Talk:Eliot Ness/Archive 1

Biography episode on Ness
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"He was a prohibition agent who became an alcoholic. A moral idealist who married three times. A crime fighter whose name is forever linked with the gangster he didn't really catch! Eliot Ness's life is a tapestry of irony, but his legend has a life all its own. In this revealing BIOGRAPHY the real story of the famed lawman comes to light. See how his legend was launched by a book he co-authored 25 years after his days with the "Untouchables," in which he recklessly exaggerated his own importance and accomplishments. Paul Heimel, author of Eliot Ness: The Real Story tells how his real victories came after his Chicago years, when, as Director of Public Safety for Cleveland, he transformed that city from one of the nation's most corrupt and dangerous into the safest. And friends trace his long decline into alcoholism, and recall the final, sad days of his life. This is the revealing, true tale of the straight-arrow lawman whose life has been eclipsed by the legend he helped create." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 152.133.8.5 (talk) 17:55, 4 March 2009 (UTC)

Physical Description
Does anyone have a physical description. Was he tall, short, fat, thin, the media portrays him as a tough ragged cop one minute then a, for lack of a better word, a yuppie the next.

What was his physical description and manner? 63.26.219.123 (talk) 21:30, 12 January 2009 (UTC)eric

The third entry under "Real Life Nicknames" seems to be more of an advertisement than a valid entry: "There is a sandwich shop in Fort Collins, Colorado, just outside the campus of Colorado State University named "Eliot's Mess" in his honor. www.eliotsmess.com" The entry has been removed. The original entry was posted as followed: *There is a sandwich shop in Fort Collins, Colorado, just outside the campus of Colorado State University named "Eliot's Mess" in his honor. www.eliotsmess.com. Destrolennox (talk) 06:48, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

is it not ironic that there is a beer now named after a man who worked so hard to maintain prohibition?

Response from DD90: I suppose it's ironic, but not as much so as you think. Ness was not against drinking, only for upholding the law, so once the prohibition ended he had no trouble having a drink named after him. In fact he was in a drunken car accident not many years later.

Is his first name spelled Eliot or Elliott?


 * Eliot with one "l" and one "t."

Rumour has it that Ness committed suicide, which contradicts the heart attack portion of this entry. Uncorroborated at this time, but possible sources include several books on Capone as well as a Ness biography. Has anyone else heard this theory?


 * No, I never heard of that. I don't think Eliot Ness committed suicide. One year before Eliot's death, his doctor was concerned about a slight heart murmur. Maybe you confuse it with FBI ace Melvin Purvis, he killed himself with a pearl-handled Colt .45 in 1960.


 * It was mentioned in an episode of Millennium; something along the lines of "A lot of ex-agents end up eating their own gun. Ness, [name unheard - presumably Purvis] - the guy who caught Dillinger." David (talk) 19:08, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Elliott Ness is also a rapper or something: www.enessonline.com - 149.152.23.23 20:14, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Someone else... &lt;span style=&quot;font-family: monospace; font-size: normal&quot;&gt;&lt;font style=&quot;border: solid 1px orange; background-color:#991199&quot; color=&quot;white&quot;&gt;&#91;&#91;User:Kitia&#124;Kitia&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;small&gt; — &lt;font color=&quot;#FF4F00&quot;&gt;&#91;&#91;User talk:Kitia&#124;talk]]&lt;/font&gt; &#124; &lt;font color=&quot;#FF4F00&quot;&gt;&#91;&#91;Special:contributions/Kitia&#124;contrib]]&lt;/font&gt; &#124; &lt;font color=&quot;#CD00CD&quot;&gt; 16:38, 24 July 2006 (UTC)&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/small&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;]] 23:42, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Parodies
What about the Bugs Bunny parody, Elegant Mess? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.5.145.74 (talk) 17:53, 6 December 2006 (UTC).

Norway?
I added the bio and LE project tags, but also removed the WikiProject Norway tag. Nothing I saw in the article hints at a Norway connection. If there is one, feel free to restore the tag, but maybe incorporate something into the article as well. Bobanny 00:18, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
 * From the article: "Ness was born in Chicago, the youngest of five, to Norwegian bakers Peter and Emma Ness." But that might still not merit a Norway-project tag. What do you think? It was added because the article is in the category Norwegian-Americans. That category holds Norwegians who moved to (or stayed a long time in) the US and US-born people with Norwegian roots.Inge 13:28, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm untouchable like Eliot Ness...
I just think it's funny how many musicians think they were the first to think of that line.The Manchurian Candidate 05:44, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating
This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 11:27, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Eliot P. Ness?
What is the meaning of the initial P.? Ness' father's name was Peter Ness, but I never heard that Eliot Ness had a second name. I think it's wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 88.64.56.113 (talk) 10:23, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

someone put it in as a joke, P.ness, sounds the same as the word for a male persons private part, we should have it removed —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.201.62.36 (talk) 13:41, 11 November 2007 (UTC)

loook
this is awesome —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.62.86.36 (talk) 14:40, 6 February 2008 (UTC)

lil wayne mentions elliot ness in "comfotable" I am no elliot ness, i don't handcuff i dont arrest 67.71.127.199 (talk)mo altarhuni

What this article did not mention
What this article did not mention was that Ness's ashes was not until the early-mid 1990s, discovered stored in a garage. Once it was discovered, it was scattered in the lake with full police honors. Donnie Park (talk) 12:28, 5 July 2009 (UTC)

Most of Eliot Ness' legacy is a lie
George E.Q. Johnson and President Hoover went after Capone, not Ness. George E.Q. Johnson brought the tax evasion charges against Capone, and the trial was just a show. Ness hardly did anything, but he spun his own stories to the press, and his so-called autobiography is mostly fiction (to Ness' defense, most of it was ghost-written). 99.53.159.10 (talk) 22:19, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

"References In Popular Culture"
This section has become a laundry list of passing references to the subject in everything from cartoons to pro wrestling to a surprising number of rap songs. This speaks to the subjects enduring legacy, which may deserve notice somewhere in the article, but are there guidelines for being selective about a section such as this? Horwendil (talk) 16:36, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Ness died a drunk
People "should know that Ness came to regard his War on Alcohol as a disastrous failure, and he died a drunk himself" Quit the lying hypocritical whitewash of this servile prohibitionist. (24.68.250.200 (talk) 17:59, 11 June 2010 (UTC))
 * Ness wasn't a prohibitionist, he was a cop. The manufacture and distribution of alcohol was, at that time, illegal.  As a police officer, he worked to uphold the law.  Yes, I know, the established hierarchy is a complete sham, the government exists to maintain the status quo, yadda yadda, but we are talking about one man here who never put himself forth as a zealot set against the evils of alcohol.  He was trying to convict a gang boss.  As for his dying a drunk, he died a shamed officer of the law who failed in subsequent business.  That would turn anyone to alcohol, and is more to be pitied than vilified. Horwendil (talk) 02:11, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

California Love
The "Trivia" or "References in Popular Culture" section was removed without any complaint. A comprehensive list of all passing references to Eliot Ness in film, TV, or in hip-hop would quickly be longer than the rest of the article. Having said that, the desire to include one lyric from Tupac Shakur's "California Love" is apparently a strong one. Does this reference stand out as significant and a necessary one to include under a "Legacy" section, or in some other way represented? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Horwendil (talk • contribs) 14:31, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Vandalism
I think this page had suffered some vandalism

The second topic says (PIGS) which I think is wrong, I dont know what is the correct title I think someone has to go back in the page history to find out

Salam — Preceding unsigned comment added by CerberuS (talk • contribs) 18:59, 18 May 2007‎ (UTC)

Bad Ass
I like this entry: Great Lakes Brewing Company makes a beer in his honor, 'The Eliot Ness', because he is a bad ass.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.219.134.114 (talk) 19:27, 21 June 2007‎ (UTC)

Expanded Article Requested
I hope that someone can take the time to expand this article. Elliot Ness has been a hero to many people, and not just to Americans (I am Canadian.) Ness is an important historical figure for his defiance of Al Capone, his part in getting him sentenced and then destroying his criminal empire. He has become an icon for the FBI and for American justice in general. There are a lot more cultural references in media. "The Simpsons" did a takeoff of him once, and I'm sure I've seen parodies of him on many other popular programs over the years. He seems to appear whenever a comedy series, especially animated, wants to depict a typical straight-laced FBI man. "The Untouchables" story, for all its accuracy and fiction, has clearly influenced the culture for decades. The story made Kevin Costner a star, among others.

Between battling gangs and rooting out corruption in police forces, there is a lot of exciting and noteworthy material for a superior article on the man. Neurolanis (talk) 02:28, 15 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Also, Dick Tracy was based on Ness. "Eliot Ness and the Untouchables: The Historical Reality and the Film and Television Depictions" by Kenneth Tucker, Page: 2 http://books.google.ca/books?id=BdV2y1UcVPsC&printsec=frontcover&dq=the+untouchables&hl=en&ei=vtC2TeGXE-Hz0gGI_OGvCQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=book-preview-link&resnum=3&ved=0CD8QuwUwAg#v=onepage&q&f=false —Preceding unsigned comment added by Neurolanis (talk • contribs) 22:19, 29 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Eliot Ness has nothng to do with taking down Capone. This article is complete bullshit.  69.158.138.222 (talk) 14:46, 8 October 2011 (UTC)


 * The Untouchables were set up in the first place to bring him down on tax evasion, and helped to collect evidence of that. They also crushed his bootlegging empire. Neurolanis (talk) 16:13, 21 October 2011 (UTC)


 * Eliot Ness was NOT an agent for the FBI. He was a Treasury Agent in the Bureau of Prohibition.  He was never in the FBI. Tom Buck, Jan 9, 2012.


 * Federal agent. Neurolanis (talk) 01:45, 30 January 2012 (UTC)

Complete, total bullshit
This article is almost totally worthless as it's based on the invented legend rather than evidence. It should either be deleted or completely rewritten. His true life story would require about 1/8 the number of words. 69.158.138.222 (talk) 14:44, 8 October 2011 (UTC)

Mayor of Cleveland
Did Ness run for mayor twice, in 1938 (image caption) and 1947 (later article text)? The article makes the first seem unlikely, whence the caption should be corrected. --P64 (talk) 18:10, 12 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Ness ran for Mayor in 1947. That photograph (taken in 1973) has a title, which is erroneous. Horwendil (talk) 19:10, 13 January 2012 (UTC)


 * I should have returned to say that I did correct the caption in this article. And I posted explanation at the image File talk.
 * At some Wikimedia Commons [where I don't know my way around] administrative page, I requested that the image file be renamed (and its documentation revised in parallel, i presume). That file name is inconveniently long but I suggested simply the date change 1938=>1947. --P64 (talk) 20:00, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Personal Opinions
This article seems to need some serious cleanup. It's not objective enough. For example, the word "unfortunately" is a red flag -- Wikipedia shouldn't consider the withering of Ness' career to be fortunate or unfortunate. 98.218.119.25 (talk) 15:35, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

Was his manuscript digitalized?
Was it? Would love to take a look at it if it's public available, and also would be a nice addition to the page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 187.121.93.184 (talk) 22:00, 15 November 2012 (UTC)

ness the lightweight?
the article makes eliot ness look like a lightweight. according to the article, ness was not involved in the capture or killing of ANY major underworld figure. he might have been involved in shutting down breweries worth a grand total of a million dollars. but how many breweries was that? four breweries? two? perhaps ONE? (i assume that breweries were worth a great deal during prohibition.) and it is ironic that ness, an avowed foe of breweries, was an active social drinker........75.68.9.233 (talk) 20:49, 16 April 2013 (UTC)

Later Life section
The short section, "Later Life" is unsourced. It links to "ask Yahoo" but not to anything about Ness or refusing bribes. If the claim that Capone offered a bribe, and Ness refused it, is true, it needs a better source or the section should be removed.Princetoniac (talk) 19:57, 5 June 2017 (UTC)

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