Talk:Dual-clutch transmission/Archive 1

Tidy up discussion (gearbox types vs trade names)
This Dual-Clutch stub is very good (description). The term Dual-Clutch is a good generic term for what Volkswagen Group are calling DSG (and the manufacturer BorgWarner call DualTronic). Should the DSG and Dual-Clutch artcils be linked/merged or better matched to each?

My thinking is this: (I am very new to WikiPedia, so go easy on me!) Mark 23:00, 8 September 2005 (UTC)
 * The new Dual-Clutch article should carry the in-depth explanation.
 * The DSG article should detail the VW / BorgWarner usage in which models etc.


 * I generally agree: link to DSG, but don't merge this w/ DSG -- or else it will be hard to separate again, as will eventually be necessary since Veyron, Koenigsegg, and some Porsche street-legalized 956/962's manufactured by Joest, Dauer, etc. already have diffeent DCT's than the DSG, and more automakers also have their own DCT's in the works. This article can carry a short description of (and link to) each brand-name of DCT, such as the DSG page.  And as more DCT's spring up, if their proprietary technology is markedly different, it's best to just link to a page for each company's DCT for in-depth descriptions if and when people provide that for each company. (P.S. I'm not new to wikipedia, but I'll be too lazy to sign up and login for as long as they allow it, LMAO.) --Jeff

'Twin-clutch gearbox'' redirects to this page. How do I change the link in the box so that it will go directly to this page? &mdash;Gm1121983 9:37 20 April 2006

Okay, I moved the article to Twin-clutch Gearbox, and I moved the talk page accordingly. Does anyone know why the discussion tab is still in red print? &mdash;Gm1121983 17:28 20 April 2006
 * Well, why is it red!? &mdash;Gm1121983 18:44 20 April 2006

According to reference[1], the first dual clutch transmission was patented by Rudolph Franke, a Professor at The Darmstadt Technical University in 1940. It was applied and tested in a truck but never went into production.

The following line in Wikipedia article could be incorrect - 'This type of gearbox was invented by Andolphe Kégresse just before the outbreak of World War II, but he never developed a working model'.

[1]. Matthes, B., 2005. 'Dual Clutch Transmissions - Lessons Learned and Future Potential', Society of Automotive Engineers, Paper #: 2005-01-1021.

twin clutch is not same as multi plate clutch
"Twin clutch" or "dual clutch" contains two clutches that can be connected to for exampel odd/even gears. Twin clutch is not the same as a "multi plate clutch" which is one clutch with multiple plates connected to one shaft. For eample the Koenigsegg CCX has a multi disc clutch, and not a twin clutch, and should therefore not be mentioned on this page even if it's multi plate clutch contains two discs.

Each of the two clutches in a twin clutch can contain multiple clutch discs as they do in for example the VW DSG.

Another form of twin clutch is the combination of transmission clutch and power take off clutch. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.248.10.91 (talk) 19:52, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

basic info missing
a regular clutch, is needed for 1st and R?...other shifts are manually commanded but carried out by computer? Since there are two neutrals, the computer does something similiar to double-clutching when shifting? CorvetteZ51 13:12, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

How much does this help acceleration? Especially on turbo charged engines it should be of great benefit that you don't have to let go of the throttle, right? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.227.28.208 (talk) 14:49, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

Porsche PDK
Today (June 6, 2008) Porsche announced that the new 911 will include the PDK. This is worth noting in the article. Reference: http://www.porsche.com/usa/aboutporsche/pressreleases/pcna/?lang=none&pool=international-de&id=2008-06-06-01 MisterRisky (talk) 15:36, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

dctfacts.com is not a reliable source
dctfacts.com, a site which is cited extensively in this article is not a reliable source. It is a blog-style collection of DCT information sponsored by a chemical company. If DCT references are to be given then they should come from trusted industry publications and news sources. What do others think? --Biker Biker (talk) 22:56, 30 October 2009 (UTC)


 * I stongly disagree. DTCfacts categorically IS a reliable source, and furthermore, all the given citations are totally and utterly verifiable by various 3rd party sources (so weather any individual has any 'difficulty' in accepting the citations as 'truth' is not a justification for not including them).  DTCfacts is produced by the extremely highly regarded Lubrizol Corporation;  Lubrizol is highly respected by virtually all worldwide automakers, and oil companies.  Lubrizol is also completely independent from any of the automakers and oil companies (though naturally, it does carry out 'business' with them).  Furthermore, Lubrizol is listed as a Fortune 1000 company - so hardly some upcoming new-shot company.  Finally, DCTfacts clearly has articles from ALL users and suppliers of DCTs (whom also happen to use manual and conventional auto transmissions) - so they could not be described as having a bias either!
 * And you think that 'motorcycle-usa.com' and similar (no doubt a bunch of journalists without any kind of professional peer-reviewed qualifications) is more of a reliable source than DCTfacts? I would personally put my trust in professionally educated sources, rather than journos whos opinions can be skewed 'advertising revenues'.  Kind regards.  78.32.143.113 (talk) 10:52, 31 October 2009 (UTC)
 * It looks quite professional but lack some info I cant find a word from Fiat clutch there, but oddly Renault is there when its going to release one year later... generally I think we should use wide variety of different sources and not use one as main source --Typ932 T&middot;C 13:10, 31 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Typ932, I can't actually recall seeing the Fiat DCT on DCTfacts (so my bad in that example!) Anyway, I hope you agree that there are now a very wide range of differing sources cited on this subject.  78.32.143.113 (talk) 14:18, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Cost and adoption
Anybody come across reliable sources that state a cost or price premium for DCTs? I am interested in how much more they cost and its effect on mass market industry adoption. Ng.j (talk) 16:59, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

Serious problems through out
I can't say I'm much a gear head, but I suspect the description section of this article is largely indecipherable even to an expert. The description of the system's operation is largely missing, and the reason for its use is entirely missing (i.e., its stated why it's better, but why is it ABLE to do that?). Consider, for instance, the statement about torque being applied to both at the same time -- well sure, but HOW?

Moreover the majority of the article consists largely of listcruft. This is subject to constant change and really shouldn't be here at all.

Maury Markowitz (talk) 14:23, 2 March 2012 (UTC)

Agreed. As someone who is very familiar with the operation of both manual and automatic transmissions I find this entire article to be thoroughly unhelpful in its description of the actual operation of dual clutch transmissions.

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: page moved. Vegaswikian (talk) 20:24, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Dual clutch transmission → Dual-clutch transmission – The compound modifier should take a hyphen; see MOS:HYPHEN. It is hyphenated in most book sources. Dicklyon (talk) 16:58, 4 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Support per WP:HYPHEN. This is not controversial.  —  AjaxSmack   23:30, 4 March 2012 (UTC)
 * Just do it! Maury Markowitz (talk) 16:59, 5 March 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

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