Talk:Empanada/Archive 1

Empanadillas
At least in Spain, the small, semi-circular shaped "empanadas" are actually called "empanadillas" --Pezezin 22:15, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Jewish Empanadas
It has been discovered that Spanish Jewish families who were conversos also incorporated Empanadas into their family recipies. See here This should be included on the main page as well. Artemisboy 16:03, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Photos
I swapped the photo at the top because I feel that in the photo of the Peruvian empanadas, the emanadas aren't prominent enough and it doesn't help people coming to the article to get a good idea of what empanadas are like. I also feel that there is a lot of potential for this article to have more photos to really show the variety of empanadas that exist. It's not to difficult to go out and buy a few local empanadas, take a photo and upload it to Wikipedia (the Commons is the best place). GringoInChile 07:23, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

"Empada" is not a brazilian version of "empanada"
The statement that brazilian empada is a variation of the hispanic empanada is discutible. Although the name is similar the brazilian empada is a very different cuisine.

Empanada resembles a turnover and is usually made of a wheat dough very similar to a bread dough and is baked exposed in the oven.

Empada is made of a dough called "massa podre", wich is completely different in composition, texture and flavor from the hispanic empanada. Also the brazilian empada is baked in a cupcake shaped metal container and only it's top is exposed to the air inside the oven.

The filler is also very distinct as empanadas usually is filled with a mix of meat and vegetables the brazilian empada is usually filled with seasoned meat alone, the only thing that go with the meat are a single half olive on top or some cream cheese (usualy catupiry, cheddar or minas).

The literature concerning genetic differences of empadas and empanadas is (as far as I know) inexistant; mostly because no hispanic-american, spaniard or brazilian (as myself) would consider empanada and empada to be the same cuisine.

To consider empanada and empada the same is similar to consider maccaronni and lasagna the same just because they are all made of dough and people talking romantic languages eat it.

Yeah whoever here is arguing against empadas has a point. An empada is one thing, an empanada is another. Make an empada page if you want to, but don't confuse people putting empada and empanada on the same page. Delete the empada phrase. Slartibartfast1992 22:39, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

National divisions
The article would be much more useful if there were broader strokes and less concern about specifically national varieties. I think that the article should be left under the sole jurisdiction of the food and drink project since it seems a bit excessive to include banners of the wikiprojects of every nation where empanadas are common.

Peter Isotalo 13:38, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Citation
Here is a link for the Moor reference: http://www.mundoandino.com/Argentina/Cuisine-of-Argentina Unfortunately, I am unsure as how to add the citation. Thanks for anyone's help! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.251.131.162 (talk) 13:51, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

closer to sambusak
empanadas are more like sambusak than fatay, actually ive never even heard of fatay and in searching it I find all the articles are in spanish, I dont think its any more arab than french fries are french. The correct arab name is sfija

http://www.redjuderias.org/red/upload/imagenes/n_shavuot04.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.72.241.193 (talk) 13:45, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

Untitled
PHOTOS

The photos of this article are in fact "empanadillas", smaller than "empanadas" and whit a different form. only the last photo may correspond to a piece of Galician empanada. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.78.83.234 (talk) 23:39, 16 March 2009 (UTC)

Duplicate in "Similar dishes" ?
Two different items (Pasty from Cornwall) (Cornish Pasty, baked pastry filled with beef and potato, from Cornwall, England) sound like the same item described with differing level of detail. Somebody who knows the facts, please merge or disambiguate as appropriate? 198.144.192.45 (talk) 21:12, 26 January 2011 (UTC) Twitter.Com/CalRobert (Robert Maas)

Empanadas in Brazil
The pictures of empanadas in other latin-american countries look like the brazilian pastéis. I actually have never heard of "empanadas" where I live (Rio de Janeiro); the closest term would be empadas (which don't look like the empanada pictures found here).


 * Exactly! Empanadas aren't empadas. Empanadas in Brazil are called Pastéis. Pastel is the singular form. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 189.122.216.94 (talk) 12:44, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

Yeah the empanada and pastel are two distinct dishes. They're similiar but the empanada usually has a more bready crust while the pastel is a more flaky pastry dough like crust.207.237.208.153 (talk) 21:10, 28 January 2012 (UTC)

File:Empanadas de horno.jpg Nominated for Deletion
These look really yummy. I want to eat some now. NOM NOM — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.58.219.107 (talk) 01:37, 20 March 2012 (UTC)

Too many countries listed. Not really 'empanadas'.
I suggest for this article only to list those countries where: the dish is actually called empanada and closely resembles the Argentine/Chilean/Galician, etc empanada. That doesn't seem to be the case of the Mexican empanada, for example.

Samosas, fatay, etc, all have their specific articles.

Empanadas is just another type of meat pie, turnover, etc, so I guess only the specific kinds should be listed here.

Not sure if I make myself clear enough, English is not my first language.

By the way, I corrected some words in the Argentine empanadas recipe (changed butter to beef dripping) and also included the sentence on the cultural difference of empanadas depending on where in ARgentina you are (in the provinces, it's more like a Sunday, family dish, whereas in Buenos Aires it's more of a take-away dish, just like Chinese, pizza, etc.). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.225.139.230 (talk) 08:20, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

It is inaccurate to call Bolani a "variant" of empanada. Bolani appear to be native to Central Asia. It shares ingredients, technique and origins with Indo-Pak paratha. Bolani should be moved to the "Similar dishes" section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.78.11.39 (talk) 10:07, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Seriously there are like 10 variants listed that have nothing to do with empanadas which in addition have their own, much larger wikipedia entries. With all due respect, this article is horrible, empanada has never been "just another type of meat pie", meat pie, is meat pie, a empanada is a empanada, seriously this is so unprofessional even for wikipedia standards...80.202.170.59 (talk) 15:23, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Chilean empanada use real beef?
I was born there (Santiago de Chile) and seriously, I have NEVER seen empanada de pino with whole beef, the mere thought sounds ridiculous and is perhaps even a attempt at making them sound more luxurious and costly than the other variations, many other variants from other countries seem to have exaggerated the ingredients value in some way or another as well such as changing the recipe`s butter with expensive options that do not even allow for a malleable dough to be made, even less fried or cooked. Seriously quit being childish. I am changing the text in the article from "beef" to "ground beef", *sigh* feel free to change it back if you want,yet know that if you are proud of our nation, then there is no need to exaggerate about its foods... and make sure you put that "they are always served with diamonds inside for decoration like every other dish in Chile" as well I mean hey why not go all the way huh? *sarcasm* 80.202.170.59 (talk) 15:30, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Beef again?
So Argentinian empanadas are made with beef dripping rather than butter huh? Must be some special Argentinian brand I have never seen (even though I lived there for twenty years) because you sure as empanada cannot make a malleable dough with normal beef dripping, and how would I know huh? I mean making empanadas (in Argentina) was a significant part of what I did for a living there...

Seriously whats next? Mexican ones made with entrecote slice beef cuts now? Brazilian ones with kobe beef? Quit the damn beef people, its like you all have a beef with one another... (boring puns intended, the whole empanada entry is too ridiculous to take seriously) its like a showoff pissing contest rather than a wikipedia article80.202.170.59 (talk) 15:59, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Empanadas in Argentina
I specified that the immigration of Galician was mostly to Argentina and Uruguay where they are a big percentage of the population, while in other parts of L. America the immigration was much less numerous and in many of them inexistent.

Rice is not used in any kind of argentina Empanada. Donkey is not a game animal in Argentina. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.229.119.25 (talk) 16:34, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

True, no rice in Argentinian empanada, I mean I made empanadas there for twenty years, as for "Donkey" I will claim the same as the comment above, "Donkey" a game animal? Nope, but hey, I "just" lived there for twenty years right?80.202.170.59 (talk) 16:06, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Origins
I've removed the origin reference, please if you're going to claim an origin provide a (valid) source. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.159.185.123 (talk) 23:09, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Good work, I have found about twenty different "origin" stories for "wikipedia standard acceptable sources"... Yet for obvious reasons I wont add anyone, else I would have to add all of them and that would make this horrible article seem even worse.

Why? Well, I refuse to believe that every South-American country discovered the recipe almost all at the same year, every nation by completely different means for completely different purposes. Aka "Chile made them first to feed coal miners, but actually Peru discovered them earlier the same year by accident, all while Argentina discovered them even "earlierer" when Cristóbal Colón (Christopher Columbus) brought them from Brazil.

Do I need say more? Actually I could have done with a lot less, but the article needs all the help it can get, and then some.80.202.170.59 (talk) 16:17, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Indonesian Empanada
In Northern Sulawesi, there is a kind of Empanada and the filling consists of tuna. It is called Panada. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.163.207.208 (talk) 09:28, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Its not the same, I mean Panada is a whole different bread-ish kind of food, and no need to argue with me, rather argue with the writer of the section from the article "Panada" on wikipedia if you must:

"Indonesian panada Panada snack in Indonesia

In Indonesian cuisine, panada is a bread snack filled with spicy tuna or cakalang fish (smaller tuna). It is the specialty of Manado city, Minahasa people, North Sulawesi, Indonesia. The name comes from Spanish pan 'bread"

My point here, is that many dishes use the word "pan" because it means bread in spanish, yet that does not mean that everything that sounds similar is the same, I mean we have pan-pizza in the USA right? That has nothing to do with it... But if its already added, I wont remove it, ill leave that to those that know more.

Just saying Panada is a whole different dish, check out the Wikipedia article regarding it before you judge or keep expanding this one thus creating duplicates.80.202.170.59 (talk) 16:25, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Hey seriously!
Every dish containing the word "pan" or being made of "bread dough with filling" is not automatically some sort of empanada, and empanada is not "just some sort of meat pie" nor any type of meat pie at all, a empanada is a empanada, while a meat pie, is a meat pie, I would add sources proving this, but seriously I will simply expect people to know better for once

After all pan means bread in Spanish and all the while empanada itself is not bread, we wont add bread and US Pan pizza here will we? I sure hope not, yet from the standard of the article, I seriously don't know what to expect. 80.202.170.59 (talk) 16:37, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Link to Knish page
In Similar dishes section there is mentioned knish (knysh) but with no link to the corresponding Wikipedia article. Adûnâi (talk) 16:45, 21 July 2014 (UTC)

Empanadas/Empanadillas in Puerto Rico
The article claims that Empanadas in Puerto Rico are breaded fillets related to schnitzel. I feel like this is misleading, since Puerto Rican empanadas use a masa and shredded meat, an alternative name for Pasteles that are made with yuca, and are baked instead of boiled. Whereas schnitzel uses breading and fillets, and is fried. KaraiBorinquen (talk) 21:07, 22 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry, but you are beyond 100% incorrect; in Puerto Rico (I should know, I live here, born and bred; my daughter is a chef in a local restaurant) an empanada is a fried, breaded steak very much similar to schnitzel. NOBODY in Puerto Rico calls a puertorrican pastel an empanada. Throughout Puerto Rico, even in different linguistic zones (my MA thesis was on this subject), a puertorrican pastel is called a pastel. An empanada is the PR equivalent of schnitzel, regardless of meat base, it is ALWAYS breaded and fried. There is absolutely, positively no relationship between a puertorrican pastel and a puertorrican empanada. None. Zero. Zip. Sings-With-Spirits (talk) 19:22, 15 May 2011 (UTC)


 * First of all, you don't need to get on the offensive like that, it smacks of emotion and will only discredit your argument. Second, I have never once ever seen anything called an empanada in Puerto Rico that looks anything like schnitzel. I have an MA and studied cultural-linguistics too, and have been cooking in a Puerto Rican kitchen since I was 11 years old. Is what I experienced first hand any more or less validated than what you did for those reasons? I'm sure your thesis is well written with a well ordered argument, and I'm sure your daughter is a great cook, but I just don't know to whom you spoke with if you've never heard of a pastel de yuca also being called an empanada before. I cannot believe your argument based on no demonstrated evidence, particularly when what actually is the case on the streets is opposite your argument. Now if you're talking about the fried, stuffed dough turnovers, then I think you might want to reconsider your description, since they neither look nor taste like schnitzel. However, that doesn't seem to be the case. KaraiBorinquen (talk) 04:48, 12 July 2011 (UTC)


 * "Not the case on the streets" where? Where in Puerto Rico do they call a "pastel de yuca" an "empanada"? Ever hear of a "bistec empanado"? That's the local equivalent of a schnitzel; also referred to as "empanada de bistec" or "empanada de carne". When done with chicken it's called an "empanada de pollo". A schnitzel is a breaded, fried flat cut of meat; that is what a puertorrican "empanada" is as well. In PR, we have "pasteles de masa", "pasteles de yuca" and "pasteles de arroz"; these are all known as pasteles; further defined by the meat they include: "cerdo", "pollo" or "jueyes". Nobody I know, either personally or through the industry, throughout the island, calls "pasteles de yuca" "empanadas". Period. You accuse me of not offering demonstrative evidence, yet you don't provide any either. I specify that "empanadillas" in Puerto Rico (the subject of the "empanadas" wiki article) should NOT be confused with what in Puerto Rico are known as "empanadas" (schnitzel, for lack of a better description); My guess is that you missed the part where I stated that in PR, "empanadas" (as in the article) are called "empanadillas" and that "bisctec empanado" (i.e. "schnitzel") is called "empanada" in PR. Then you further confuse the issue when you state that "empanadas" are "pasteles de yuca" (cassava-puree mixed with meat, wrapped in banana leaves) that are baked, not boiled (How does the leaf react to the baking process, BTW?). I counter that in my *extensive* experience in the field I have NEVER seen that ANYONE in PR calls "pasteles de yuca" "empanadas". Heck; I have never heard of "baked" "puertorrican" pasteles. I submit that you might be referring to another dish that is unrelated to either "empanadas", "empanadillas" or "pasteles". You dish sounds like "yuca rellena", a popular peruvian dish normally fried but may also be baked. Sings-With-Spirits (talk) 22:13, 5 August 2011 (UTC)

Sing-With-Spirits arguments are as invalid as his ability to type anything from a somewhat neutral standpoint, his defensive stance and facts pointing to the contrary of his claims are more than enough proof. While his "I have a daughter that makes these" is simply a largely unspecified claim.80.202.170.59 (talk) 15:19, 6 April 2014 (UTC)


 * Personal experience in the matter is "unsubstantiated"? I posit that you did not read the entire discussion, in which it should be clear that "pasteles" are NOT called "empanadas" in PR. I mention my daughter (who is now stationed overseas) to establish (perhaps not clearly enough) that I have extensive experience with local cuisine... but am not a professional chef myself. Would you like me to list a number of websites to demonstrate that my statements are fact? How much more "neutral" must the objective truth of my statements be? I am passionate in the defense of the truth and of my culture, sorry if it comes through as brutish. It's unladylike of me and for that I apologize. --Sings-With-Spirits (talk) 20:54, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Kind of silly
This is a bloated, silly article. It groups way too many different types of food under the umbrella of "empanada", with little regard to consistency. Any sort of turnover, stuffed pastry, etc. is deemed to be an "empanada", which is just ridiculous. Including the Brazilian "pastel" under "empanada"? Really? This article should stick to empanadas and empanadas only. 201.81.242.47 (talk) 00:12, 27 December 2014 (UTC)

Empanadas in Mexico
The picture of empanadas in Mexico is not quite accurate as salty empanadas are very very popular even more so than sweet ones. Mole empanadas and tuna and ham and cheese empanadas should be highlighted as they do not seem to show up in other countries. Well mole is purely Mexican. Also many times puff pastry is used in Mexico instead of the regular wheat dough. This makes them similar to a filled croissant but they are called empanadas. The bit on Pastes from Hidalgo was good. My name is chant a and I love pineapple and coconut empanadas ..... yes there's some variety but... there are empanadas for meal for desert, and there's different types of empanadas... lets say by zones too.... eastern, center, mid west and nortwest... and you will see clear difference. say eastern like the pejelagarto empanada.... and the shrimp empanada are different taste and ingredients on east and west part of mexico.. that makes it cool..but not confused the term empanada and quesadilla.. i not ever seen a empanada of huitlacoche can be a new thing so the most common to see it in a quesadilla which the outside layer's are thinner than the empanada. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sastevio (talk • contribs) 20:23, 6 March 2015 (UTC)

Merger proposal
I purpose merging in 'Mpanatigghi to this article; 'Mpanatigghi states that the name is from Empanada and that they were introduced during Spanish rule in the 16th century, so they are a regional variation on an Empanada and not a separate dish; similar to those already covered rather than a unique or separate dish as with others of the similar dishes. Falconjh (talk) 22:06, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

Empanadas in NYC
A section on empanadas in the United States, particularly in New York City, is missing. Many of the food trucks and Food carts there sell them. See e.g. "10 Spots To Score Excellent Empanadas In NYC" by Angely Mercado, Gothamist, 13 October 2014. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 22:31, 10 October 2015 (UTC)

Can someone explain me why is the place of origin listed as "Latin America" when just at the start of the article it says otherwise?
"Empanadas trace back their origins to the northwest region of Spain, Galicia."

There's a clear common theme with all these spanish/portuguese food if they get popular in latin america, such as the churros being listed as "mexican".

Latin America might have adopted the empanada, and now it's a big part of their culture, sure. But that doesn't cange the fact that it's not originary from there. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.50.44.176 (talk) 10:43, 14 October 2016 (UTC)

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empanadas
aren't the empanadas at café patagonia great!? [café patagonia https://cafepatagoniafoods.wixsite.com/beta] — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.75.79.57 (talk) 04:01, 30 July 2017 (UTC)

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Proposed merge of Paste (pasty) into Empanada
The claim to differentiate between empanadas and Mexican pasties based on whether the filling is raw is not sourced and, according to reliable sources, it's also false. (Mexican) pasties appears to be a less commonly used name for empanadas. Spudlace (talk) 07:06, 6 September 2020 (UTC)


 * NO!!! Empanada gallega is NOT a pasty. It is a large pie, baked NOT fried. It is very different from what is described as "empanada" in South America, which is what Gallegos call "empanadillas" ("little pies"). Please correct to reflect regional variations.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.217.147.57 (talk) 20:04, 5 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Oppose: This specific variation is descended from the Cornish Pasty, and although maybe have some strong resemblance, it is not an empanada, and is culturally distinct from the origins of such.31.127.21.2 (talk) 23:29, 20 October 2020 (UTC)