Talk:Emporia State University/Archive 1

Motto
Has ESU changes their motto? I know they've been using I'm A Hornet since March, and it was Changing Lives since 1863. I just want to know what others think.  Corkythehornetfan  Talk 04:51, 26 July 2014 (UTC)


 * Some other editors get very picky about mottos, so make sure you find a reference to prove it, otherwise editors will remove mottos that don't have a ref. I recommend that you use "I'm A Hornet" instead of "I'M A HORNET.", because it isn't an official college thing or advertisement, instead this field is just information on Wikipedia.  I rarely remove unref'ed mottos unless they sound fishy or bogus.  •  Sbmeirow  •  Talk  • 01:23, 6 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Alrighty, thanks! I'll change it to the suggestion you made and add the reference.  Corkythehornetfan  Talk 01:34, 6 August 2014 (UTC)

Oldest public university in Kansas?
I have brought this up before on K-State's talk page, but I'm still questioning as to whether K-State is the oldest university in Kansas. Emporia State University, founded in March 1863, I believe is the oldest institution under the "new" state. K-State was known as Blue Mont Central College, and was founded in 1858, before 1861 when Kansas became a state. BMCC was under the Kansas Territory, not the actual state. The Kansas Board of Regents history page has ESU as the first university in Kansas, followed by KU and then K-State, becoming the Agriculture College of Manhattan which is then governed by the state. A Kansas State Statue book, found on books.google.com, says the K-State was the 1st (Feb. 16, 1863), followed by KU (Feb. 20, 1863) and ESU (March 2, 1863). This history article states that KSU didn't become accepted until 1863, and states that KU became the 1st institution secured. I know ESU says that it wasn't established until March 1863, but why would the Board of Regents, the governing board of the universities say that ESU is the oldest? It just doesn't make since. I just want to know what others think.  Corkythehornetfan  (Talk)  02:36, 26 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Corkythehornetfan,
 * I read the Hanschu research and the Kansas Board of Regents article to have the meaning that the Kansas Legislature enabled the founding and existence of the corporate Board of Regents as an arm of the State as a part of the Act that established Emporia State University (then Kansas State Normal School). So by that virtue Kansas State Normal School was the first public institution under the control or lineage of the Board of Regents. Kansas State University was to be accepted/established as a public institution by a separate act of the Legislature later in February 1863. Assuming the Board's recount of events is considered THEE state historical interpretation, then Kansas State University was established second in chronology due to the fact that it remained a private institution up until the time the bill was enacted. It appears Kansas State even claims 1863 as the year of founding, not 1858 (which is not always how other states or institutions view these things). In relation, the University of Kansas wasn't established formally until 1865.


 * So in sum, technically the Board of Regents are saying that the idea of a public university was not established in law in the city of Lawrence until later than Emporia and thus Emporia is in their view the first 'public' institution. Of course there is interpretation and qualifiers as to the meaning of 'first'. One could also suggest that because Blue Mont Central College was founded in 1858, that it is chronologically the first institution. But folks following that line of logic should then also back up the assertion that it was the same continuous body from private to public. I know it's been a year and half since you posted this but I came across it and figured why not read up on it. Randomeditor1000 (talk) 20:04, 24 April 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the comment, ! I'm still not sure, but I still argue to this day that KSN was the first public institution established by the state legislature... mainly because K-State was already operating as a private before Kansas became a state. KSN would be the one the first they created from scratch. Did you see the conversation that took place from a couple of editors at the K-State talk page? They list other sources, but I basically decided it wasn't worth fighting so I went with it. That was almost two years ago, so I may bring it up again with them! ☔️ Corkythe hornetfan  ☔️ 02:01, 28 April 2016 (UTC)
 * I would think that since the official source for this information would be the Board of Regents as to the current, most recent interpretation - wikipedia would view that reference as a more accurate source of information then the original Kansas Book of Statutes from 1863. The reason I propose this is that subsequent information in time may include more accurate information than what was originally published (potentially vice versa as well). I wonder if the Board of Regents History on the website took into consideration the Book source or not? I would state that my opinion is that Emporia State should be referenced as the 'oldest public university' per the Board of Regents most current publication and that the Kansas State article would reference the fact that it was founded as the 'oldest private university'... that subsequently was received into public ownership. I think I follow your logic and I wish you luck in trying to find a clear middle ground Randomeditor1000 (talk) 02:17, 28 April 2016 (UTC)

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