Talk:Etrog

Grafting
One thing I find unclear is the topic of grafting. Is citron non-kosher if any branch at all has been grafted to the tree, even if that's not the branch that the citron came from (aka, the citron in question genetically identical to its rootstock)? Aka, does having any graft of any sort anywhere on the tree "contaminate" all of the citron growing on non-grafted branches and render them non-kosher? The article isn't very clear on that. -- Rei (talk) 12:12, 30 December 2017 (UTC)


 * The logic is that the citron needs to have grown totally from a citron tree, so it wouldn`t matter if another branch was grafted.
 * As far as I understand if for example a lemon branch would be grafted on a citron tree it would grow lemons not 'impure' citrons (there wouldn`t be logic to do so because lemons are strong trees while citrons are weak so one would graft a citron on a lemon tree not vice versa). גוי אחד בארץ (talk) 23:21, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

It`s worth mentioning that there is no talmudic or medieval (rishonim) mention of grafting being a problem. It has also been questioned by several achronim including Rabbi Joel Sirkis--גוי אחד בארץ (talk) 23:27, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

Issues with article
This article has several issues with it. First off, it mentions that Etrog is Hebrew, when it fact it is Aramaic. The correct Hebrew word is Tapuach (commonly but mistakenly translated as Apple). See Shir Hashirim 7:9, Targum on Tapuchim is Etroga. Also see מסכת שבת דף פח א תוס פריו, and Beer Mayim Chayim - Sdeh Tapuchim on Rashi Kerayach Sdeh on Bereshith 27:27. Furthermore, the Tapuach being the Citron is not universally accepted, Yeminites use a different type of fruit.


 * Yeminites use a different type of fruit for what? Ortho 03:35, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Ortho: Yeminities use a fruit that isn't a Citron for fullfilling their obligation to take a Pri Etz Hadar on Succoth. Nachman - 217.132.15.38 17:56, 21 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Nachman, I'm very familiar with the "Etrog Temany" (Yemenite Etrog). What is it if not a type of Citron? Ortho 00:10, 22 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Yeminites use a variety of citron which grew in Yemen (currently also grown in Israel.)≈≈≈≈ גוי אחד בארץ (talk) 23:30, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

Sign your names please
Hello everyone, please use the four tildes ~ to sign your comments so that we can know who is saying what to whom. Thanks. IZAK 08:15, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

New Link
The Teimany already has a page of its own go to Yemenite Citron. Shoteh (talk) 17:42, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

relation to ingredient for bakery ?
Can anyone confirm that this fruit is used to produce the ingredient for bakery called "Sukkade" in german (translated by 'candied peel' by ) ?

if so, it would be nice to put a link on the corresponding wiki page, where there is no word found about it so far. I was quite ignorant about any possible relation between bakery and a jewish festivity, and think I am not the only ignorant one ;)

Thanks! Eva 82.135.87.243 12:46, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

You can see that Etrog is Hebrew for citron which would turnout in German for

Cedro 19:01, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

Ancient Fruit
Why is the Yemenite more ancient than others? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.113.246.69 (talk) 14:47, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Infobox
This page should not have the taxobox infobox, but should instead have the cultivar infobox. The taxobox gives one the impression that this article is for the species Citrus medica when it's really for a cultivar of that species. --Rkitko (talk) 17:08, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Etrog
Hey, the source you requested is there. If you think anything else is not accurate you may request sources, but please note that not everything you didn't hear of means it is not correct. - CitricAsset (talk) 04:15, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Just a glance at the "diagram" of an etrog's "anatomy" that you introduced is enough to show that you don't have a clue. The terms are "oketz" and "hotam" - not "uketz" and "hotem." The English is also substandard. My attempts were to make the article sound more professional. If you insist on making it sound idiotic, be my guest.--Gilabrand (talk) 05:46, 27 February 2008 (UTC)--Gilabrand (talk) 06:15, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
 * I tried to fulfill your request, any other issues? - CitricAsset (talk) 05:02, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
 * You fixed the diagram, but not the text of the article. Also, a blog is not a valid source, and the English needs serious editing.--Gilabrand (talk) 05:54, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
 * (User:CitricAsset) made a great job doing a digest from important rabbinical sources, he shouldn't get regreted, but appreciated. If the grammar is bad, it is not so difficult to correct it. I'll give a try soon.

Shoteh (talk) 15:11, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

WikiProject Food and drink Tagging
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Unexplained deletion
May I ask why this information, given under the title "Cultural influence", was deleted without any explanation?
 * In the Israeli politics etrog has become an epithet for a politician whom journalists prefer not to criticize in order to pave his way to a certain political position, or in order to promote common interests. The first use of this metaphore is attributed to the Israeli journalist Amnon Abramovich. In February 2005, during Ariel Sharon's campaign to promote his Disengagement plan, Abramovich who supported Sharon's plan said that Israeli journalists should treat Sharon like etrog: so long as the Disengagement plan is not completed they should cherish him and refrain from attacking him, but once the plan is carried out they should treat him like an etrog after the holiday is over, i.e. stop protecting him . This metaphore caught up quickly, and today it is not uncmmon to use the term as a verb, e.g. The press etrogs certain ministers (לְאַתְרֵג).

DrorK (talk) 17:34, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry for not explaining, I didn't delete it. I only "moved" it to a separate title Etrog (political term), since it doesn't belong in this article which is about the Etrog of the ritual. In fact, this article was once named "Etrog (ritual)" and I dont know why it was changed to "Etrog". I hope this helps. -Shoteh (talk) 18:34, 3 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I wonder if there is enough information in the paragraph to become a separate article. The paragraph was meant to demonstrate how the ritual is used metaphorically in Israeli/Jewish discourse. DrorK (talk) 21:01, 3 August 2008 (UTC)

Etrog rivision
Thanks for Gilabrand for revising the Etrog article to a more professional english, and correct style. I am reviewing your work, as to moniter the important information. I guess that you realized that there are some large bulky paragraphs that must be split, and that the graphic layout may be enhanced by placing some pictures at left, so that they don't cause the text to be shifted to their bottom.

As of now I would comment that the Etrog does not refer only to a single variety, nor to those varieties used for the ritual. Etrog is actually the common Hebrew name for all kinds of citron or citrus medica. Even a fingered citron is called Etrog haEtzaboth אתרוג האצבעות. You may enter also that Etrog in its Sephardic romanization is also the one adapted in Modern Hebrew. Thanks again, keep on. shoteh (talk) 03:54, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

Reasons for deletion
Someone decided to compose a fiction about Nehemiah refering to olive branches as "pri eitz hadar" as false evidence that the idenitifcation of the etrog as "pri eitz hadar" is of a "late date." In reality, Nehemiah 8:15 refers to oilve branches as one would expect "alei zayit" and "alei eitz shemen." The phrase "pri eitz hadar" does not appear anywhere in the verse. Likewise, the unsupported statement that the identification of the etrog as the "pri eitz hadar" began during the Second Temple Period has no foundation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Yosefsimcha (talk • contribs) 20:23, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Fruit or Judaism?
There are two reasons you might end up at this article. One is that it's a fruit and you're interested in the biological aspects (what makes a citron an etrog, lineage history, etc.). The other is that you're interested in the Jewish view of an etrog. I came for the former so to find that I've skipped from biology to theology by following a link was a surprise. Perhaps one section for each reason?

Secondly, if we're worried about the specifically Jewish aspects of it, can I suggest you reorder the article? It has no leading-in structure, so if you happen not to be informed about Judaism it's a nightmare to read.

It appears, with a lot of reading between the lines, that it's used in a ritual/celebration/something (although not how) and that the (buried in a paragraph, rather than pulled out) biblical quote is the reason why it's used (which could be a lot more obvious, I read that paragraph three times before realising what I should take away from it, since it doesn't mention Sukkot itself and nor does the accompanying text).

It also appears that an etrog must be kosher to be used, that certain properties decide if it is kosher, and that other properties decide, for a kosher etrog, that it's also desirable. Perhaps some sort of list of the elements to consider, with separation of those two categories, would be more useful than the enormous run-on paragraph? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.72.123.240 (talk) 19:49, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

The Syrian word for Citrus medica is Kabbad according to the entry on Citron. This is remarkably similar to the Lubavitch sect Chabad - a Hebrew rebus on Wisdom, Understanding & Knowledge. 121.210.67.247 (talk) 01:59, 1 March 2017 (UTC) Ian Ison

Lack of information on the ritual role of the Etrog
The article lacks any information on the Etrog's ritual function and its meaning. It would be nice if someone knowledgeable would take the trouble and add the information. Less importantly, Etrog rates very low as food, as its use as such is minimal and I can't understand why it was included in the Food portal. (talk) 01:22, 20 May 2012 (UTC)

Copyvios
I've been doing some online research about etrog orchards, and noticed whole paragraphs in this article copied from etrog.info, so I removed them. Per Wikipedia rules, every statement needs to be sourced and paraphrased. Also, this page is nowhere near B or C class; I downrated it to Start. Yoninah (talk) 20:18, 30 August 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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Hebrew Wikipedia
Strangely, given the importance of the etrog in Jewish ritual, this article does not link to the article אתרוג in Hebrew Wikipedia. I tried to add a link, but was unable to as that article already links to Citron. Since both that article and this one relate to the fruit Citrus medica, I don't want to remove the other link. Bur there really must be a link from this article to the Hebrew article. How should I proceed? RolandR (talk) 21:51, 15 November 2023 (UTC)