Talk:En plein air/Archive 1

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Definition
Comments from User:Oriolesfan61 copied from article:

At the end of the first paragraph: (I dispute this commonly-held definition; see below.)

My quibble with the common definition:

In general, in common use, it means to paint outdoors and is inaccurately translated as painting "in the open air." But, literally, in French, it means "in" + "full" + "area." So when we begin to figure what the original term would mean, it would be "in the area fully," or "fully in the area." It would be similar to the Italian "all prima," not "al fresco."

The last "e" in "aire" is not superfluous; it is essential; the meaning is diferent, since "air" in French means "air" in English."

This is most simply understood as being an echo of the Italian "alla prima" which means "at the first," meaning a painting done in one long session, without the layers and layers over weeks and months of traditional oil painting.

This means that "en plein aire" is not the same as "painting outdoors." It of course has the same effect, since most outdoor paintings are done in one session. But that is the point of how the phrase is used (incorrectly, or inaccurately) today, not the point that the meaning of the term is as generally thought. Many French dictionaries mistranslate this term.


 * This is important info, I will try to incorporate it. You can also, whoever you are, and from whenever you come… Bod (talk) 06:14, 2 November 2015 (UTC)

En plein aire
There is an important omission in the definition of the term as it appears in the article ... three little words ... and from life. For a work to be considered a plein air(e) piece, the artist must not only be painting outdoors, but must be painting the scene surrounding him/her. Someone who has set up his/her easel in a field or on a riverbank but who is creating a painting from a reference photo of different place (or a still life or portrait) clipped to the easel is NOT creating a plein air(e) work. Many plein aire works are created alla prima - an Italian term meaning "from the first" or "all at once" - but a plein aire painting can also be completed in several visits to the same location.

Translation
Wouldn't "en plein aire" literally translate to "In plain air"?

--- Yes, but that's not necessarily what it means. We have many similar phrases in English, ya know? Tlasco Rydrion 10:50, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Literally, in French:

<> = "in"

< > = "full"...NOT "plain"

< > = "area"...NOT "air"

Events section looks like SPAM
The "Events" section looks like spam. Why are these events important? There must be thousands of events. If (and only if) an events list is proper, then it seems to me that there must be notable events outside the United States, all the current links are inside the United States! --Charles Gaudette 07:30, 9 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Eh, let them spam. The only reason this page exists at all is to make happy a few people who are so excited by the minutiae of the fine arts that they must use a French expression where an English one will serve. 173.174.85.204 (talk) 14:11, 14 November 2016 (UTC)Eric
 * This was over seven years ago. No such section exists. Thanks for the condescending side-note, though, anonymous IP. Icarus of old (talk) 17:44, 14 November 2016 (UTC)

Artist Personal Page References
Is Further Reference an appropriate place to list the personal home page of a plein air artist? I think not.... Kgendler (talk) 22:58, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

No contemporary artists or information?
There should be contemporary "Plein-Air" painters included in this article. There are such painters who are famous (e.g. Jack Cassinetto, who was one of 4 living painters featured in the inaugural issue of "Plein Air Magazine" in 2004) and worthy of mention here. Plein Air painting is very popular today, both as a hobby and as a serious art form (and among collectors); contemporary artists in this form deserve mention. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Msft watch (talk • contribs) 05:56, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I have attempted to answer this here: Suffice it to say that such mention could easily be seen as a vehicle for promotion by contemporary artists and galleries. Practicing and teaching this myself, I am familiar with plein air painters in the U.S., and there are many credible examples. However, for any to be included in this article, I think that particularly strong notability would need to be established, a recognition that clearly sets the named artist or artists apart from others (I don't think that a profile in Plein Air Magazine, a short-lived publication which has since become Fine Art Connoisseur, is quite enough to do this). Otherwise, the gates are open for entire societies of plein air artists to place themselves in the article. Which some have already done, en masse, in the 'further reference' section. JNW (talk) 12:35, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

I agree there should be contemporary examples of Plein Air Painters. What about notable groups that have several members? I think that takes precedence over individuals. I think contemporary examples of Plein Air painters is appropriate, especially if there are already examples of individiuals listed on the page. Why were the groups deleted? ! ? Rembrandt21 (talk) 22:10, 4 April 2009 (UTC)
 * If the painters satisfy WP:NOTABILITY, as is the case with outdoor painters Rackstraw Downes or Antonio Lopez Garcia, then inclusion would be appropriate. Otherwise it's spamming, usually in the attempt to promote regional societies and painters. JNW (talk) 23:28, 4 April 2009 (UTC)

Copyright problem
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Copyright problem
This article has been reverted by a bot to as part of a large-scale clean-up project of multiple article copyright infringement. (See the investigation subpage) This has been done to remove User:Accotink2's contributions as they have a history of extensive copyright violation and so it is assumed that all of their major contributions are copyright violations. Earlier text must not be restored, unless it can be verified to be free of infringement. For legal reasons, Wikipedia cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material; such additions must be deleted. Contributors may use sources as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences or phrases. Accordingly, the material may be rewritten, but only if it does not infringe on the copyright of the original or plagiarize from that source. Please see our guideline on non-free text for how to properly implement limited quotations of copyrighted text. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously. VWBot (talk) 13:00, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

The invertion of tubes
I'd like to point out that tubes were not invented directly after pigments were ground and mixed. before tubes, premixed oil paints were sold in pigs bladders with a loose seal at the top and then glass syringes. I don't know if this is worth mentioning in the article, but the article is currently incorrect in stating that before tubes were invented artists had to mix their paints from pigments for use.

24.222.180.78 (talk) 19:06, 6 June 2013 (UTC)Alex

External links modified
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