Talk:Economy of Russia/Archive 1

Trade data is wrong
Export: $162.5 bln, Import: $92.91 bln

Right data (Central Bank of the RF): Export: $183.5 bln, Import: $96,3 bln

***
I've added a new section on the post-Communist transition, focusing on structural adjustment refroms, macroeconomic stabilization, and privitization. Shock therapy and the Washington Consensus are controversial subjects too. I'd appreciate if someone could look over that section.

172

This figure of GDP per capita (purchasing power parity) is wrong: $$\frac{\mbox{GDP - purchasing power parity}}{\mbox{population}} = \frac{620.3 \mbox{ billion } \$}{145470197 \mbox{ people}} = 4264\$ \neq 7700\$$$

It would also be higher than of most central european countries, and that's clearly absurd. I'm replacing it with saner value 4200 unless somebody has better estimates. Taw 14:09 21 May 2003 (UTC)i love trey songz 4 life

Commonwealth of Independent States
There needs to be a section on this, I'll look at how to fit it in and structure it, though if anyone else has the time to I'd be grateful. Grunners 00:27, 21 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Some work needed
With some work, this could be a pretty good article. Let's get it up to featured status like Economy of Africa. I'll do some work, trimming it down where needed, adding Wikilinks, adding an info-box (like in Economy of Africa), and adding some pictures. 172 10:36, 29 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Rule of law
an economy operating on the basis of market forces, private property and the rule of law.
 * You wish.--Jerryseinfeld 00:58, 8 Jan 2005 (UTC)

dreams are free Libertas

Uncovered topics
Some of the most important problems left uncovered here. If Western sovetologists don't know abour these problems or ignore them, their articles don't worth a paper on which they are printed.
 * Criminalisation of Russian economics. Most businesses pay money to local mafias for "protection". This is called "krysha" (roof).  Sometimes, bandits kill businessmen or their relatives or demand arbitrarily high sums of money which they unable to pay.  In such circumstances, it is very hard to create a normal business.
 * Corruption. It is impossible to run business in Russia without bribing officials.

Another uncovered topics
 * No discussion for Putin's plan for doubling of GDP. It is not even mentioned.
 * No annual statistics for GDP (nominal or PPP). Only GDP for 2004 is given.

--Urod 04:33, 14 September 2005 (UTC)

GDP recovery 1999-2005
Given strong growth from 1999-2005, has Russian GDP recovered to its pre-collapse peak? What is the index of current Russian GDP, if pre-collapse peak is given to =100?
 * Yes, it has recovered just this year(2007). Now the GDP is higher than in Soviet Union in 1990.

-A.Rod

Someone needs to update the article because it is way old
Russia has hade a boom in the economic sector since 2003 but these article kinda stops around 2000 Someone should type that 2004 was a very good year for Russia and 2005 was even better


 * Yes, I was about to say the same thing. The article's roughly three years out of date, and the last three years have been the best in the post-Soviet era. Palefire 07:04, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Needs even more updating, these last comments are from 2006!Amicianthony (talk) 01:46, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

There is a detailed and up to date article in Russian part of Wikipedia, I doubt there is any reason to keep this one. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.125.6.1 (talk) 12:58, 28 June 2013 (UTC)

POV and updates
The section "Economic reform in the 1990s" is very long and sounds like it may have been copied from a Library of Congress article (which is in the public domain). It should probably be audited for POV by someone familiar with the recent economic history of Russia. I removed this particularly non-neutral paragraph:


 * In mid-1996 the national government appeared to have achieved some degree of macroeconomic stability. However, longer-term stability depends on the ability of policy makers to withstand the inflationary pressures of demands for state subsidies and easier credits for failing enterprises and other special interests. (Chubais estimated that spending promises made during Yeltsin's campaign amounted to US$250 per voter, which if actually spent would approximately double the national budget deficit; most of Yeltsin's pledges seemingly were forgotten shortly after his reelection.)

This section also seems to only consider events up to 1996; it should really be more integrated with discussion of later events when assessing the "legacy" of reforms or putting them into a sort of hindsight perspective. -- Beland 16:57, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

The 1996-2006 section also needs to be updated with figures from recent years. -- Beland 17:20, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

Removing POV check. LOC text is within the realm of reasonable discourse on the subject. 172 | Talk 12:32, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

Length and focus
This article is really an economic history of Russia in the 1990s and 2000s. This is interesting and useful information, but other articles, such as Economy of the United States or Economy of the People's Republic of China separate detailed information on the structure of the economy, from the history. Given the length of this article, I think it might be a good idea to move much of the content to something like the "Economic history of Russia", and expand structural coverage here. It would be nice to have a brief summary of the last two decades of reform, for people that just want a quick introduction, and don't really care about the detailed play by play. -- Beland 17:16, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Perhaps the beginning of the article can contain a summary of the structure and performance of the Russian economy today. Such a section can be written along the lines of (say) the regular country reports put out by the Economist intelligence Unit. I disagree with the removal or shortening of content on the transition years, which one must understand if one is to be at all knowledgeable on Russia’s economy. 172 | Talk 22:20, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree with Beland. I have just read this article because I wanted to know about the economy of Russia but I instead came across the economic history of Russia which I did not want to know about at this time.   I then came to the talk page to effectively say exactly what Beland has said.  If there was a move to an Economic history of Russia article, I would support that action.  This article should be primarily focussed on the current Russian economy, how it got to where it is makes for a separate article.  I disagree with 172 completely in that it is not necessary to know what happened in the transition years to be able to understand the current economic picture.  To understand the current political economy of Russia, it would be necessary to know what happened in the transition years but I would expect that an article on the economy would be focussed more tightly on the economy itself. MLA 08:33, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
 * lets make a separate page to summarize the condition of the Russian economy in the transition period.

and this page should be about the current status.--Ifeldman84 16:17, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

Doesn't appear we managed to split. The article seems to have retained a primary focus on historic information rather than current a year since anyone raised the issue last. MLA 15:48, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Budget incorrect
This line: ''The mafia remains a significant force in Russia. The drugs (narcotics) industry alone has a turnover of $8-9bn a year, compared to a state budget of 20bn.'' Yeah alright maybe mafia and drugs but state budget is: Revenues 	$176.7 billion (2005 est.) Expenses 	$125.6 billion (2005 est.) which is in summary table.

Any article on the economy must mention that even though the population is decreasing by 700,000 a year, the fact that income from natural resources are mostly rental and is unaffected by population size will bring an upward pressure to per capita income. For e.g. a decreasing population per se will not reduce per capita income (its mostly neutral), in Russia it will increase it. The other factor that must be mentioned is that while the size of the grey economy is roughly the same in most nations, it is larger in russia and so the economic size will be understated by 5% or so. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.226.9.245 (talk • contribs)

Minor comment
I love the fact that in the 'economic restructuring measures' section, someone has listed the essential/staple food items as 'bread, sugar, dairy products and... vodka.' I thought about removing it but a quick look at the history reveals its been there a long while, so it's staying. It might even be true...

OK, another comment, more serious this time... In the 'natural resources' section, Russia is given as the fourth largest fish producer. But then further down it is stated that 'Russia produces one quarter of all the world's fish'. These two statements are logically incompatible. If Russia is the fourth biggest producer, and produces one fourth, then the top four contries' production alone would add up to more than 100%. And what about all the other countries as well? One of these sentences is therefore wrong, but I'm dammed if I know which one... Thick as a Planck 18:06, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

Divided in two?
I think that something must be mentioned about how the country is increasingly being divided in two. From the Moscow article: "These new Muscovites are attracted by the local economic growth, which contrasts to the stagnation or even decline in most of Russia as a result of sharp polarization of the country in recent years." Esn 22:06, 25 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Actually, I dont think I can agree with you on that. Almost every region is growing economically, roads are being build, so is housing, and infrastructure is being improved. Yes, everything is happening quicker in Moscow, but there is no decline or stagnation. Before you change, you will need to provide concrete examples.

Population Below Porverty Line
I found a 2005 update for the figure provided by US Department of State, so I guess it is pretty accurate. Look: "In 2005, 7.8% of the population lived below the poverty line (with a subsistence wage of $94 per month), in contrast to 38.1% in 1998. However, the gap between rich and poor continues to widen at an unsustainable rate. " - US Department of State, http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3183.htm 24.110.133.226 04:15, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Outdated information
There is so much outdated information. For example, the first sentence stated that Russian economy is 1/2 that of Soviet Union. Well, that is outdated since March 2007, when Russian GDP surpassed Soviet economy of 1990. The are lot more examples like this, so I think that updating the article should be one of our priorities.

Problem in natural resources section
The section 'Natural resources' contains the claim that 'Russia is the world's fourth largest fish producer' and also 'Russia produces one quarter of the world's fish'. These two statements are logically incompatible, since it would mean the top four producers of fish make more than 100%, without even accounting for all the other countries. One of these statements must, therefore, be wrong. But I'm not sure which.

Outdated
Much of the article is hopelessly outdated. For instance, the New York Times reports that "in the first six months of this year, net private capital inflow into Russia was $67.1 billion — more than during the entire first decade after the collapse of the Soviet Union". --Ghirla-трёп- 13:57, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

Graphs and Tables
Currently this is the table in the article:

I will be working on these tables. I hope to get a clearer idea of the size of the post-Soviet collapse of the Russian Economy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Dwarf Kirlston (talk • contribs) 02:31, 9 November 2007 (UTC)

Please, spicify data on 'product per capite by region' Regional product by Tambov region is great smaller than Lipetsk Region (5.61 against 12.86 -http://rating.rbc.ru/articles/2008/07/17/32024526_tbl.shtml?2008/07/17/32024516). On map situation is overturned. Tambov is poor dotation region. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 195.34.254.6 (talk) 19:37, 3 October 2008 (UTC)

I left a comment on the discussion page ofth e graph that only goes up to 2006. It needs to be updated!Amicianthony (talk) 01:45, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Accuracy of measurements, inflation, statement in the "introduction" portion
"Economists have struggled to achieve accurate measurement of the Russian economy, and they have questioned the accuracy of official Russian economic data. Furthermore, the exchange rate of the ruble (for value of the ruble) to the United States dollar has changed rapidly, and the Russian inflation rate has been high. These conditions make it difficult to convert economic measurements from rubles to dollars to make statistical comparisons with the United States and other Western countries."

I've removed this seemingly biased and politicized paragraph. Inflation does not interefere with economic accounting when it is measurable, as data can be indexed for inflation. In fact, I am an economics student and I had an assignment on indexing data to inflation a week ago, it is not hard to do with office excel. Further, all countries experience inflation. Russia's inflation is not too high and is by large driven by exports of commodities. Core inflation is fairly low when compared with the rest of the developing, growing economies. It appears to me to be someone's attempt to discredit the recent economic growth. Further, saying that "economosts" have struggled to do something is not an academically acceptable statement. Who are these "Economists"? You? Either cite or remove this statement. Further, if you wish to use the plural "economists", it is improtant to cite several studies which agree on this.

Dbullet 21:52, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

The amount of "External debt" in "Public finances" is misleading, should be 10 times less
Since it is headed "Public finances", the correct amount for the external debt of Russia is $44.9 billion as of January 2008. Source: Russian ministry of finances (http://www1.minfin.ru/ru/public_debt/external/structure/)

If you count all foreign loans by private corporations, then it is not "public finances". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.237.244.226 (talk) 01:58, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

"The Indian Rupee/Economy of India"
"THE ECONOMY OF INDIA"????? "THE INDIAN RUPEE?" This is a huge mistake. Monumental and insane. How could you mistake Russia for India? Who did this? Own up, accept responsibility and accordingly RESIGN FOREVER from editing Wikipedia Articles.

The top right column apparently is called this instead of the "Economy of Russia" "The Russian _____". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.124.106.17 (talk) 00:17, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

HUGE MISTAKE, INCREDIBLE OVERSIGHT of MONUMENTAL proportions deserving swift judgement from the moderators. This person needs to have the book thrown at them. How could you possibly face your History professor? How do you sleep at night?

Simple amazing and incredible. Disregard this message if the problem was caused by a database glitch.

76.124.106.17 (talk) 00:09, 18 March 2009 (UTC) Jon D.H.

Seems that the problem is indeed caused by some sort of Table glitch. I tried to fix the issue that Jon pointed out but the edit page shows the correct information, for some reason the "Economy of India" is still shown when the page is loaded. Has to be some sort of glitch. If a moderator could investigate that would be great. Thanx.76.124.106.17 (talk) 00:36, 18 March 2009 (UTC) Jimbo

Improving the article
I'm thinking of starting to work on this article in the future. I'd like to hear what others think is wrong in this article and what should be improved. Any suggestions would be helpful. Offliner (talk) 05:45, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Currently there is too much economic history while not enough info on the present situation in different sectors. There should be info on the following things:
 * infrastructure: railways and roadways, waterways and seaways
 * space technology
 * aviation and aviaindustry
 * nuclear energy and technology
 * pharmacology production
 * modern medical equipment production
 * tourism
 * Some of this things are set by the President Medvedev among top 5 priorities for Russia's modernization . Greyhood (talk) 09:54, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, I agree with these. I think we should split off some of the history to a new article such as Economic history of Russia. It seems that (unbelievably) there is almost no information at all about the energy sector (oil & gas companies), so this should definitely be added. The article Petroleum industry in Russia is in a poor state, so maybe I will improve it first. I've been working on User:Offliner/Space industry of Russia, and I have many sources about this sector, so I will be able provide material about it in the future. I also have some knowledge about the defence and machine building sectors. The other sectors (pharma, tourism, nuclear and infrastructure) - I probably won't be able to provide much material about those. Offliner (talk) 10:17, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, I can add some material about infrastructure, nuclear and tourism myself. But it would be nice if somebody restructured the article first, removing most of the history and listing the main sectors of Russian economy. Greyhood (talk) 11:56, 16 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I just removed 60% of the article, as almost all of the material was unsourced, and most of it also not really relevant to economy of Russia. I moved some material to Economical history of the Russian Federation, and also deleted all material that was actually describing the economy of the Soviet Union and not the economy of Russia. Next thing to do is to rewrite the sectors chapter. Offliner (talk) 10:30, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

Lead
I removed a slightly POV and misleading sentence from the lead. State ownership of companies in Russia is not higher than it Western European economies. Oligarch speculation also isn't lead material. And Russian economy is totally different from SU's; the comparison is POV and not useful. We should write a new and better lead after article overhaul is done. Offliner (talk) 11:51, 25 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I have added much information on Energy, Science and Technology, Transportation and Tourism into Russia article. I believe these sections could be fully or partially taken right into this article. Greyhood (talk) 12:58, 25 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I think that's a good idea. Offliner (talk) 10:08, 26 October 2009 (UTC)

academic graduates
Re: this. Since Russia also has the largest population in Europe, wouldn't it make more sense to have a graph which shows graduates in tertiary education PER CAPITA? If your country has like 5 people, like Belgium, it's sort of hard to have hundreds graduate from the universities. Or at least have both kinds of graphs. (Similar comment made over at image page).radek (talk) 01:32, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Europe and asia
can you ad that counted as a whole its the 4th largest economy in asia and fifth largest in europe--Sinny55 (talk) 10:29, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
 * By what GDP parameter, nominal or PPP? Grey Hood   Talk  12:35, 15 August 2011 (UTC)

Comment
Does anyone have a source to prove that macroeconomic policies helped to prevent the Russian economy from going into further recession? Abhijay Talk?/Deeds  00:32, 13 December 2011 (UTC)

This entire article needs to be rewritten!
...starting with the opening section: way too much space devoted to Russia's troubled economic history; just describe its current condition. I suggest the passages that deal with economic history should be moved to the relevant section

Overall the article reads more like an essay, than an encyclopedia piece - not very informative at all.Keverich2 (talk) 16:44, 13 July 2014 (UTC)

I'll be removing outdated, unsourced stuff
This article is poorly written and seriously outdated. Large sections are no longer relevant anymore. Many parts are barely comprehensible, as if someone made a translation from Russian into English using googletranslate. None of this stuff is particularly informative and it's just clogging up space.Keverich2 (talk) 22:54, 23 July 2014 (UTC)

Types of legal entities in Russia
That's a weird section and I don't understand its purpose. Doesn't look like it belongs to this articleKeverich2 (talk) 16:05, 28 July 2014 (UTC)

World Bank or IMF
I've read both tables but people insist on using the IMF table. However, the WB table seems to boosts Russia economy much further than that of the IMF that seems to downplay it, even though the WB has recorded this earlier. The question is, which one would be right? As far as I know, Russia hasn't experienced negative growth since 2012. Wouldn't that make it's GDP bigger rather than smaller? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.141.16.52 (talk) 08:31, 5 May 2014 (UTC)


 * the wolrdbank is the right one why? Because they updated PPP exchange rates rates from 2011, imf uses 2004 figures for russia.

http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/faq.htm#q4c

'''A. The Purchasing-power-parity (PPP) between two countries is the rate at which the currency of one country needs to be converted into that of a second country to ensure that a given amount of the first country's currency will purchase the same volume of goods and services in the second country as it does in the first. In the WEO online database, the implied PPP conversion rate is expressed as national currency per current international dollar. The advantages and disadvantages of using PPP-based exchange rates rather than market exchange rates are discussed in the Finance & Development article "PPP Versus the Market, Which Weight Matters?" (March 2007) and Box 1.2 of the September 2003 World Economic Outlook (WEO). For the latest PPP weights revision, please see Figure 1.16 from Chapter 1 of the April 2008 WEO. For 2003 PPP weights revision, please see Box A2 from the April 2004 WEO. For the 2000 PPP weights revision, please see Box A1 from the May 2000 WEO. The International Comparisons Program (ICP) is a global statistical initiative that produces internationally comparable Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) estimates. The PPP exchange rate estimates, maintained and published by the World Bank, the OECD, and other international organizations, are used by WEO to calculate its own PPP weight time series. Currently, WEO PPP exchange rates are based on the ICP’s 2005 round but these will be updated upon the release of the 2011 round of estimates. For more information, you can go to the World Bank’s ICP page at''' http://www.worldbank.org/data/icp.

-the worldbank uses updated ppp exchange rates only for OECD countries and Eurostat countries as well as Russia which was the closest country to join it at that time. Thats why you see eastern european EU countries and especially Turkey and Russia having higher ppp numbers in world bank because they were the first who got their ppp exchange rate updated. And even China could overtak the US in PPP terms. http://www.cnbc.com/id/101626562 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NEaHyiAIsZE But if you listen to the news you can hear that china and all other developing countries got their ppp rates updated too, so when WB updates all countries to 2011 ppp rates you will see china and india and especially saudi arabia having bigger gdp in ppp. So yeah World Bank is the way to go because eventually the IMF has to update their 2004 numbers to 2011. Why havent they done it before for russia? I dont know they are just mentality retarded institution i guess, but its pointless to change it because many people are too retarded to get it and keep constantly going back to IMF numbers. I have constantly had debates explaining that to people all the time, and they still dont get it.--Crossswords (talk) 14:30, 5 May 2014 (UTC)
 * From the IMF webcite:
 * The IMF is not a primary source for purchasing power parity (PPP) data. WEO weights have been created from primary sources and are used solely for purposes of generating country group composites. For primary source information, please refer to one of the following sources: the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, the World Bank, or the Penn World Tables.
 * I think that settles it. IMF is basically telling everyone to use the WB numbers instead.Keverich2 (talk) 06:10, 19 August 2014 (UTC)

Economic indicators
Hello everyone, I would like to add two indicators to the statistics in the box on the right side:

1) Trade balance latest 12 months in bn US$ 2) Current account balance latest 12 months

Both numbers are the current data availabe on: http://www.economist.com/node/21604509

Does anyone object to this? Be1981
 * I think that table needs annual data, and from a more relible source than Economist.Keverich2 (talk) 17:05, 25 August 2014 (UTC)


 * The Economist Intelligence Unit compiles the data, and Haver Analytics sources them, which also works for the US census bureau; see https://www.richmondfed.org/research/national_economy/national_economic_indicators/ "Data for charts provided through Haver Analytics .."
 * Despite political tensions between Russia and the West and The Economist´s stance on V. V. Putin, The Economist and Economist Intelligence Unit are to be considered RELIABLE cause
 * a)it is a high-quality non-scholarly source and
 * b)they do fact-checking, have a reputation for accuracy and regularly publish corrections if they make a mistake
 * see also here: []


 * the numbers for Russia are
 * a) Trade balance latest 12-months +193.3 billion US$ (Jun)
 * b) Current-account balance of the latest 12 months =+51.5 billion US$ (2nd Quarter 2014)
 * c) percentage of GDP =	+2.9 % Be1981 13:55, 26 August 2014 (UTC)
 * The primary source for Russian macroeconomic statistics is Rosstat. They have the relevant annual figures available on their website, and I'll be sure to post them when I have time. The statbox should use annual, quarterly or monthly figures. Including the numbers for "the latest 12 months" is unusual. It would confuse people imo. Keverich2 (talk) 18:34, 26 August 2014 (UTC)

The Economist is a reliable source (see WP:RS). Rosstat does not fit WP:RS criteria for reliable sources. The Kremlin clearly has a vested interest in ensuring that Rosstat highlights the positive and ignores the negative. --108.45.56.173 (talk) 00:29, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Technology
There are some problems with this edit. If somebody really wanted to say "Russia has businesses that provide internet services X, Y, and Z", then that might be slightly closer to WP:NPOV, but it's still trivial. So what? Any big economy has businesses that provide common types of internet services. As it stands, we have spammy and nationalist content which overinflates the importance of mundane businesses and services. bobrayner (talk) 21:16, 14 January 2015 (UTC)
 * "Russia is one of the few countries in the world with its own national internet search engine" makes it sound like a "national internet search engine" is an actual thing. It isn't. There are lots of countries, lots of search engines, and very rarely is there - or should there be - a 1:1 relationship between them. That's just silly. Google isn't the American national search engine.
 * The same goes for "Russia also has its own email services" and so on. These are all very common things on the internet, usually cross-border, and Russia is no exception.
 * If there is any legitimate reason for restoring the spammy content deleted, please follow WP:BRD. Don't just restore the content without so much as an edit summary. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:36, 22 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Crossswords, why do you keep on restoring this incoherent spam? bobrayner (talk) 21:39, 30 January 2015 (UTC)
 * I've restored the previous version, although I'm hardly convinced that Yandex isn't WP:OFFTOPIC or just plain promotional bloat for this article., you've already been asked to discuss the merit of this content yet, rather than discuss it, you continue to try to sneak it in without so much as an edit summary. If you think it's relevant, follow WP:BRD and please explain why. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 21:06, 31 January 2015 (UTC)
 * its a fact that yandex is the second biggest search engine in europe after google because google has monopoly almost everyhwere except in russia, china (baidu), south korea (naver) and japan & taiwan (yahoo) at least in the more industrialized world. Its no nationalistic talk pointing that out, the econimist even called russia an exception in europe.

http://www.economist.com/node/21555560  You could say that the headquarters of Yandex, Russia's biggest online-search company, symbolises the country's whole internet economy: a bit smaller than expected, but growing fast, and unmistakably Russian. The email stuff etc. was allready removed so i dont u derstand why you bring that up, and i changed national to homegrown it was just some mistunderstanding here. And yes google is spying for the NSA so it is a national search engine for the US in many ways, thats just one of the reasons.--Crossswords (talk) 14:31, 1 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Cheers for the clarification. Could we please stay away from the soapboxing about Google. This isn't supposed to be a venue for parsing the machinations of global hegemony. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 04:51, 3 February 2015 (UTC)

Right source?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Russia#mediaviewer/File:Equivalent_countries_to_the_Nominal_GDP_of_federal_districts_in_Russia,_source_World_Bank_2012.png

For some reason I have hard time believing that map is from the cited source (World Bank) or they have some serious conspiracy with Russia, knowing in advance during year 2012 the Russian future plans. The plot in lower left reminds surprisingly much Crimean peninsula, which was invaded by Russia 2014, which means the map obviously can't be from 2012. I also seriously doubt that any international source would claim Crimea to be (de jure) part of Russia at the moment. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.181.34.216 (talk) 23:19, 6 March 2015 (UTC)
 * It's probably best to ask the creator of the map,, what the sources are. There are none cited on the map at Wiki Commons. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 20:57, 9 March 2015 (UTC)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Russian_federal_districts_by_GDP in this article the sources are, it was a map made by me in for this article made in 2014. I used Worldbank and another source who stated how big the economy of crimea was in 2012. At that time there was no 2013 data available from worldbank. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chinese_administrative_divisions_by_GDP I was inspired by a similar chinese article--Crossswords (talk) 20:20, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
 * Well, the map has been correctly removed by another editor. I don't see how the Crimean economy in 2012 bears any relationship to the RF in 2012. It most certainly doesn't even represent 'facts on the ground'. Please don't try to apply present 'facts on the ground' content retrospectively as if it were a reflection of the reality at that previous point in time. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:00, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

Image. Higher or lower GDP than Russia
Hello Volunteer Marek, why are you keep deleting which was here for years, and allways in the same format. You cannot without reason remove link to images, if they are not even marked as incorrect. If you think that data are in conflict because varies by source, please explain in which case on or contact creator, if user do not reply you can even delete it. This is the proper way. But still, I do not think that on image is something incorrect, or in conflict. Thanks. Jirka.h23 (talk) 13:10, 9 April 2015 (UTC)


 * I did give a reason. You cannot mix data from different sources. The IMF, the WB and the CIA use different methodology (the first two are similar, but definitely different from the third) and the numbers are not comparable. This is pretty basic. If you were writing a paper on gdp, you would not do this (without making some serious adjustments). For Wikipedia purposes the image violates WP:SYNTH and WP:OR. And I don't go to Commons. It's a creepy place.Volunteer Marek (talk) 13:51, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Ok, if you say they are not comparable and cannot be mixed with CIA figures, we can delete all figures from CIA. As it is mentioned on image, data are from Worldbank (only where are no data, they are from CIA). So which country build the biggest worries for you - where are no data from WB, but CIA? I am willing to satisfy you, and take care of it. Jirka.h23 (talk) 15:44, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Hi, . For the purposes of Wikipedia, it's the IMF figures that have 'traditionally' been used for all nation-states. This has been a matter of parity/consistency, remembering that we have articles about all sovereign states, but the majority of these are maintained by regulars as there aren't contributors for these countries active (or even in an economic position to be active) on English Wikipedia. For example, I have my sticky fingers in a lot of pies, so I try to stay on top of a number of such articles like the Solomon Islands and quite a few other unrepresented/under-represented areas of Wikipedia.


 * I'll ping on this issue. Last year s/he nearly got themselves into a position where they could have been blocked over using Worldbank stats. S/he was using Worldbank stats for the Russia article, as well as introducing them on this article. This was causing disruption because Worldbank and IMF figures, while gleaned their results using the same methodology, are slightly different with IMF data being more generic. This lead to Italy and Russia having the same ranking on one of the performance scales.


 * As I recall, I did consider that Crossswords (whose interest and some form of specialised knowledge appears to be in economics) had a compelling argument for the use of Worldbank data, but that using WB data for Russia alone was misleading for readers who have a reasonable expectation that, when looking at rankings and other data comparing economies across the globe, it should be uniform. Changing data/statistics for Russia alone is disruptive. Other editors also preferred to maintain the status quo.


 * Rather than have you waste time on developing an image representing IMF stats, this is probably a good time to consider whether proposing Worldbank statistics should become the community consensus norm to be applied across the board.


 * Naturally, if we choose to do this via an RfC, it can't be decided here. We'd have to have to find an appropriate venue (a crossroads article?) where a solid, representative number of editors/contributors are most likely to find it and be given an opportunity to voice their opinions. Let's wait on Crossswords to respond before the next step. Cheers!


 * P.S. Apologies for the response being so long. I couldn't think of a way of making the issue simpler as it's far more complicated than even this wall-of-text would suggest. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 04:17, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Hi Iryna Harpy. You are right that this should be decided in an appropriate place, I am not sure if here. I am not against IMF stats to be preferable, but if they are not included in an article, in my opinion WB data could be used.


 * However here we are talking about an specific image. If someone would prefer IMF stats, developing an image with IMF stats could be the way, but why not to include the one with WB stats, when the other is not yet avaible. The second thing is, that in my opinion, both stats will do not change anything on this image. If.Volunteer Marek thinks that two sources cannot be used (even in my judgment, they are not in conflict to each other) We could simply change description to either WB or IMF and leave this image as it is. Jirka.h23 (talk) 05:52, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay, Jirka. I understand your position as your latest rework (per the description for the image you've provided) is based on Worldbank figues. I haven't had a moment to compare the WB data with your updated rendition, so please bear with me a little. I'll take a look at the WB stats you've provided for the image (being here, per the information you've provided), and provide a response ASAP.


 * Ultimately, the decision isn't really one for either you or I to make between us. has stated his opinion, and other editors involved in this article should also be given the opportunity to state their case as to whether it's appropriate or not.


 * If I don't get back to you on this issue in the next couple of days, please ping me. I'll be on holiday next week, so won't get an opportunity to comment again until the week after next. Do you really feel that the image is so important that it isn't something that can wait for a couple of weeks? If so, I'll make it a priority before I go away. If it isn't, I'd be grateful if you were prepared to leave it until my return. Apologies if this comes across as putting pressure on you. It's certainly not my intention to do so. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 06:36, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
 * No problem, I will wait for your answer, however I can assure you that the update is correct, this is not the problem. If matters more sources, then, as I have suggested, it could be simply resolved by changing description to either WB or IMF (if it will be sourced). Jirka.h23 (talk) 08:03, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
 * If you make an image which consistently uses one set of figures (and IMF would be the preferred choice) then I got no problem with it.Volunteer Marek (talk) 13:12, 10 April 2015 (UTC)

Hi and. I've just returned and have noted that hasn't chimed in. Under the circumstances, I have to agree with VM that IMF stats are the standard for Wikipedia. I don't see a reason for disqualifying WB stats, but any images would have to depict both as there are differences between the two (World Bank data/stats are more immediate, whereas IMF data is more generalised and easier to follow in terms of linear data that can be quickly and easily updated on a yearly basis for all sovereign states/countries). While IMF data draws on World Bank data, the two aren't mutually interchangeable.

Under these conditions, Jirka.h23, you'd be placed in a position of having to update the World Bank data image on a quarterly basis (at least... which is a big ask of you), while the IMF chart would remain the same until the next financial year. If you're prepared to do this, and keep it up, I wouldn't have any objections to both charts being depicted together under the one subheader. I would, however, recommend that they be created separately so that, should the WB data fall behind, that particular chart could be removed until it's updated.

While this could be understood as being appropriate for this particular article, only IMF data appears to be favoured for the broad-scope articles unless there is a change in community consensus across all nation-state articles.

Any other regular editor input regarding having two charts would be appreciated. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 04:26, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I have created an separate image, using IMF stats. As was demanded. File is sourced. Hope it is resolved now. Happy editing to both of you. Jirka.h23 (talk) 04:57, 23 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Having finally found a moment to compare your new image file against the IMF data, I have no objections to your having introduced it to the article. Thanks for your hard work and patience, ! --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:59, 24 April 2015 (UTC)

Actually, there is still a problem. First, the image should really state the year for which it is relevant. I just looked at the figures for 2014 and, unsurprisingly, the map does not accurately the situation anymore. Also, the original title of the map is 2009-2013. That means an average over those years. But the current map has only 2013, which is misleading. Basically, there should be a separate file/map for 2009-2013 and for particular years. I will upload an updated 2014 version shortly.Volunteer Marek (talk) 20:55, 26 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Volunteer Marek, my pricture do not include any year of figures. I do not wish you keep adding it there, then we have to draw it there every year, this is very annoying. This picture shows newest real data which are valid now. You keep adding data which represent estimates, they are indicated by shaded cells. I do not wish you keep adding them to my picture - they do not represent real data, which I am seeking for at wikipedia. They can be arbitrarily changed by IMF many times throughout the year. Jirka.h23 (talk) 06:34, 27 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Most of the 2013 numbers are also estimates. The 2014 are just as "real" as the 2013.
 * As I've stated before, it actually doesn't make much sense to use per-year numbers, five or so year averages would be better. But that's not what you wanted - you're the one who changed the original image.Volunteer Marek (talk) 06:43, 27 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm also confused as to what you mean when you say "my pricture do not include any year of figures". You used 2013 numbers.Volunteer Marek (talk) 06:45, 27 April 2015 (UTC)
 * "my pricture do not include any year of figures", I meant in the picture, it is annoying to draw it there every year. Why not to change it only in description? Marek, I do not want to use five year averages, per-year numbers look more accurate. However I have checked your data for 2014 and they looks ok. Lets keep it, because shaded cells are in 2013 as well. Also, why have you reverted caption "IMF" to "World Bank"? Could you return back IMF and delete year in the picture? Your changes should be also allways sourced. Jirka.h23 (talk) 07:03, 27 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Volunteer Marek, why did you changed description in image back again to World Bank? Why you do not source your changes? Jirka.h23 (talk) 11:42, 29 April 2015 (UTC)
 * You're right, good catch. I'll fix it.Volunteer Marek (talk) 15:31, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 May 2015

 * per capita           = $8,158 (April 2015) $24,009 (April 2015)

92.44.108.94 (talk) 01:14, 13 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. Where is this to be added? Cannolis (talk) 02:48, 13 May 2015 (UTC)

Error - Reference 41
Xx236 (talk) 06:08, 15 June 2015 (UTC)
 * --Iryna Harpy (talk) 23:22, 15 June 2015 (UTC)

As of 31 December 2007, there were an estimated 4,900,000 broadband lines in Russia
2007 in telecommunication is the past.Xx236 (talk) 05:50, 16 June 2015 (UTC)

The picture
A picture in an infobox should be neutral, it should describe the subject rather than create a propaganda image. The image of the Moscow International Business Center isn't neutral here, the economy of Russia is generally different than the MIBC. Xx236 (talk) 08:10, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Unsourced
Several sections are unsourced (Banking, Agriculture), some quoted sources are old - 2006, 2007, some links are dead.Xx236 (talk) 08:19, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 14 July 2015

 * revenue             = $416.5 billion (2014 est.)
 * expenses            = $408.3 billion (2014 est.)

178.240.208.245 (talk) 09:45, 14 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done Stickee (talk) 01:24, 16 July 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Economy of Russia. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20140531105736/http://english.ruvr.ru/2011/12/09/61946411.html to http://english.ruvr.ru/2011/12/09/61946411.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

Cheers. —cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 12:08, 27 August 2015 (UTC)
 * ✔️ Archived page was bad redirect. Replaced with live version at sputniknews.com. Thanks, . --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:37, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Sanctions
I found it odd that the sanctions in 2014-2015 and their impact on the Russian economy wasn't mentioned anywhere in the article. In fact the word sanctions doesn't appear once in the article. 143.165.48.50 (talk) 14:29, 11 June 2015 (UTC)
 * This article, along with parallel articles, doesn't deal with WP:RECENTISM. There have been enough problems with articles related to Russia and Ukraine being dragged WP:OFFTOPIC and being used for political leverage. There are ample recent events articles dealing with the subject matter specifically, and this article is WP:NOTNEWS. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 22:43, 12 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Irina, I do understand your point. However, this article is already filled with "recentism stuff" and I believe that he made a good point. We have a whole paragraph dealing with only the last year and even pushed into headline. I would say, that if you want to obey the WP:Recentism, this also do not belong here. I would have been for moving this below, where we can also mention sanctions as one of the reasons for this recession. Jirka.h23 (talk) 06:31, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * There is quite a lot of relevant information in International_reactions_to_the_war_in_Donbass, I suppose it would be just matter of rewording that to be more economy focused and adding here. In general I fully support the idea about updating the article with information on sanctions - I don't think it's very much "recentism" if the whole thing goes on for a year now. Kravietz (talk) 06:51, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Mention of the sanctions with economic impact added. Jirka.h23 (talk) 07:12, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Did not mean to stir anything up, I understand how this could be a sensitive topic. The small paragraph you added seems appropriate in scope for now, thank you. Also to quickly address Iryna Harpy's concerns. Recentism: sanctions do seem to pass the "10 year test", in other words 10 years from now these sanctions will likely still be relevant and I think one small paragraph in this massive article will not tilt it too far towards recent events. OffTopic: sanctions are closely tied to and can heavily impact a country's economy and are not off topic. NotNews: sanctions of this scale are certainly not "routine news" and seem to easily meet notability requirements. I understand your reluctance to include information on sanctions, but please don't use Wikipedia policies as a stick to bat away information you may find distasteful. 143.165.48.50 (talk) 19:45, 22 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Okay, I accept that there is consensus among editors that updating the information is WP:DUE. My dominant concern is (and, for the moment, will remain) that, as with other articles, that the content be succinct and not used as a WP:COATRACK for POV-pushing. So long as we keep our eyes on the subject matter in order to contain the content, I have no formal objections. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:47, 23 June 2015 (UTC)

I welcome mention of sanctions, but would agree with Iryna Harpy's concern that we should watch out for POV-pushing. bobrayner (talk) 20:54, 10 July 2015 (UTC)
 * I added a bit about forex reserves, however I did not add what the reserve is made of now, nor their importance. That requires more research using reliable sources. Anyone up for the job? TGCP (talk) 21:24, 9 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Again, I'd be reticent to add too much detail given the broad scope of the article. If anyone wishes to create an article on the current status of the RF economy (that'll pass scrutiny), they're welcome to try. For the purposes of this article, there's no need for a detailed analysis of the current status. --Iryna Harpy (talk) 00:30, 11 September 2015 (UTC)

GDP growth
Hello ZinedineZidane98, please explain me where are your better sources than mine? As I have read document which was sourced before, I have found only comprason of last half a year and this half a year - which certainly does not mean GDP growth, or am I wrong? Anyway source from OECD is, in my opinion, definitely most precise we can find. Jirka.h23 (talk) 15:16, 21 September 2015 (UTC)


 * Hi. Yeah I was little confused myself. Until I realized that the OECD website (https://stats.oecd.org/index.aspx?queryid=350) shows Quarterly growth, not year-on-year.... i.e., how much an economy has grown/shrunk in the last Quarter, not Q2 2015 when compared to Q2 2014.


 * http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/a4b9944c-3f77-11e5-b98b-87c7270955cf.html#axzz3mOfN7M58
 * http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-08-10/russian-economy-shrinks-4-6-as-oil-slump-risks-deeper-recession
 * http://www.cnbc.com/2015/08/10/russian-economy-shrinks-46-in-q2-compared-to-last-year.html
 * http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/08/10/uk-russia-crisis-economy-idUKKCN0QF1JQ20150810
 * http://news.yahoo.com/russian-economy-contracts-4-6-second-quarter-151958069.html


 * ZinedineZidane98 (talk) 17:59, 21 September 2015 (UTC)


 * If it's okay to put 1st quarter growth in there, then it's fine to put in 2nd quarter growth in there, no?  Volunteer Marek   18:46, 21 September 2015 (UTC)


 * .... GDP Growth stats are customarily (and certainly on Wikipedia) given for 12-month periods. The most recent stats available for the 12-month growth rate in Russia report a 4.4-4.6% shrinkage (from Q2 2014 to Q2 2015). If you wanna start putting in Quarterly stats (3 month periods) then that's a whole new ball game. ZinedineZidane98 (talk) 04:41, 22 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree that if we have annual data (quarter to quarter) then that's better than just quarterly. I also think the paragraph in the lede beginning with "There were fears of the Russian economy going into recession from early 2014 ...." should be updated.  Volunteer Marek   14:56, 22 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Yeah, absolutely, lots of things need updating. I'm too lazy to do it just now... ZinedineZidane98 (talk) 15:24, 22 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Guys, you should firstly understand the difference bettween: comparison between quarter (or half) a year and same period over last year, and the real growth of GDP in any period (2014, Q1 2015 etc.) What are Zinedine refering is the comparison (like comparison of Q2 2015 and Q2 2014), not the growth. What are we filling here, is the real GDP growth over some period. Marek, if you will provide realible source providing growth, not the quarter-year by year, I am surely not against it, I do not care if its gonna be quarterly or yearly data. However, it should be filled correctly. Jirka.h23 (talk) 17:39, 22 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Umm... yes... that's what I said. Why are you repeating back to me the mistake that I pointed out to you, that you are making? You're the one who keeps re-inserting the incorrect figure (sourced to Quarterly growth stats, not year-on-year)... why are you doing that? ZinedineZidane98 (talk) 18:27, 22 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Because last annual data we know, are that from 2014 (1). Last quarterly data are from Q1 2015 - 2. What are you refering to, in news agencies, are only comparison of Q2 2015 and Q2 2014, not real GDP growth in that period. Thats why I am inserting the last known data, and I do not care if they gonna be quarterly or yaerly stats. Do you understand now Zinedine? Jirka.h23 (talk) 05:41, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
 * To make it more clear, please read for example: Measuring Economic Growth. (We need the "Quarterly growth at an annual rate" or the "The annual average growth rate". The quarter year-over-year rate is popular among among businesses to avoid seasonal variations, however it does not reflect real GDP growth in that period.) Jirka.h23 (talk) 06:38, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Ummm... whether you measure the 12 months from Jan-Dec, or July-July, it still measures the same thing: "real GDP growth". It's become popular in recent years in the press (and subsequently Wikipedia) to use the most recent 12-month period (Q1-Q1, Q2-Q2) simply because it's more up-to-date, and more useful - a lot can happen in three quarters, as it has in Russia. This is not some innovation I am attempting - you'll find it in the "Economy of..." articles for most of the world's biggest countries. ZinedineZidane98 (talk) 07:32, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
 * Oh.. looks like you still do not understand difference between: comparison of 2nd quarter in 2015 and that of 2nd quarter in 2014 and the growth of 2nd quarter from last quarter (Q1 2015). No, it does not measure the same thing. You are refering to comparison of those two seasons, not to growth of this season. Please, how to make it more simply so you could understand? Jirka.h23 (talk) 10:33, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
 * I'm in that weird bit of Wikipedia again... ok, this is the last I will contribute to this conversation: both figures measure growth, they just take different dates as their starting point. Q2 2014 to Q2 2015 measures growth over a 12-month period, just as measuring from Jan-Dec (Q1-Q4) of 2014, measures growth over a twelve month period. The economy doesn't stop-and-start activity according to the date. Thankyou, and good-bye. ZinedineZidane98 (talk) 11:31, 23 September 2015 (UTC)
 * What are you talking about? There are not any data from Q2 2014 to Q2 2015, again, this is just the comparison of growth in the 2nd quarter of 2015 and that of 2nd quarter in 2014. No, it does not measure a 12-month period. For GDP growth in 12 month period, is allways used Jan-Dec period. Do you understand now? Jirka.h23 (talk) 12:16, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

Nevermind, explaination of differences between measures of GDP to ZinedineZidane is beyond my powers. Now I would now like to clarify practice how to edit GDP growth in infobox. What should get priority? In my opinion it should be the last "quarterly growth at an annual rate" or the "annual average growth rate" (for me does not matter if first data or second, or both), if those data are not avaible then the "quarter by year-over-year". Jirka.h23 (talk) 12:37, 23 September 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 December 2015
GDP Values are wrong. According to provided source IMF website ( http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2015/02/weodata/weorept.aspx?sy=2013&ey=2020&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&pr1.x=91&pr1.y=11&c=922&s=NGDP_R%2CNGDPD%2CPPPGDP%2CPPPEX&grp=0&a= )

Russia 2015 GDP 1,235.858 billion dollars. Russia 2015 GDP(PPP) 3,473.780 billion dollars.

Please update the info.

ДОброМАкс (talk) 03:42, 4 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done -- ferret (talk) 20:05, 15 December 2015 (UTC)

Russia's GDP incorrect?
Russia's nominal GDP on the article is listed as $1.175 trillion, the source is the IMF here. However, on the article List of countries by GDP nominal, Russia's GDP is listed as $1.860 trillion by the IMF. IMF source is here. Which one is the correct one? --AntonioR449 (talk) 20:53, 3 November 2015 (UTC)
 * One link is an estimate for 2015, other is real data for 2014. Jirka.h23 (talk) 12:23, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
 * One is PPP, the other Current prices.Xx236 (talk) 10:51, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
 * So then is the one on this article correct? It seems to really be low-balling the Russian economy.  Also, on both sources it says "Shaded cells indicate estimates".  The $1.175 trillion is shaded, meaning it's an estimate.  And the $1.860 trillion is not shaded, indicating it's not an estimate.  So should the article's GDP be changed?  AntonioR449 (talk) 20:58, 5 November 2015 (UTC)
 * One is 2014 one is 2015.  Volunteer Marek   21:55, 5 November 2015 (UTC)
 * So if I understand correctly, the Russian economy has went from $1.860 trillion in 2014, to $1.175 trillion in 2015? 685 billion dollars, in other words a 37% contraction of the Russian economy?  I'm not questioning it, I just didn't realize the sanctions have hit Russia so hard.  AntonioR449 (talk) 22:15, 7 November 2015 (UTC)
 * It is due to the devaluation of the Rouble (which stands 1:1 with the (not) fall of Oil price at the pump in Russia) that the GDP expressed in Dollars felt 37%, in my opinion. The only real message of this fall is that Russian companies can be buy for relatively cheap by foreign capital, but, that would not happen with a world crisis going on and a positive account balance on the Russian side. In fact the capital is out-flowing, and the reason for this may be not because of the outlook on the Russian economy but because of the present state of neighbouring countries. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.55.183.107 (talk) 20:18, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

Russian financial crisis (2014–present)
Russian economy currently is in a deep recession. But there is no a word about it in the article, for example in 2014–present subsection. 46.71.164.213 (talk) 18:57, 20 November 2015 (UTC)
 * It is not — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.55.183.107 (talk) 20:20, 31 December 2015 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 26 December 2015
DOING BUSINESS 2016 RANK 51	and 54 for 2015. This is wrong in the article!

208.185.6.7 (talk) 15:35, 26 December 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done /wiae   /tlk  14:45, 8 January 2016 (UTC)

misunderstanding of WP:CRYSTALBALL
re:. Please actually read WP:CRYSTALBALL before quoting it as policy. WP:CRYSTALBALL applies to Wikipedia editors not making predictions about the future. It does not prohibit reporting what reliable sources say about the future. This is particularly true about economic forecasts. And anyway, WP:CRYSTALBALL is about articles, not text in articles.

Please stop trying to WP:GAME policies which aren't even appropriate.Volunteer Marek (talk) 18:33, 10 February 2016 (UTC)


 * What part of "Wikipedia does not predict the future" do you not understand? Athenean (talk) 18:36, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
 * I understand that perfectly fine. What you don't seem to understand is that this isn't *Wikipedia* predicting the future, it's a *reliable source* making a notable forecast. See the difference?Volunteer Marek (talk) 18:41, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
 * Except that when you put that in a wikipedia article, it is then wikipedia that predicts the future. Btw, I take it your silence on "There were fears" means you have understood that it's weasel wording.  Athenean (talk) 18:43, 10 February 2016 (UTC)
 * No, because - one more time, it's not that hard to understand - the text has a source in it so the claim is verifiable and it's that source that makes the claim.
 * And you can take "my silence" however you want. I don't really care about whether it says "there were fears" or "it was at risk", I don't see much substantial difference there. So I kept your rewording. What I *do* care about is you pretending that it's about a couple of words, when in actuality you're 1) removing a bunch of well sourced text and 2) restoring horrendous grammar as you did [here. Both of these suggest that this isn't about some "fears vs risk" but rather you're just blind reverting and edit warring for the sake of it.[[User:Volunteer Marek|Volunteer Marek]] (talk) 18:47, 10 February 2016 (UTC)