Talk:Distilled water/Archive 1

Another 'myth' type statement that could be added
I have also seen examples of super-cooled pure (distilled) water which does not actually freeze when cooled below 0 degrees centigrade. However, the water can immediately turn into ice with just a simple tapping of the container or when it is poured out. This could be included under the 'myth' section. 124.185.39.152 22:10, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Except that this is not a myth. Freezing of liquids at or near the melting point requires some kind of nucleation for crystals to start to form. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.55.55.37 (talk • contribs)

Overall cleanup
This article is a bit of a mess and could use a cleanup from someone who actually knows a lot about the topic. 68.101.130.214 02:31, 10 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Your comment is rather snide. Are you implying that contributions thus far, are not factual? Please sign if you expect your main page comments to remain.E8 16:00, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Steam generator irons - using distilled water
I've just discovered that my brand new steam generator iron requires replacement filters at a rate of 12 per year. The yearly cost for these works out at two thirds of the total purchase price (subject to increases in postal charges). I am not amused. "A" Level Chemistry memory to the rescue! It's somewhat hazy unfortunately, however, isn't it the case that distilled water, when boiled, leaves no residue? As such, it'd be ideal for the iron. Has anyone some informed comment for me, please? Hettymarkson 13:03, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Pros and cons
I made this section independent of the "Drinking distilled water" section as it contains a discussion of costs as well as health issues. E8 01:43, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Aviation use
My source is the book named "Boeing 707/720 - Jim Winchester Airlife's Classic Airliners". Airline mentioned to use it was Qantas. RGDS Alexmcfire

1) According to Boeing 707, these airliners have been out of service for over two decades. The application is interesting, but without further detail on why it was necessary to use distilled water, it appears irrelevant (merely trivia). Can you provide more detail? 2)You still need to properly cite this source. 3)Your addition is fragmented. Please edit for readability.--E8 (talk) 01:38, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Humidor
I removed the fact tag from the humidor application. This information is readily available on the web and is mentioned on the Humidor main.--E8 (talk) 01:58, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Types of distillers
The various types of equipment used for distilling around the world, should be added. I started with the famous inventors method, but there are others. Showing what percentage of various nation's water supply is distilled, would be a good addition to this article as well.  D r e a m Focus  01:41, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

HEALTH ISSUES
I am going to take out the "adverse health effects" unless someone points out to a good article stating that indeed drinking distilled water is dangerous. This can not be right! Distilled water is water. The only difference is that minerals give some flavor to water. But the idea that such a solution is so hypotonic that it will "suck" out minerals from the body is nonsense. As another person pointed out, tap water (contains some minerals) is also hypotonic to almost every single fluid in the human body. Also, the GI system is well protected from such events. This assumes that human cells are not protected by water channels, mucus, and powerful ion pumps that take care of the fact that we drink HYPO- and HYPER- tonic solutions ALL THE TIME!!!Reefpicker 02:59, 6 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Seems fine to me. The linked summary-of-a-study indeed supports your text and not the previous. I hate when people do that. Jeh 06:51, 6 April 2007 (UTC)


 * I think you should include this information with citations: "tap water (contains some minerals) is also hypotonic to almost every single fluid in the human body. Also, the GI system is well protected from such events.  This assumes that human cells are not protected by water channels, mucus, and powerful ion pumps that take care of the fact that we drink HYPO- and HYPER- tonic solutions ALL THE TIME!!!" This seems like the information need in the "Pros and Cons" Section.E8 14:14, 8 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Removed tangential/questionable section Reefpicker commented on; replaced with similar, more specific information, complete with two new citations from peer-reviewed sources. I think this section is far from complete, but at least it now contains some valid information.E8 14:14, 8 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Is this statement --> "The cost of distilling water (about 0.04 to 0.10 Euro or USD per litre in 2005) prohibits its use by most households worldwide," related and/or necessary? I think it needs to be located in another, more appropriate, section or removed.E8 14:14, 8 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks for taking the time to add that information. I think its a lot better now.  I still do not  think that drinking Distilled water has any effects on the mineral balance in the body but oh well, I do not have time to look for information in the primary sources.  Also, it should be pointed out  somewhere that the addition of minerals affects the taste of water.  I dont think thats there. Reefpicker 21:21, 11 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Restored recent edit by Gnowitall. I feel the detail removed was useful as this site has international readers. A change in wording would be fine if the same level of detail is maintained. Thanks


 * I oppose including any claim of adverse health effects of drinking distilled water without referring to several, supportive scientific studies published in peer review journals. If there is no body of scientific evidence supporting the claim, it should be removed. Also, the human body obtains the vast majority of minerals from food, not liquids.  If you would like to read about debunking the myth of distilled water as unhealthful, then read this:  http://www.chem1.com/CQ/ionbunk.html.  I have a Bachelors of Science in MicroBiology from UCLA and I stand by the logic of the Scientific Method, not unsubstantiated propositions. matthew (talk) 23:03, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
 * The "Health considerations" section in Hard water contains multiple sources on this topic. This page has had many issues with spam and point-of-view pushing, and is in need of improvement.--E8 (talk) 17:05, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

Applications
"Some people use distilled water for household aquariums because it lacks the chemicals found in tap water supplies. It is important to supplement distilled water when using it for fishkeeping; it is too pure to sustain proper chemistry to support an aquarium ecosystem."

I feel this should be re-written. ALL water that is introduced to an Aquarium has to be supplemented. Whether saltwater, which salt mix has to be added, or freshwater, additives have to be applied to the water to adjust PH, etc. Although I dispute the neutrality of this entire page, this particular statement seemed way over the top.

Even as an issue of maintaining water levels when evaporation occurs, adding distilled water to the Aquarium would seem optimal. It's completely pure and neutral, which means you would merely be adding volume to the Aquarium. Once the water mixes with the water already in the Aquarium, it's going to adopt everything that is in there. Water is only as clean as the receptacle it is stored in.

I feel this falls under the same line of thought as "leeching". JMiller1978 (talk) 01:58, 24 July 2009 (UTC)JM

I did a rollback on mass deletion
If there are references for the information, then you shouldn't wipe it out in a mass deletion. Thus the reason for my rollback. I went ahead and removed the two unreferenced facts. And the criticism section is not controversial, since its references are official medical sources. I have thus eliminated that tag.  D r e a m Focus  16:18, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Why was this article redirected?
I came here to verify the claims my dentists made earlier today, on why my teeth were so horrid, blaming it on the distilled water I said I drunk. And I found instead a redirect to another page, which doesn't contain all the valid information found here. Anyway, please don't redirect it again. It is a very useful article in itself. Lack of minerals is why my teeth apparently started having parts chip off and fall away, and cavities apparently are everywhere, I not noticing until one appeared between my two front teeth. Minerals make your teeth stronger, a fluoride kills some bad things as well.  D r e a m Focus  01:19, 16 May 2009 (UTC)


 * The minerals in water are inorganic and cannot be absorbed by the body. So if your dental issues are caused by a mineral deficiency, it's because you need to be supplementing these minerals, or eating more of a specific type of vegetable or fruit that contains it. So drinking distilled water would not be the cause. And as far as fluoride, if you brush your teeth regularly with fluoride toothpaste, your teeth should be getting all the fluoride they need. Sounds to me like you should change Dentists.JMiller1978 (talk) 02:09, 24 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree, if you have a double redirect, the solution is to fix the first link, not to undo the second redirect. 65.92.67.202 (talk) 07:22, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Merge proposal to Purified Water
This article overlaps significantly with the Purified water article. I believe the content would be better maintained if this article was merged into Purified Water and a redirect was placed to that article from Distilled Water. I propose the merge begin in 14 days of this posting. Please post your suggestions and thoughts on this proposal here. 65.92.67.202 (talk) 07:16, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * AGAINST MERGE Just noticed this.  I'm against any merge, since the article has valid content for this notable topic, which would not all fit over there, nor have any reason to be placed there.  Distilled water is different than purified water.   D r e a m Focus  20:03, 14 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Against merger for the reasons noted by Dream Focus. Having a single page as home to some of the pro/con arguments common to all types of purified water, but not all purified water types are the same, and they need to be distinct, having separate pages.--E8 (talk) 15:06, 24 September 2009 (UTC)
 * There is enough material here that it would make the purified water article too lengthy. Seems to be no support for a merge, so I'm removing the tags. Gobonobo  T C 08:15, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

Air Conditioner distilled water?
Is the water that accumulates from my air conditioner and dehumidifier distilled water?


 * Essentially yes, but it probably gets contaminated almost immediately by dust on the heat exchangers and probably also by other manufacturing contaminants from the same source. Air conditioners are not designed to produce potable water, so they probably don't.  Velella  Velella Talk 16:58, 7 August 2011 (UTC)

Abbot's water distiller
Hi everyone! I just uploaded an image of Charles Greeley Abbot with the water distiller he invented. I'm not too sure where it might fit in this article, but, it might be of interest to some of you watchers out there! See the image. -- Sarah (talk) 19:17, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

Health Effects
I think it should be mentioned that distilled water is slightly acidic in health effects due to the absorpbtion of CO2 and so it is unhealthy 175.138.110.206 (talk) 02:57, 21 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Do you have any references to back up that claim? I searched around for awhile but couldn't find any.  Would it cause problems when it hit your stomach after drinking it?  How would this damage anything?   D r e a m Focus  00:40, 30 September 2011 (UTC)
 * Doesn't that mean I should be leaving out the tonic in my gin and tonic ? Wouldn't want to cause myself any adverse health effects with this darn CO2 stuff.  Velella  Velella Talk 19:22, 11 April 2012 (UTC)

Rain water is also slightly acidic, due to CO2 pulled from the atmosphere. It is perfectly safe to drink rain water in most places. Drinking slightly acidic (pH 6) water will not change stomach acidity (pH 1.5 to 3.0), in all actuality, adding a bit of alkalinity should help health a bit.

Effects of distilled water on skin
What effect does distilled water have on skin - we know that due to osmosis liquid with less matter dissolved in it (ideally distilled water) penetrates through membrane and tries to water-down the liquid with more dissolved matter in it. Skin cells are like bubbles filled with water in which various matters are dissolved - it should mean that distilled water would go through cell membranes and slightly inflate the cells - and since there are millions of cells - it should (in theory) make the skin look fuller - or not? Where's a before and after picture on that? Would it have a wrinkling effect - like on fingertips when hands are for too long in water or would it have the opposite effect of "swelling" the skin so it is not wrinkled if it was wrinkled in the first place (such as on really old people)? Put something regarding these biological effects in this article - it's too poor on that subject - on youtube, for starters, there is a video that demonstrates how cells can burst open due to osmosis: "Osmotic burst of blood cells Low" ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wliubItqqaA ). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 109.92.83.222 (talk) 19:22, 15 June 2014 (UTC)


 * A good start would be to read Skin which describes how the dermis provides a relatively impermeable layer. Secondly, if skin did allow unrestricted osmosis, we would all inflate every time we had a bath, went swimming in fresh-water of went out in the rain. Thirdly, this isn't anything to do with distilled water, ordinary fresh water would do as well so the question is not really relevant on this page. Fourthly, have you never enjoyed watching the skin on your fingers gone wrinkly in a long hot bath ?. That is about the extent of any osmosis that will occur.  Velella  Velella Talk 19:22, 20 June 2014 (UTC)

Drinking distilled water
There has been a deficit of information in this article regarding the effects of drinking distilled water, which seems to be related to a lack of broad definitive conclusions from peer-reviewed studies.

Some kind of discussion needs to be included in this article regarding drinking distilled water. I propose that we determine a set of agreed upon points that can be worked into a section of the article. Below are some statements (not necessarily verified) as a starting point. Feel free to add to the list or give reasons one should not be used. My position is that if and only if every item on this list can be deemed in error or innapropriate for the article should the issue be dismissed with nothing added to the article. RichG (talk) 07:43, 9 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Many people do claim to drink distilled water.
 * In the US, distilled water is regulated in the same manner as any other bottled water (FDA).
 * Many sold containers are labelled "distilled drinking water"
 * There is no scientific proof that drinking distilled water is any healthier than drinking decent quality tap or bottled water.
 * The american medical association states, "The body's need for minerals is largely met through foods, not drinking water."
 * The FDA states no cautions or warnings regarding drinking distilled water.
 * Bottled and tap water are, like distilled water, also hypotonic to the body's fluids.
 * The pH of distilled water is within the range of other drinking sources.
 * There is a lack of definitive research on the effects of drinking distilled water versus mineralized water.
 * Several medical doctors suggest drinking distilled water
 * Robert D Willix Jr. MD
 * Peter A Lodewick MD, "A diabetic doctor looks at Diabetes"
 * Andrew Weil MD
 * David Williams MD


 * Distilled water is said to taste strange due to lack of salts and minerals.

Health Concern section is inaccurate
The section misinterprets what "negative correlation" means: negative correlation between drinking hard water and instances of heart disease means that drinking hard water is correlated with a decrease the risk of heart disease, not an increase. This is also what article's abstract states. 155.68.153.124 (talk) 23:58, 16 December 2014 (UTC)

I've removed the section entirely now, because the section is irrelevant to an article about distilled water anyway. If anything, it should go on the page about hard water. 155.68.153.124 (talk) 00:07, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
 * There was no mistake in the section; it's a bit confusing for some, but you understood it perfectly well and, as you stated, it followed from the cited work. The segment could certainly be rewritten as it's been changed over time so as to avoid OR {as it was, it required the reader to make a small leap in logic (minerals in water correlated with lower rates of heart disease & distilled water lacks minerals --> ...) and draw conclusions on their own, rather than stating them directly}; this is an important subject that warrants inclusion somewhere (see the above discussion and link).  While there are rules against OR, I haven't seen one that states that facts and sources can't be left for users to formulate their own conclusions (if I'm wrong, link the WP guideline for this and I won't reinsert).  Ultimately, I'm wondering if a single differential page on the health effects of different waters / additives is the best solution - one discussion that distilled, hard, soft, purified, drinking, mineral, tap, and any of other water-for-human-consumption pages can link to.  At the moment, I have too many projects and I lack access to the med content behind paywalls (again, see the above posting), so I'm not positioned well to undertake the big fix.--E8 (talk) 01:43, 17 December 2014 (UTC)
 * I think moving the section to Hard Water would be best, as well as editing for clarity in order to prevent confusion (such as specifying what effects, which can be gotten out of the abstract). I don't know if there's enough content to make give water-related health its own page, but then again, I do not know Wikipedia's policy regarding page creation for something like this. 155.68.153.124 (talk) 04:24, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
 * A few notes: by failing to read the content in question (Hard water already includes discussion on this source and content; the Kozisek (above), from which there is no shortage of content on this subject) you give the appearance of not participating in good faith and/or pushing. The section will be altered based on the rediscovered Kozisek source and supporting materials as they're significantly more thorough.--E8 (talk) 13:09, 18 December 2014 (UTC)

Kozisek source
The last archived link is. The title page states: "Draft for review and comments (Not for citation)." Clearly this can't be used as a source for health/medical claims, and I couldn't locate a formal, finalized publication, but it has reliable citations that can be used. I'll see what relevant documents I can pull up, but I lack access to those in pay-walled databases.--E8 (talk) 16:29, 23 November 2014 (UTC)


 * I found this 2005 report where Chapter 12 appears to be a formally released version of Kozisek's paper. It looks pretty relevant and credible to me. The basic conclusions are, I think, that demineralized water isn't a problem if the necessary minerals are present in the rest of the diet-- but that mineralized water is the easiest way to get some of those minerals. Also, demineralized water will tend to remove the necessary minerals from food cooked in the water, which makes it that much more difficult to get the necessary minerals. Maybe someone with directly relevant healthcare experience could work this material into the article? I don't feel qualified. 71.197.166.72 (talk) 02:17, 18 December 2014 (UTC)


 * Awesome - thanks.--E8 (talk) 05:01, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

Health effects
The rate at which water dissolves a mineral or salt is only mildly effected, if at all, by the purity in these ranges from 0 parts per million to 30,000 parts per million (sea water) according to solubilization rates described by Fick's second law and measurements of diffusion coefficient rates of water - J. R. Jones,  D. L. G. Rowlands and    C. B. Monk Trans. Faraday Soc., 1965,61, 1384-1388, where changes occur only in high saturations where the actual viscosity of water is changed by the dissolved mineral. There is essentially no difference in the rate of dissolving that is attributed to distilled, ultra ultra pure water, which are both at 0 ppm, or tap water, which is at around 225 ppm, or even sea water, which is at 35,000 ppm for dissolving salt or calcite. the primary contaminate in water. If the rate of dissolving is no different, then any concept related to distilled water being more "Thirsty" or being a "more powerful solvent" with different chemical properties", is a myth. This means that the capacity of distilled water to leach minerals from your bones or teeth or blood is no different from tap waters ability to do the same.  The World Health Organization study mentioned here showed distilled water is healthier to drink because of the greater diuretic effect.  This does not imply a different chemical solubilization or solvency of slightly different purity levels of water, as that is a chemical effect, The WHO study was describing an effect on the body which is a complex mammalian biological system.  it is describing a biological effect where bodies recognize or respond to pure water such as rain water, and hard water differently.  The body responds differently to different intakes of substances. Mammals respond to the purity of water by either expending energy on initiating more chemical processes to safely isolate or remove toxins or inorganic minerals it cannot easily utilize or easily get rid of. The body responds to pure water by expending less energy on processes that are reactions to dissolved minerals, metals and toxins and just allows the water to function in a more streamline and normal fashion of helping the body detox in a right-as-rain kind of way. You simply give the body more work to do by suppling less pure water but your body will take advantage of the pure water, not because of some imagined leaching chemical property effect, but because your body does not have to spend energy dealing with build up of inorganic minerals that are very different from food-sourced minerals in terms of bioavailability and safety. Even if your body could make use of minerals that are not bound in organic amino acids compounds, the amount needed to equal even a small amount of food would be a lot of water even if you had very hard water. The dosage for water poisoning, pushing too much electrolytes and causing death, should be about the same. If the electrolytes of the dissolved minerals were a factor would, the dosage decrease needed to cause water poisoning with distilled water as compared to water at 100 ppm, would be exactly the same as the decrease from 200 ppm to 100 ppm so distilled water is not special in its propensity to cause osmotic electrolyte dangers or problems. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 97.123.247.161 (talk) 11:43, 20 December 2015 (UTC)

I feel that under "Health Effects", there should also be a discussion of how distilled water leeches toxins from the system.


 * There should be nothing similar, either about beneficial effects of leeching toxins or harmful ones of leeching minerals and nutrients. Once distilled water dissolves even a tiny bit of minerals or anything else, it would then be only as pure as non-distilled water, and therefore couldn't have any unusual ability to suck out anything. Ken Arromdee 22:20, 9 January 2006 (UTC)


 * There's an old Usenet post on this point: "Body osmolality is about 280 milliosmols, and your average springwater might run 20 or 30. The difference between there and zero, so far as you cells care, is nothing."
 * i.e. no, it doesn't matter if you drink ordinary tap water, spring water, or distilled. Can someone find some more references, or at least recast the above so it isn't a direct steal? Jeh 18:40, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

The linked FAQ points to a site that sells home distillation kits, perhaps this isn't the most unbiased of sources. Jmeeks 7 March 2006 (UTC)

I have also heard that drinking distilled water is bad - it leaches minerals from your system. But I can't find anything to support this. Health Canada's website on drinking water says, "There are no known beneficial, nor harmful health effects associated with the ingestion of demineralized or distilled water." Activated carbon filters are mentioned as they can become saturated or can lead to bacterial growth. They also advise against drinking softened water because of high sodium. Hmm. So where did that concept come from? 198.103.161.1 14:52, 1 September 2006 (UTC) Dalila
 * The concept probably came from a water filter supplier who would rather consumers bought water filters instead of water distillers -- MightyWarrior 15:44, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

There is a staggering amount of unscientific twaddle and nonsense that I've seen when looking at a number of so-called "explanations" for the use or and for the non-use of distilled water. It appears that U.S. "health" web-sites can get away with writing complete non-truths and fictious "science" with impunity (that is, without fear of punishment). -- MightyWarrior 15:44, 1 September 2006 (UTC)


 * This uncited statement was challenged the other day, and it seems worth of discussion: "A purported effect of drinking water in its pure form is a 'more powerful solvent' that helps cleanse toxins from the body." Can anyone confirm or refute this statement? Chemically, demineralized water is a more potent solvent, but in the biological environment of the human body, I don't know that this enhanced solvency holds. Anything definitive would be very useful.E8 04:02, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

FWIW: I have been drinking distilled water exclusively for 15 years with no ill health effects whatsoever. I am also a former kidney dialysis patient and current kidney transplant patient. Never was I advised by ANY doctor to avoid distilled water. In fact, it's consumption was recommended by most I spoke with. The health benefeits far outweigh any possible detriments. If you drank distilled water exclusively AND had a very poor diet, maybe it would be bad for you. Until I see hard facts from reliable sources stating distilled water is dangerous, I will continue to drink it regularly. It appears many posters describe a "worst case scenario" regarding distilled water's effects. Come on guys, it's JUST water! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.65.13.254 (talk) 07:20, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

Distilled ocean water?
I'm assuming that you can take ocean water, distil it and drink it. Would I be correct in this assumption?
 * Yes.

Is this where most distilled water comes from?
 * No.

What do you think sailors drink.??? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.2.170.114 (talk) 22:22, 20 December 2015 (UTC)

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Citation Needed overuse
Someone has taken a rather liberal and unescessary use of Citation needed in the health benefits area. I believe this was likely in effort to promote distilled water against critical opinion. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2601:C8:C100:AFDC:EDA3:43B2:FD1:EAC2 (talk) 01:00, 8 April 2017 (UTC)

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Distilled water
Just a wild thought: Is water collected from a hehumidifier considered to be distilled water? It is great for the plants in the house. Thank U 69.136.152.186 01:56, 17 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Wouldn't it be a bad idea to water most plants with distilled water? Wouldn't it drain them of nutrients if you let excess water run out of the pot as you water?  Just a thought.--Bfesser 02:48, 18 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The opposite is actually true. Plants are in most cases evolved and adapted to rainwater, not tapwater containing minerals.  The primary quality defining distilled water is its similarity to rainwater in its lack of mineral and chemical content.  Like humans and other animals, plants primarily extract minerals, not from water, but from the soil, their "bread," as it were.  Exotic plants and fish which are sensitive to water quality thrive on distilled water, as would your dog or cat, if you were inclined to provide it.  If you buy a shamrock, for example, the greenhouse/florist will recommend that you water with rainwater or distilled water rather than tapwater.  Just sayin'  rags (talk) 01:35, 29 January 2019 (UTC)

electrolytes question
In the Health effects section is mentions that it lacks minerals, which you can get from foods, and also that it pulls electrolytes from your body. You can get electrolytes from various foods also. Does it still cause a disruption even if you have plenty in your body?  D r e a m Focus  04:17, 8 February 2020 (UTC)