Talk:Ethylene glycol/Archive 1

where does the ethylene come from?
I meant instead: where does the ethylene come from? Or rather, from what natural source does the ethylene come? Commercial quantities of ethylene production starts with either natural gas liquids (from natural gas) or from naptha, which comes from oil refining. In nature, ethylene is produced by the ripening of tomatoes.

how produced
Does anyone know the source of ethylene glycol or how it is produced?
 * See the article - from ethylene, which is converted to ethylene oxide, which then reacts with water and forms ethylene glycol. --Shaddack 00:30, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

boiling points of ethylene glycol mixtures
Anyone know the boiling points of ethylene glycol mixtures?
 * See the tables here: http://www.ashchem.com/adc/chemicals/faq_answer.asp?typeID=3&is_header=N --Shaddack 00:30, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

produced or found in nature?
Can ethylene glycol (not ethylene) be produced or found in nature?
 * Is it true that antifreeze can be diluted and poured into a sewer with no environmental problems? It's degraded by bacteria? — Omegatron 03:58, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

Safety
A nasty story of a man left blind and deaf after ingesting antifreeze. I would have added it to this article, but the story doesn't definitively say that the substance involved was ethylene glycol. Richard W.M. Jones 15:29, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

JMOL figure not equilibrium structure
The equilibrium structure of EG does not have C2h symmetry, it has C1 symmetry. Outlined in this paper. Journal of Molecular Spectroscopy 205, 185–196 (2001) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 146.6.144.70 (talk) 21:39, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Diethylene glycol toxicity
The information about diethylene glycol toxicity, (Haiti, Austria) although a related chemical, is not really appropriate for this document, perhaps it should be in diethylene glycol.

Industrial Hazards
I like including a reference to the "Apollo 1" fire in this section. However, the use of the word "caused" wrt the fire seems wrong. Unless someone can quote a more authoritative reference, the following appears in NASA's final report on the accident under PART V. INVESTIGATION AND ANALYSES:

"There is no substantial evidence that coolant was involved in the initiation of the fire.   However, this coolant, when spilled on damaged electrical wires and equipment, provides    both the fuel and the ignition mechanism to start a fire. This has been demonstrated in    laboratory tests."

ref: http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/Apollo204/invest.html

The coolant referred to is "RS-89", "a mixture of 62.5 percent ethylene glycol, 35.7 percent water, and 1.8 percent stabilizer and corrosion inhibitor."

I think words/phrases like "implicated in", "associated with", "possible cause", etc. would be more appropriate, e.g. "In the Apollo 1 fire catastrophe a coolant comprised mostly of ethylene glycol was implicated as a possible cause via this reaction."

70.92.87.231 22:43, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Reactivity due to pH variations
What type of reactions does ethylene glycol undergo when acid or base is added? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.113.83.253 (talk) 03:38, 4 April 2007 (UTC).

Found in space
I've removed this chunk because I can't find the article at the source website.

This molecule has been observed in space by Hollis, et al. http://www.journals.uchicago.edu/ApJ/
 * Interstellar Antifreeze: Ethylene Glycol doi:10.1086/341148

--Rifleman 82 03:58, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Flammability
Was curious as to the flammability, after looking at the flashpoint info. Anyone? Being an alcohol, I was suprised to see nothing in the article about it. Pharmboy (talk) 03:09, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

According to my information Ethylene glycol in not inflammable in the sense as petrol. Pathare Prabhu (talk) 02:16, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

MEG
Where can I find a list of countries which produce Mono Ethylene Glycol and a list of distributors?Robbie.Elmes (talk) 10:37, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Isophorone
The formula for isophorone is incorrect. The ketone should be α,β-unsaturated. --Vuo (talk) 14:52, 20 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Fixed (refresh might be needed). My bad! --Rifleman 82 (talk) 15:26, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

Melting/freezing point?
Ethylene glycol is used in car antifreeze (usually mixed with water). But in many areas of the world, temperatures can go way below -12 degrees C, how come ethylene glycol doesn't freeze then? Raduberinde (talk) 17:10, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Hi! That is a quite difficult process.  But even a mixture of water and sodium chloride (normal salt) has a melting point lower than water (in the eutectic point at -21.2 degrees C).  Some explanation is there (at eutectic point), the full explanation would include some thermodynamics, probably.  Hope this explains.  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 15:11, 22 July 2008 (UTC)


 * In extreme conditions, it probably does freeze. The problem is dealt with using a block heater.  -- Ed (Edgar181) 15:14, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
 * If coolant freezes, wouldn't everything be ripped to shreds because of the expanding ice? Raduberinde (talk) 17:10, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Not if there is air or other gas in the line. -- Ed (Edgar181) 17:19, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
 * The eutectic mixture stuff explains it, thanks! In opposition to my intuition, you can get a mixture of water and ethylene glycol which has a much lower freezing point than either of the constituents (as low as -50C!). Perhaps this little bit of information could go in the Antifreeze page? Raduberinde (talk) 17:10, 22 July 2008 (UTC)
 * Raduberinde, this is Wikipedia, the encyclopedia that anyone can edit, why don't you give it a go? --Dirk Beetstra T  C 08:55, 23 July 2008 (UTC)

Ethylene glycol as a refrigerant
I know there are refrigerating systems using Ethylene glycol as a refrigerant. Nothing of that is given in the article. Danfoss are making compressors for that. They recommend R134a refrigerant but it is same as ethylene glycol. Pathare Prabhu (talk) 02:19, 22 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Ethylene Glycol may be used as a heat transfer fluid, but definitely not as a refrigerant, and R134a is tetrafluoroethane (boiling point -26 C, lower than 40% EG freezes -23 C)
 * 24.148.80.51 (talk) 18:45, 18 April 2013 (UTC)

Liquid armour
This product is also sed in Liquid Body Armor.This site: http://www.military.com/NewsContent/0,13319,usa3_042104.00.html is about Liquid ArmorAgre22 (talk) 19:59, 12 December 2008 (UTC)agre22
 * This is kind of funny. It says that ethylene glycol isn't toxic. 207.210.29.71 (talk) 04:54, 31 December 2008 (UTC)
 * hmmm... maybe because what they are making it from is "polyethylene glycol" HO-CH2-(CH2-O-CH2-)n-CH2-OH. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.173.221.81 (talk) 03:39, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Error in reaction diagram.
In the Chemistry section, there's an error in the reaction diagram. It does not match the text. The text claims that para-Toluenesulfonic acid is used as a catalyst, yet the reaction diagram shows PhCH3, which is only toluene.--Bfesser (talk) 17:11, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Error in temperature table.
9°F are not -23°C. -9°F = -23°C

Taste?
I have removed this, to prevent the fiew who may from trying the chemical. (How do we know what it tastes like?) Russellsaccount (talk) 03:15, 8 February 2010 (UTC)
 * We also report melting points, but we don't worry about kids heating things to 250 deg C. If it's a property of it, why not mention it? I've never tasted it, but generally chemicals that have multiple hydroxyl groups are sweet. PDCook (talk) 13:23, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
 * You should sometimes check old pharmacopoeias, they're incredible, reporting tastes of things that definitely shouldn't be tasted. Unfortunately this information can no longer be found in modern sources. --vuo (talk) 18:38, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree that it probably should be included, but there is something very ironic about putting that something tastes sweet and immediately afterwards that ingestion can cause death, but maybe this is the only way to warn people not to do it. Since the old pharmacopeias would be in the public domain, it would be good to add them to Wikisource if they are not available at Project Gutenberg. I think that sourcing it is important to show that this is not being done by modern chemists to keep the warning from being seen as not serious (like some of those funny warning labels you can lookup on the internet). It is not just this concern, however, but also Wikipedia policy on reliable sourcing.--Jorfer (talk) 02:16, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

The taste of POISONS is a key FACT. Ethylene glycol tastes SWEET which is why it poses such a danger to mammals.-96.237.78.13 (talk) 15:56, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

Diethylene glycol in antifreeze
Most commercial Ethylene glycol antifreeze in the US contains a few percent Diethylene glycol. Why? Because it is a common byproduct/contaminant of the production process, that would be trouble or expense to remove? Does it add desirable properties?-96.237.78.13 (talk) 16:23, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

VLE data for ethylene glycol
data regarding vle for water as an another component is of interest for analysis. for fitting in an predictive modells such as "wilson's" "NRTL's" "UNIFAC" we need to verify with the actual data (experimental) but in literature search for VLE data we could get T xy data. Which could be use but checking it for thermodynamic consistancy it won't stand valid. So for the validity of thermodynamic consistancy we require data in the format of P xy. Which is difficult to get.\ I request if data are available please link it to wikipedia. all using it will be really pleased. thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Inder solar (talk • contribs) 05:04, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

There is some data on ethylene glycol and water mixture available on the manufacturers website MEGlobal Following is the link to it http://www.meglobal.biz/media/product_guides/MEGlobal_MEG.pdf — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ashwin Date (talk • contribs) 06:34, 1 May 2014 (UTC)

What is produced when it "breaks down" in the environment?
The article states that: "Ethylene glycol in water and in soil will break down within several days to a few weeks." What does this mean? What chemicals are present after it has broken down? Presumably those chemicals are harmless, or less harmful than ethylene glycol itself, but we can't tell from this article. (Marzolian - not logged in)208.185.201.194 (talk) 22:15, 4 April 2011 (UTC)
 * It may form oxalate and ultimately carbon dioxide and water, but without a source I won't be adding it. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 11:06, 6 November 2013 (UTC)

Miscibility
This article states that Ethylene glycol is "Miscible with water in all proportions." I believe that's redundant. My understanding of the word miscible is that it means the materials can form a mixture in any proportion. Therefore, wouldn't the correct statement be, "Miscible with water."?

Confusion with Propylene Glycol
I added the Template:Distinguish for Propylene Glycol. As many people confuse the two when citing human toxicity. For example Austin News called Electronic cigarette poisonous as "They use the same ingredient as car antifreeze". When in fact car antifreeze uses Ethylene Glycol and ecigarretes use Propylene Glycol. Charles Dayton  (Talk)  16:58, 11 March 2012 (UTC)