Talk:Evonne Goolagong Cawley

WikiProject class rating
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 11:01, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Request for wider input on discussion at WikiProject Tennis
There is a long, ongoing discussion at WP:Tennis about the tournament tables found in tennis articles on English-language Wikipedia (e.g., this type of table). The discussion is about whether the "official sponsored name" of a tournament - such as Pacific Life Open - or another tournament name without the sponsor - such as Indian Wells Masters - must be used in those articles. Please join the discussion here. Thanks. Tennis expert (talk) 09:22, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Possible additional References
For anyone interested in expanding the article: Mentions Evonne traveled with her brother Ian to Timor Her Brother Ian who played with her in mixed doubles in Wimbledon: Can not find any mention of Evonnes other siblings 114.76.85.3 (talk) 08:06, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
 * http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1108680/index.htm
 * http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1012909/index.htm
 * http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1093463/index.htm
 * http://theland.farmonline.com.au/news/state/agribusiness-and-general/general/barellan-makes-a-racquet/1637320.aspx
 * http://www.womenaustralia.info/biogs/IMP0070b.htm
 * http://www.eniar.org/news/sport2.html
 * http://blog.taragana.com/sports/2009/09/14/evonne-goolagong-cawley-grand-slam-winning-mom-congratulates-kim-clijsters-on-us-open-win-28684/
 * http://www.smh.com.au/news/sport/goolagong-cawley-finally-a-world-no1/2007/12/27/1198345162454.html
 * http://www.dsf.org.au/learningchoices/expo_speakers.php
 * http://bleacherreport.com/articles/263244-thank-god-for-tennis-goolagong-cawley-evert-borg-and-mcenroe-too
 * http://www.smh.com.au/news/SPORT/Goolagong-Cawley-takes-tennis-to-Timor/2005/12/06/1133829587279.html
 * http://www.starnewsgroup.com.au/story/83883
 * http://www.whittlesea.vic.gov.au/content/content.asp?cnid=4009
 * http://www.toptenn.com/venue-burwood.htm
 * 122 Ian Goolagong
 * Ian Goolagong is available for tennis coaching

Siblings names in goolagong article as well as name meaning
—Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.76.73.71 (talk) 05:56, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Goolagong means "tall trees by still waters"
 * Siblings names:
 * (younger brother)Ian 19, plays tennis in Texas State Collage
 * (2 younger brothers) Kevin and Martin are sheep shearers who live in Barellan,NSW
 * (2 younger sisters) Gale and Janelle who live in Barellan,NSW
 * older brother Larry (married and lives in Sydney)
 * older sister Barbara (married and lives in Sydney)
 * Ian's A Goolagong By Name, Not By Deed. The Age - Jul 2, 1982
 * 19 year old brother Martin —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.76.73.71 (talk) 06:52, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
 * How the Daughter of an Ancient Race Made It Out of the Australian Outback By Hitting a Tennis Ball Sweetly and Hard; Evonne Goolagong, By HARRY GORDON, August 29, 1971, Sunday, Section: magazine, Page SM10 ,home court as often as possible with her two-years-older brother Larry —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.76.73.71 (talk) 07:04, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Goolagong Fools Coach---Wins at Wimbledon, Teen-Ager Upsets Defending Champion in 61-Minute Rout GOOLAGONG WINS, Los Angeles Times (1923-Current File) - Los Angeles, Calif. Date: Jul 3, 1971 There could he another Goolagong around the ten nis circuit in a few years time Evonne has a 12 yearold sister Janelle who has tennis talent too  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.76.73.71 (talk) 07:09, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Evonne Seen Next World Net Queen, Reading Eagle - Apr 4, 1971 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.76.73.71 (talk) 07:27, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Kenneth Goolagong Dead at 44; Tennis Star's Father Hit by Car; Part-Time Fruit-Picker, October 6, 1974, Sunday, Section: GN, Page 65, 302 words Kenneth Goolagong, father of the tennis champion Evonne Goolagong, was struck by a car and killed here today in this town 450 miles west of Sydney. He was 44 years old. 114.76.73.71 (talk) 11:37, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
 * Re: Ian and Martin: How could her siblings be in their teens if she's in her 60s? 97.116.52.160 (talk) 20:17, 17 June 2017 (UTC)

Goolagong or Goolagong- Cawley?
Is there a reason why this article is not called "Evonne Goolagong- Cawley"? In media nad other sources, that seems to be her name nowadays. I can shift it, just wanted to check that there isn't a reason this hasn't happened already.WotherspoonSmith (talk) 11:29, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
 * You said it. "nowadays". Wikipedia has no obligation to rewrite history and create a new reality by effectively changing how she is addressed according to some recent "fashion" that is here today and gone tomorrow. That would amount to WP:RECENTISM. It would have been relevant only if there was any indication that she has actively changed her name at some point in time, which she hasn't. --Loginnigol 12:44, 26 January 2018 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Loginnigol (talk • contribs)
 * --Loginnigo, I hate to break the news to you, but women using their married name as their full name is not a "recent fashion"... of a trend "here today and gone tomorrow"... Welcome to the 21st century. Stevenmitchell (talk) 10:25, 5 September 2022 (UTC)

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Religious connection
One of the teachings of the religious group, The Family International, is that there is a demon named "Hong Kong Goolagong". Although founder David Berg claimed the name was revealed to him during a coughing fit, numerous commentators believe the true source of the name is Cawley's. Berg himself eventually acknowledged the possible connection in his own correspondences (but continued to express belief in the demon). Given the fringe nature of this religious group (which Cawley has no links to), I'm not sure if it's notable enough to include here or not. 97.116.52.160 (talk) 20:25, 17 June 2017 (UTC)

Evonne Billabong
Can anyone find a reference for this humorous and affectionate nickname? I can remember her being called that in UK during her years of greatness in the 70s.

I can also remember, I regret to say, a drawing (disgusting to decent-minded people and publicly condemned at the time) in a UK tabloid newspaper in the 70s of what she might have looked like playing tennis naked :-( Very unpleasant; but if it can be documented, it should be. Narky Blert (talk) 20:32, 29 March 2018 (UTC)
 * No it should really not be if it's one drawing from a 70 tabloid. If it made worldwide news maybe. Fyunck(click) (talk) 23:39, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Playing Style
A playing style section would be helpful? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.248.54.158 (talk) 17:22, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Does the title conform to Wikipedia policy (WP:COMMONNAME)?
The subject of the article seems to be widely known as Evonne Goolagong, even in the article she is referred to as "Goolagong", not "Goolagong Cawley". In accordance with WP:COMMONNAME should that be the title of the article? Park3r (talk) 02:49, 10 December 2022 (UTC)

Requested move 10 December 2022

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion. 

The result of the move request was: Not moved. This nomination was clearly made in good faith and some of the opposition didn't give it the respect that a good faith nomination deserves, but there is a clear consensus against the proposed move. (non-admin closure) Iffy★Chat -- 16:28, 25 December 2022 (UTC)

Evonne Goolagong Cawley → Evonne Goolagong – In accordance with WP:COMMONNAME and the "Recognizability" principle in WP:CRITERIA, Evonne Goolagong seems to be the better name for this article. The article text itself refers to her as "Goolagong" rather than "Goolagong Cawley" Park3r (talk) 02:56, 10 December 2022 (UTC) — Relisting. echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  09:35, 18 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Looking over the previous 20 years, most awards and recognition credit the subject as "Evonne Goolagong Cawley", including Sport Australia Hall of Fame, Companion of the Order of Australia, National Museum of Australia, ITF Philippe Chatrier Award and Australia Post. WWGB (talk) 04:10, 10 December 2022 (UTC)

Massive Keep - I don't see why we would rewrite history and change how she is addressed. WP:RECENTISM comes into play. Is there any indication that she has actively changed her name. Even the National Museum of Australia uses Cawley. The Olympics and Encyclopedia Britannica use Goolagong Cawley. Sorry but his seems like a strange request. Fyunck(click) (talk) 08:02, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * It seems to be split. Here's the Sydney Morning Herald calling her Evonne Goolagong. Her foundation is called the "Evonne Goolagong Foundation" and her Twitter account (admittedly not active) uses "Evonne Eoolagong". So does the Australian National Portrait Gallery in the header at least. . Her autobiography is titled "Home!: The Evonne Goolagong Story". There's another book called "Sunshine Super Girl: The Evonne Goolagong Story" and few other biographies that call her Evonne Goolagong. The article text itself calls her "Goolagong" and not "Goolagong Cowley", and that's her name in the infobox. It's a legitimate question (not "strange"), but obviously not an entirely settled one, otherwise I would have attempted the move myself, without consultation. Park3r (talk) 11:29, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * You mentioned her foundation being called the "Evonne Goolangong Foundation" but when that same foundation explains who it is named after they say "ABOUT EVONNE GOOLAGONG-CAWLEY Evonne Goolagong Cawley, AC, MBE is a Wiradjuri Aborigine." Tennis Australia uses Evonne (Goolagong) Cawley. The two ruling bodies of tennis use Evonne Goolagong Cawley, the ITF and the WTA. The twitter account you talked about is not a verified twitter account so it could be made by fans considering goolagong isn't even capitalized. The portrait gallery photo of course uses Evonne Goolagong for it's header. The submitted photo was taken in 1970 when she was 19 years old and not married (till 1975). But in the detail section of that portrait gallery where it says who the photo is about it says "Evonne Goolagong Cawley AC MBE." Fyunck(click) (talk) 19:52, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * The point was to illustrate that this is not a “strange” request, but one that should be considered. Secondly, this seems to be the mirror image of the discussion on Ash Barty. If say, Steffi Graf were to start using the name “Steffi Graf Agassi” would we retitle the Wikipedia article? I think not. That’s the reason why I referred to  “Recognizabity” in WP:CRITERIA; which is the policy for determining article names. Would the average person looking for information on the subject search for “Evonne Goolagong Cawley” or “Evonne Goolagong”? I would argue the latter, and this is bolstered by the fact that the article itself uses “Goolagong” in its text. This also bolsters the case for “Goolagong” fulfilling the “naturalness” requirement in WP:CRITERIA. Furthermore, the “Concision” criterion is met by the shorter form of the name. EDIT: Also the International Tennis Hall of Fame uses "Evonne Goolagong". Park3r (talk) 22:17, 10 December 2022 (UTC)
 * I see that. And the Australian Tennis Hall of Fame, her home country, uses Evonne Goolagong Cawley. Oh and the New South Wales Sports Hall of Fame, where she was born, uses Evonne Goolagong Cawley.. And if you go to the town she was raised, Barellan, Australia, you can visit Evonne Goolagong-Cawley park.. I just don't see the point in changing this article. Fyunck(click) (talk) 05:11, 12 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Relisting comment: To form a clearer consensus echidnaLives  -  talk  -  edits  09:35, 18 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Support per nomination. Subject achieved international fame as Evonne Goolagong and that is indeed her WP:COMMONNAME in the rest of the world, outside of her native Australia. International Tennis Hall of Fame lists Margaret Court as Margaret Smith Court because she achieved international notability as both Margaret Smith and Margaret Court, although she achieved the greatest portion of her notability as Margaret Court. Evonne Goolagong, on the other hand, achieved her entire international notability not as Evonne Goolagong Cawley, but solely as Evonne Goolagong and is thus listed as Evonne Goolagong in the International Tennis Hall of Fame. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 00:26, 22 December 2022 (UTC)
 * Where did this falsehood come from? It is complete balderdash. Goolagong Cawley played from 1967 through 1983. She married Mr Cawley in June of 1975. She won four major titles pre-marriage and three major titles after her name change. In January of 1976, after she won the Australian Open the press was pretty universal in saying that Evonne Goolagong Cawley won the championship... whether it's the San francisco Examiner, the Chicago Tribune, or the Miami Herald. On January 9 of 1976 there was a tennis battle of the sexes on tv (filmed in October of 1975) with the heading in tv Guide of "The Challenge of the Sexes - Evonne Goolagong Cawley and Elie Nastase." Goolagong won. Much of Goolagong Cawley's career took place after her name change. The tennis Hall of Fame doesn't use Cawley but the Australian Tennis Hall of Fame does! I can certainly see someone having an opinion that differs and wants to drop Cawley, but base it on facts not fiction. Fyunck(click) (talk) 01:11, 22 December 2022 (UTC)
 * In view of those facts, I am striking my above "Support" vote and am replacing it with Neutral. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 16:15, 22 December 2022 (UTC)

Comment WP:CRITERIA remain unaddressed by the side that wants to keep the name. Unless there’s some other policy for tennis players that overrides general article naming policy. Park3r (talk) 20:31, 22 December 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't see that at all. There are reasonable criteria for either version of her name. Both versions are quite common in every day usage. Both are common in the context of the governing bodies of tennis. She went by both versions during her long career (about 3/5 to 2/5 with just Goolagong). The press has used both versions. I think you were incorrect with your original conclusions on common-name and I simply don't see a reason to change it. Sure if 30 editors overwhelmingly think just Goolagong is a better fit we'll move it, but this is in your court to provide overwhelming evidence that Goolagong Cawley is not used much. Had you done so then editors would have rightly jumped onto your ship. I think using Cawley is the most popular but even if it's 50/50, it's not a reason to change without a heap of consensus to do so. Fyunck(click) (talk) 23:12, 22 December 2022 (UTC)


 * Oppose. I'm perplexed as to why the instigator of this proposal thinks there's any evidence for the shorter version being the common name, or there being a "recognisability" argument is not using a name that she's primarily known by. We understand the policy perfectly well; we're just pointing out that you've got your facts wrong and as such you're trying to incorrectly apply the policy. The Drover&#39;s Wife (talk) 09:58, 25 December 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

In which four Grand Slam Events did she miss the Finals?
Paragraph two of the Career and Grand Slam tournament success section has the following text:

From her first Grand Slam singles final appearance in January 1971, to December 1977 when she won her last Grand Slam title of the 1970s, she played in 21 Grand Slam events. Her only four defeats prior to the finals came at the 1972 US Open in the third round; 1974 Wimbledon, where she was defeated in the quarterfinals; and at the semifinal stage at Wimbledon in 1973. To start the decade, she was defeated at the 1970 Australian Open in the quarterfinals and in the second round of the 1970 Wimbledon. In 1971, 1975, 1976 and 1977, Goolagong reached the final of every Grand Slam championship in which she competed.

That lists five different tournaments. Anyone able to determine which four to keep? Bro rick (talk) 16:38, 28 August 2023 (UTC)
 * The one line says "...and at the semifinal stage at Wimbledon in 1973." It should say "...and at the semifinal stages of the French Open and Wimbledon in 1973." That would make four. I fixed it. Fyunck(click) (talk) 18:48, 28 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I see that I could have fixed it and saved both of us a little time. Bro rick (talk) 19:01, 16 September 2023 (UTC)