Talk:Ernest Radcliffe Bond

Pre-FAC comments
Looking at the article, I think this still needs quite a lot of work before it's ready for FAC. The news articles/obituaries are certainly not bad sources, but I'd really want to see more extensive use of scholarly studies; I assume you haven't actually read The Road to Balcombe Street? There's surely going to be a lot of value in there; you've only got one passing reference. IRA activities have been very extensively studied; I would be surprised if there wasn't some discussion of Bond's activities in academic journals. There are literally dozens of books about the Angry Brigade, many of which will no doubt discuss Bond (see [https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=%22Angry+Brigade%22+Bond&btnG=Search+Books&tbm=bks&tbo=1&gws_rd=ssl this very quick and imprecise search). This article's actually very short, given the subject matter, so there's plenty of room for expansion with what is said in these other sources. Here are some more specific comments:


 * His personal life doesn't warrant such prominent mention in the lead.
 * It seems he's notable for being a police officer, rather than being in the military. This needs to be made clearer in the lead.
 * "His notable achievements in the bomb squad were negotiating the rise of The Angry Brigade, eventually jailing several members. The other major event he negotiated as commander with the Bomb Squad was the Balcombe Street siege, in which two people were taken hostage by four Irish Republican Army members, who demanded a plane to Ireland. Bond, answering the demands, refused saying that the police "are not going to make any deals"." This doesn't read well.
 * Barrow's a close-knit community? Or he was part of a close-knit community in Barrow?
 * Changed. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  16:40, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * We're certain he was in Barrow? There isn't a John Street in Barrow, but there is one in Askam, a few miles north of Barrow.
 * Well, The Times reported that and they're usually pretty good, and I found pictures here (do a Ctl+F) which mentions John Street a few times. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  17:01, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * "After he finished school, Bond was an apprentice French polisher." Doesn't read well.
 * Changed. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  16:40, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * "Bond joined the British Army on 16 September 1935, in the 2nd battalion of the Scots Guards." You don't join "in" a battalion, do you? I also don't like the way you've done the linking here.
 * Changed both. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  17:01, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * "His objective was to fight in any short engagement he could, and to become a policeman." This needs to be more clearly spelt out. I also think "police officer" would be preferable.
 * Changed police part, but not sure how to re-phrase part 1 of the sentence. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  17:01, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Years and ranks and such for the Arab Revolt info would be preferable.
 * No info that I could find I'm afraid (searching terms such as 'Arab revolt Ernest Bond', 'Arab revolt Ernest Radcliffe Bond', and 'Arab revolt Private Ernest Bond'. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  18:11, 29 July 2014 (UTC) (Note to self: )
 * "After a short time in No. 8 (Guards) Commando, in a group of units under Robert Laycock's command;[2] the unit was disbanded, and he journeyed to North Africa with his original battalion in the Scots Guards,[1] fighting in the Eighth Army.[2]" This doesn't make sense
 * Changed a little. Does it make sense now? Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  17:01, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * "against the airfields" Targetting? Aiming to capture? "against the" doesn't say anything
 * "He became a prisoner of war for the remainder of the conflict.[1][2]" Where was he sent? Was this the whole four years mentioned in the next (very short- to be avoided!) paragraph?
 * "When Bond was released from his imprisonment by the Axis, he was demobilised in 1946" Clumsy wording. Was he demobilised "when ... released" or "in 1946"?
 * "His division became 'E' division" Presumably, you mean he moved division
 * ""he began to develop a reputation for his discerning skill as a detective."" It'd be good if we could have in-text attribution for this quote. Also, be aware of MOS:LQ.
 * "Bond joined the Bomb Squad, newly formed in January 1971[5] due to concern over The Angry Brigade,[2] Bond became the unit's first commander[5] on 23 June 1971,[3] having being promoted to that position in 1969.[1]" Comma splice
 * "having being promoted to that position in 1969" So, while in the murder squad? Why don't you mention this in the previous paragraph?
 * "The unit served at Tintagel House, and Bond's name was theoretically meant to be kept secret and he should be called 'Commander X', so that he was not bombed, but journalists have since claimed to have known his name within days of his appointment." Clumsy wording. The use of quotes for the remainder of the paragraph is also rather jarring in places.
 * Perhaps "terrorist" is a word to avoid...
 * "The gunmen gave up on 12 December,[10] their surrender sparking fears of reprisals, after what Bond called a "rather humiliating episode,"[11] Bond "masterminded" the operation to regain the hostages.[4]" I don't follow.

Sorry- I know this probably isn't what you wanted to hear. J Milburn (talk) 16:25, 29 July 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, it's best to get the news that it needs a lot of work now than nominating it then finding out. Thanks for all the help, I'll start taking a look at the issues. Thanks, Mat  ty  .  007  16:29, 29 July 2014 (UTC) (Oh, and before I forget, thanks for adding the cats and helping on the quote).
 * Template:Cite ODNB is good- it has a nice way of handling the "subscription needed" note. To be clear, this is a solid article (even if the writing's a bit all over the place in a few places) and a great topic, combining several interests of mine! However, the FA bar for biographies is very high. J Milburn (talk) 16:36, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

Odd sentence in lead
"His notable achievements in the bomb squad were negotiating the rise of The Angry Brigade, eventually jailing several members." There's two things wrong here. It says "achievements" but only gives one. And more seriously, how did he negotiate their "rise"? It's been that way since April 2014, when the article's creator finished his work on it. Maproom (talk) 08:30, 20 November 2023 (UTC)