Talk:Deucalion

Etymology
I placed in an interesting etymological idea from "the letters of Shir". I could not find support for this view (that the greeks interchanged r and l) from wikipedias phontic page. Perhaps someonelse van find out more. Possibly From Noah to Deucalion would be a more interesting subject header? BestWolf2191 05:04, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

There is also a connection between the greek word for shovel "dixella", I don't have the alphabet down so I can't add it in. Perhaps someone else can.Wolf2191 01:53, 10 June 2007 (UTC)


 * The Greeks interchanged l and r in what sense? Among Greek dialects, or from PIE?  &#0149;Jim 62 sch&#0149;  13:42, 19 June 2007 (UTC)


 * I removed this from the article as it is a mess: "However, it is also possible that "Deucalion" is related somehow to lightning or to oaks, from "Dyēus" -- Liddell and Scott note a Boeotian variant "Δεύς" of the usual Greek Ζεύς -- and κᾶλον "stuff to be burned," hence "wood" (and thus "ships"), which they derive from καίω "burn, set on fire.""
 * If you are refering to PIE, you need to note it as *Dyēus. Second, the Aeolian form Δεύς doesn't really matter as Ζεύς is derived from *dyēus or *deiwos anyway (there is disagreement on the actual root, no matter what the Wikipedia article says), the same root from which Deus is derived.  Also mentioning lightning (I suppose via Zeus' reputation as "Thunder-God) seems a bit odd, and the point becomes unclear.
 * Finally, κᾶλον simply means dry, seasoned wood (no reference to ships), although it is derived from καίω. Also, whence "oak"?
 * Bottom line, it's none to clear where this particular tangential etymology is going nowhere fast.  &#0149;Jim 62 sch&#0149;  14:01, 19 June 2007 (UTC)


 * κᾶλον is a good point I have to say. Also, we should note that δευ- could be from the verb δεύω 'to make wet, drench'. The combination of those two feels a bit more related to the context of the story.Fkitselis (talk) 21:08, 26 May 2013 (UTC)


 * As to "dixella", where did that come from? The closest I can find (or that I'm aware of) is διχα (in two, asunder), and which would be transliterated as dicha, hence if διχελλα did exist it would be transliterated dichella.  Also, there is absolutely no proof that the Greeks had any problem with the Hebrew R.  &#0149;Jim 62 sch&#0149;  14:33, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

You're likely right. The rabbi in question lived in the 18th century but he did know his greek.I need to look for the exact spelling. I can see a connection between asunder and knife. There maybe such a usage in ancient greek?? Best.Wolf2191 05:09, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Incidentally the (ancient) hebrew R was half R half a guttural Ch, I can see how it might end up an L.Wolf2191 21:17, 22 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Lost me on "asunder and knife".
 * If you read the Septuagint, you'll find that there was no problem transliterating the Reish to a rho (which, btw, was also partially gutteral). Additionally, there is no real proof that Greek borrowed much of anything from Semitic languages.  What was really happening in the case of the Rabbi was that he was using the Tower of Babel story to a assume a tongue from which all languages derived.  &#0149;Jim 62 sch&#0149;  22:14, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

"there was no problem" agreed but mistakes to happen on occasion. We aren't discussing necessarily whethr greek and semitic languages are related but rather if a greek man had heard the story from a Semite and heard Noah described as a Dekeron might he then have transmitted a story about a dekaron which a slight speech defect would make deucalon. (i.e. a connection is being hypotesized between two similar sounding words, how and when such a switch would've happened is left to the realm of the imagination. I any event as a valid source I think it can stay but I am interested in your thoughts on this subject Possibly you can look in on thhe metatron etymology as well. ThanksWolf2191 22:31, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Deukalion is transleted in Albanian language as whom was let from the god .."diel deus zeus zot(god)e ka le"... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.107.177.27 (talk) 23:10, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

The current etymology is terrible and completely defies the rules of linguistics. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.238.48.165 (talk) 15:46, 19 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Agreed, and it's also unsourced, in the sense that none of the cited sources backs up the idea of this being the real origin of the name. 173.77.14.72 (talk) 06:35, 24 January 2014 (UTC)

Intro in disorder
The intro tell us that Deucalion is son of X and Y. Then the intro tells us nothing about Deucalion, but about Zeus'es deluge. An intro should mainly be about Deucalion, and his role during Zeus'es deluge. Said: Rursus (☻) 21:02, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Plato as Source ?
He's much earlier than some of the "primary" sources cited, and mentions Deucalion early in Timaeus. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.21.123.155 (talk) 21:46, 31 December 2008 (UTC)

Bot-generated content
A computerised algorithm has generated a version of this page using data obtained from AlgaeBase. You may be able to incorporate elements into the current article. Alternatively, it may be appropriate to create a new page at Deucalion (alga). Anybot ( contact operator) 15:54, 21 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I think the latter alternative would clearly be preferable in this case. Speaking as a human, of course. Til Eulenspiegel (talk) 16:10, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

The most relevant dating of the Deucalion flood can be found in the first Western Enceclopedia written By st Isidor of Spain who places this flood in the period of Moses and the plagues of Egypt. Together with the explosion of Santorini would give the 10 plagues a cause nad effect. But also explain why the Jewish God had a name change as the roar sounded like JWH or the God who hit the face of El. El or Elohim being our Sun as the Sun god Ra of the Egyptians. Confirming the first synods choice of God being opur Sun. While "The Admonitions of an Egyptian Sage" translated from the Hieratic Papyrus found in the city of Leiden in the Netherlands seems to make this explanation most likely. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.168.51.242 (talk) 14:23, 3 May 2009 (UTC)

Prometheus chronology
A minor note, that we don't need to worry too much about: Prometheus was chained by Mount Caucasus at the end of the Silver Age to be liverhacked each day, for stealing the fire and giving it to the humankind. Then comes the Bronze Age, and Prometheus begets Pronoia creating Deucalion. Then Zeus is pissed off and decides to annihilate the bronze age men. Afterwards comes the Age of Heroes, or maybe the Iron Age, during which Heracles frees Prometheus fronm his chains... (?) Of course: the Greek mythology was very slippery and splattery, so maybe Prometheus did something with Pronoia there upon the mountain, while the eagle hacked liver, but seriously: the mythology probably changed form all the time causing such a contradiction, so it might be important to know in what cultural layer (i.e. arcaic, old antiquity or new antiquity) the Deucalion story got its current form. Probably it was some import myth from a certain cultural layer, since other sources tell us that bronze age men became extinct by their own warfare. ... said: Rursus ( m bork³ ) 14:03, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Good story to put elsewhere
GOOD STORY TO BE PUT ELSEWHERE: This was a sacrifice that was forbidden in the new Olympian order, utterly inappropriate as an offering, and repugnant besides. Zeus struck Lycaon's house with a thunderbolt and turned him into a wolf. But it was the treatment Zeus received when he visited the hall of the fifty sons of Lycaon, in the usual poverty-stricken disguise. They set him a stew of sheep guts—hearts, livers and tripes—in which they included the stewed innards of their brother Nyctimus. Zeus was appalled by this cannibal offering, and turned them all into a pack of wolves, then restored Nyctimus to life. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Fages (talk • contribs) 21:28, 30 August 2011 (UTC)

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