Ram" as its regimental song" shurey shome mishtake here.84.71.5.46 (talk) 18:47, 25 April 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 October 2020
Henrich Ravas has moved to Hartlepool United on loan. Sarrunda (talk) 17:45, 1 October 2020 (UTC)
 * , ❌. Please use the change x to y format Asartea   Talk  undefined  Contribs  09:24, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 30 November 2020
Section Minor honours, change 1992–93 to 1992–93. 76.103.46.252 (talk) 22:04, 30 November 2020 (UTC)
 * ✅. ◢  Ganbaruby!   (Say hi!) 10:11, 1 December 2020 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 November 2021
The Derby County third kit isn't pink that's last seasons 2A01:4C8:C88:9841:CB57:CE8E:4421:80EB (talk) 17:37, 14 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Seems legit from their online store, but I don't know how to do this myself. ◢  Ganbaruby!   (talk) 10:23, 19 November 2021 (UTC)