Talk:Direct grant grammar school

Assessment
I am assessing this article following a request as B/Mid. The article is well written, contains plenty of well cited references, and seems to have most content needed so hence I am giving it B-class. The importance of school type articles is more ambiguous than for individual school article, as this article contains important history and is linked to many important schools, I am giving it Mid importance. Its UK only nature however would make High/Top importance inappropriate. Camaron · Christopher · talk 14:57, 11 August 2009 (UTC)

Title
I am surprised at the article title. I attended one of these schools in the 1960s. At that time, they were never called "direct grant grammar schools" - they were simply "direct grant schools". The term "grammar school" was used, in contrast, for selective schools in the national state education system - the direct grant schools were seen as independent of the state system. I am no expert on the education system or legislation, but I would like to see sources that explicitly use the term "direct grant grammar school". Ghmyrtle (talk) 10:52, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * You may well be right, but the selection for the direct grant places made them part of the grammar system, and I believe a number of them had 'Grammar' as part of the individual school name- Manchester, King Edward's Birmingham, etc.
 * Gravuritas (talk) 13:21, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Both terms appear in the sources. For "direct grant grammar school", we could start with the Donnison Report, Report on Independent Day Schools and Direct Grant Grammar Schools, which is the definitive account of these schools, or the Direct Grant Grammar Schools (Cessation of Grant) Regulations 1975.  More uses can be found with a Google books search.  There were also a few direct grant technical schools and over a hundred direct grant special schools.  Kanguole 16:52, 29 March 2015 (UTC)


 * Well, there you are... I've learned something new today. Thanks.  Ghmyrtle (talk) 20:15, 29 March 2015 (UTC)

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Fees after 1944
By the interwar period I believe many county councils were providing financial help for bright kids from modest backgrounds who won places at grammar school (my own uncle won a place at grammar school but could not afford to go, in Cwmbran circa 1930, but Ted Heath was, I think, given help by Kent County Council in the late 1920s/early 1930s).

The books I've read seem a little confused about what happened to fees in the 1944 Butler Act. Some books say Butler's Act guaranteed free secondary education for all. Others say that some or all grammar schools still charged fees for some pupils. If so, did this continue until the grammar schools were absorbed into the comprehensive system a generation later, unless they went private again?

I'd be interested to learn. Preferably from somebody who actually knows what he is talking about and can point us to an authoritative source, focussed on the specific matter in hand (eg. a concrete statement as to whether or not fees were still payable, by a writer who has clearly given the matter some thought or research, not an oblique, tangential and not necessarily accurate reference in a book focussed on something else).Paulturtle (talk) 12:05, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Doesn't the second paragraph of the "Direct grant scheme" section (and the references therein) address this issue? See also Grammar school for the two types of grammars.  Kanguole 12:29, 25 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Thanks, that's useful. I think some writers might be being a bit sloppy, or wikipedia editors summarising them sloppily.Paulturtle (talk) 13:27, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Have you found something in this article that needs clarifying or fixing? Kanguole 14:03, 25 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I'm sure it's fine. It's the inaccuracies in other, more general, articles which need fixing.Paulturtle (talk) 03:20, 27 May 2018 (UTC)

United Kingdom?
The article has recently been edited to suggest these were a UK-wide phenomenon, yet the only legislation mentioned applied only in England and Wales. THis needs clearing up. DuncanHill (talk) 19:58, 2 December 2021 (UTC)