Talk:Drinking the Kool-Aid/Archives/2012

Kool Aid vs. Flavor Aid
The Kool Aid vs. Flavor Aid issue needs to be cleared up one way or the other in the article. Depending on which section you read, it was either definitely Flavor Aid (first paragraph) or definitely some of both (Jonestown Massacre section). And in trying to read here in the talk section for some clarity, I can't tell what position the above editor believes.

I'm sorry, is this for real? The largest massacre of US citizens in history next to 9/11 and you fuckers wanna sit around and argue over which corporate brand to pin it on? What kind of twisted sub-human $@%@ prioritizes this kind of issue enough to even warrant its discussion? Piss on the lot of you. For fucking shame. 199.168.239.245 (talk) 20:43, 9 October 2012 (UTC)

Too much emphasis on Jonestown?
Some recent oral histories, memoirs, and journalistic accounts argue that many members of the People's Temple did not "drink the kool-aid" in the idiomatic sense. That is, many residents of Jonestown did not follow Jones blindly and commit suicide; rather, they resisted and were murdered. Examples:, , ,

Those objections notwithstanding, "drink the kool-aid" is typically used to mean "follow blindly," and some users probably think of Jonestown (or possibly the Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test) when they use the phrase.

I would suggest that this article should focus not primarily on Jonestown, FlaVorAid, and Kraft Foods, but on the use of the phrase (e.g., ), with its etymology as only one aspect of that. Cnilep (talk) 17:23, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

First Usage ?
FWIW, I am, I believe the first person to use the phrase in reference to a person's gullibility (or, maybe one of several who began using it simultaneously). I first used "you drank the Kool Aid" in the spring of 1979 in a suburb of Vancouver, Canada. In the fall of 1979, I moved to Portland, Oregon, and began using it there. In the spring of 1984, I moved to San Diego, California. I don't believe I used the phrase in San Diego, or if I did, only rarely. I eventually returned to Portland. The first time I heard the phrase in the media was in the mid 1990s on a Portland talk radio show. Lars Larson (now a nationally syndicated talk radio host) used it while substituting for host Bill Gallagher on (I think) KXL radio. It stuck in my head because, up until that point, I had not heard anyone outside my immediate circle of late 1970s / early 1980s friends use the phrase. I did not hear it used in the national media until several years later. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.20.216.103 (talk) 00:17, 11 November 2012 (UTC)

Racist Implications
I'm curious, would I be getting into an edit war if I added the use of Kool-Aid as a racial stereotype? While such stereotypes are difficult to document, Kool-Aid is a black American stereotype just like fried chicken and watermelon. Of course, people who use the phrase "drinking the Kool-Aid" in reference to a president they disagree with do not intend the phrase to be taken as a racial stereotype, but the fact that President Obama is black indicates that it may be interpreted as a racist stereotype. As for documentation of the term as being racist, there were separate incidents in 1991 and 1992 in which black Americans celebrating MLK day in St. Louis were sprayed with Kool-Aid from a fire hose. The guilty parties plead guilty and it was considered to be a federal civil rights violation. Here's the court document: http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/Pre_96/February95/84.txt.html Moralmoney (talk) 05:01, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Comments: My first reaction is that it's a stretch. HOWEVER: 1. It's news to me, and therefore if demonstrably significant, it becomes relevant information. I respect your claim of Kool-Aid as a "Black-American Stereotype"; however while I may be naive, I've personally never seen sufficient indication of cultural/racial-bias among those who drink "Kool-Aid" vs those who drink it or various other drink products. Not enough for the expression "Drinking the Kool-Aid" to become racially stereotypical. 2. The topic here is the expression "Drinking the Kool-Aid" (ie: the act of accepting something powerful and dangerous on extreme-blind-faith) -- not use of Kool-Aid beverage as a racial stereotype -- (a subtle distinction, a different topic, perhaps?)? 3. I question the source-significance of applying the existing expression to current President Obama any more than applying it to Tea-Baggers, or other current applications. Not everything associated with the President becomes racial. Give it a try; however, to me priority is: "Jonestown", "Acid Test", "Race/Cultural", or "Applications" ??? HalFonts (talk) 17:24, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

ADD TO FIRST PARAGRAPH — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ardee444 (talk • contribs) 17:33, 5 July 2011 (UTC) I think the first paragraph should be amended at "The phrase usually implies that the ideology in question is not good."

More correctly, the statement should be: "Whether such organizations are 'good or bad', the "...Koolaid" statement says that such entities also carry the seeds of their own destruction."

The reason I say this is because I'm looking it up while reading an article about NASA in which a reporter covering this Organization makes the observation. Well, NASA isn't "bad" but it undeniably shot itself in the foot. (Ardee444 (talk) 17:31, 5 July 2011 (UTC))
 * what you bitchin about @Moralmoney? nothin racist about it. grow an education

FYI
I have noticed that the use of this phrase and also the word "sheeple" are now being considered a violation of Godwin's law, specifically as a corollary of the law. Use it and you have marked yourself as a fool and lost the debate. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.108.140.32 (talk) 22:19, 29 May 2012 (UTC)