Talk:Emperor Ling of Han

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I cannot make any sense of this sentence: "As soon after his death the power fell into the hands of Dong Zhuo, who despised him, Emperor Ling was one of the rare examples of history in which an emperor whose throne was inherited by a son who received a highly derogatory (but accurate) posthumous name." 75.72.177.105 05:29, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

The name 孝灵 (his dynastic title) is translated as "filial and inattentive", but this seems like a really bad way to translate 灵. My Classical Chinese is not the best, but I've never seen the word used to describe a negative quality in a person; I associate it more with translations like "nimble", "mentally acute", or "precocious". Anyone feel similarly or have the proof to show I'm wrong? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mrmyway (talk • contribs)


 * Remember that posthumous name meanings are not the same as the plain word meanings of the characters. According to the Yi Zhou Shu (逸周書) -- which dealt in a major manner with Zhou Dynasty customs and regulations, including posthumous names, the possible meanings of Ling are, along with my translations:


 * 死而志成 (wishes were accomplished after his/her death)
 * 亂而不損 (disorganized but not hurt by disorganization)
 * 極知鬼神 (knowledgeable about spirits and gods)
 * 不勤成名 (famous despite inattentiveness)
 * 死見神能 (even after his/her death, his/her spirit showed its power)
 * 好祭鬼神 (favored worship of spirits and gods)


 * If the person matched any of these descriptions, then "Ling" would be an appropriate posthumous name; he/she did not need to have all of these characteristics. Given that the throughout the various dynasties, "Ling" was given a pejorative connotation (and specifically, the one that I chose -- the fourth one -- was one that was echoed later specifically by Emperor Xiaowen of Northern Wei when he selected "Ling" as the posthumous name for one of his corrupt officials) I do not believe "inattentive" is a mistranslation.  You are free to propose another translation, but the ones you proposed above ("nimble," "mentally acute," and "precocious") are all ones that do not correspond with the "posthumous name meanings" of "Ling."  --Nlu (talk) 06:42, 19 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Wow, thanks. There's a lot of good information in there; I really appreciate the contribution. Mrmyway (talk) 08:46, 19 December 2006 (EST)


 * Thank you. --Nlu (talk) 18:18, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

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