Talk:Falmouth, Cornwall/Archive 1

Comment
Are Cornwall and England not separate entities? I don't really want to get into a civil war on the subject. :) RickK 05:28 13 Jul 2003 (UTC)


 * Okay, I'll bring this up on Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (city names) - Efghij

Article needs lots of flesh... 'HARBORS' NOTES THAT Falmouth Harbor is possible contender for second largest natural harbor in the whole world. THAT certainly deserves more mention than references to business shifts and tourism! fabartus@comcast.net


 * I hold copyright for this piece (including the maps) that I wrote hurriedly for the Jacob's Ladder Inn in Falmouth: About Falmouth. (They're friends of mine, I did their website as a not-for-profit task.) While I have no great commercial motive here, I think if I do it would be only polite to mention the Inn and provide a link (although I do not need their permission, I think it would be good form). Hope that might be OK. I think it could use a bit of revising too, but it was very hurried. Tarquin Binary 02:08, 31 October 2005 (UTC)


 * I have revised this quite a bit. I haven't thrown anything away, but moved them into a more logical order - I hope - and provided headings. I also added the Falmouth College piece, and linked it to the Wiki article, since it is a major part of the town. Whilst the port may well have declined, it is still a major working port and docks. The same could be said of its tourism economy, it is much more likely to be a day visit destination than a base.LessHeard vanU 22:30, 17 March 2006 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the tidy up, it was probably long overdue. It also shows that there is a huge gap in the history - the development of the town needs to be seen in context with the mail packets. Geof Sheppard 08:31, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Notable visitors
Do we really need a notable visitors section? I'm sure Florence Nightingale visited lots of places but that doesn't make it notable information. Perhaps this information would be better spread over over sections like history. Any comments? Mammal4 10:12, 14 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Ok this is getting a bit unbalanced now - we have a few short paragraphs detailing Falmouth's history etc, and then three sections on people or fictional characters with sometimes very tenuous links to the town - i think that this needs to be rewritten. Mammal4 13:14, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Re-Write Falmouth
I hope so! Is reading a good start?

I see User:Mammal4 is in the Penwith Wikiproject can she/he advise us ?

BTW Tarquin's link is broken and the Jacob's Ladder Inn is closed for re-furbishment.

===Vernon White (talk)  22:13, 24 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Sure - I haven't read this one myself, but any book written specifically about Falmouth would be a good place to start. For an idea of how these articles should be structured take a look at St Buryan, which has recently been graded as a good article.  There are also some ideas on the Penwith wikiproject page although these are a little out of date.  have fun! Mammal4 07:10, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

"citation needed" tagging
I'm not sure why the mention of the gold robbery was singled out to be tagged with when there are many other unsourced facts and the wikilink leads to an article with sources. But have added the reference anyway. PamD 15:57, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Fal and Vikings
I have amended paragraph 2 on two accounts.

The description of the word Fal as a word of Norse/Viking/Danish origin is unevidenced. It's origin is unknown but may well be pre-Celtic (see Adrian ROOM, British place names.)If there is evidence for a Viking origin for the word please put it up.

The reference to a Cornish/Viking alliance is too sweeping. The only documentary evidence we have is a single reference in the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle for 838. See the Cornwall article where I have written on this Cornish/Viking thing. Crococolana 20:13, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Wodehouse family
ODNB says "Wodehouse succeeded his grandfather as third Baron Wodehouse on 29 May 1846, and inherited almost 10,000 acres in Norfolk and several hundred in Cornwall, including virtually the whole of Falmouth parish." - Article by John Powell, ‘Wodehouse, John, first earl of Kimberley (1826–1902)’, Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, Oxford University Press, Sept 2004; online edn, May 2006, accessed 8 Sept 2007."

The Wodehouse family is commemorated in Falmouth by various street-names and Kimberley Park. It would be good if the article reflected their contribution to the development of the town. Vernon White '''. . . Talk''' 20:58, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

Harbour claim
This has

"Together with Carrick Roads, it forms the third deepest natural harbour in the world, and the deepest in Western Europe."

But the Carrick Roads article claims it is "the third largest natural harbour"; so which is it? Swanny18 (talk) 16:59, 6 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Third deepest. QueenCake (talk) 18:43, 3 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Twofold Bay, New South Wales, Australia (Eden) also claims to have the third deepest natural harbour in the world. I think these definitions are imprecise - maybe in some definitions Twofolks Bay isn't a Harbour because it's not fully enclosed - but how does one decide?  Jpp42 (talk) 10:54, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

History
According to Mee, Arthur (1937) Cornwall. London: Hodder & Stoughton; pp. 62-67 the name Pennycomequick was due to Sir Peter Killigrew in the time of the Commonwealth (previously Smithwick) and Falmouth was due to Charles II. The Cornish version of PCQ looks like a phonetic version of the English rather than a real old Cornish name. They were fond of these meaningful names at that time, e.g Labour in Vain, Come to Good, but Killigrew would be unlikely to use Cornish at such a late date.--Felix Folio Secundus (talk) 06:11, 25 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I am removing the by whom tag from the claim that that an earlier Celtic name for the place was Peny-cwm-cuic, which has been Anglicized to 'Pennycomequick', since that claim is made in the cited source. Incidentally, whether the Cornish version 'looks like' a phonetic version of the English rather than a real old Cornish name depends rather on how you look. Peny-cwm-cuic looks as though it might contain three topographic descriptors (head, valley, creek) that are plausibly consistent with the place itself, whereas English Pennycomequick looks distinctly odd as a place name. I have heard (but I have no source) that Smithwick and Pennycomequick were different locations in what is now Falmouth. -- Frans Fowler (talk) 22:09, 25 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Or Smithick (spelling) -- Frans Fowler (talk) 22:23, 25 June 2016 (UTC)

"Aberfal"
The article says:

"The name Falmouth is Anglo-Saxon, and appears to be a direct translation of the prior Celtic name Aberfal, 'mouth of the Fal river'."

This seems to me to be wishful thinking amongst Cornish language enthusiasts hoping to justify their translation of the name Falmouth. The [River name]-mouth or -port is a pretty common English construction (Cockermouth, Portsmouth, Bournemouth, Plymouth, Monmouth, etc). However, it does not appear in any Cornish placenames I know of: it does not appear in any of the placenames in Padel's "A Popular Dictionary of Cornish Place-Names" (1988), nor Edwin Chirgwin's "One Thousand Place Names of Cornwall," nor in Robert Mornton Nance's "A Guide to Cornish Place-Names with a List of Words Contained in Them" (4th ed, 1963).

Granted, Nance's 1952 dictionary does include the word "Aber" with the definition "confluence, meeting of waters, mouth of river," however, he notes that it is a respelling of an Old Cornish word.

Aber does, of course, appear in Welsh and, to a much lesser extent, in Scotland. However, these languages have been long separated from Cornish and it does not appear that this place-name construction is traditional.

I recommend rewriting the section to read:

"The name Falmouth is English, which recent Cornish language enthusiasts have translated to "Aberfal" based on Welsh precedents."

Perhaps a link can be made to the list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aber_and_Inver_%28placename_elements%29#In_Wales — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aebrynis (talk • contribs) 18:15, 12 January 2012 (UTC)

Jon Mark born as John Michael Burchell on 8 May 1943 in Falmouth, Cornwall
Today I (have) added that Jon Mark, a musician who is known for his recordings with Marianne Faithfull, Sweet Thursday, John Mayall and Mark-Almond was born as John Michael Burchell on 8 May 1943 in Falmouth, Cornwall. - Prior to this I had asked ChloeBurchell who is one of Jon Mark's daughters where and when her father was born. But Bob Re-born reverted my edit without discussing his revert here. This seems to me some kind of hostile. If he'd only used Google he'd seen that there still are some Burchells in Falmouth, Cornwall. --Popmuseum (talk) 12:41, 6 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Original research counts for nothing on Wikipedia, so the truth is always trumped by verifiability. All you need to do is provide reliable sources to support your assertion that Jon Mark lived in Falmouth. --Bob Re-born (talk) 22:50, 6 April 2013 (UTC)

This one should be just Falmouth
It is the original. It's a bit like London, England; the second bit is not needed.Bashereyre (talk) 22:56, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

The West Country Challenge
Would you like to win up to £250 in Amazon vouchers for participating in The West Country Challenge?

The The West Country Challenge will take place from 8 to 28 August 2016. The idea is to create and improve articles about Bristol, Somerset, Devon, Cornwall and the Isles of Scilly, Dorset, Wiltshire and Gloucestershire, like this one.

The format will be based on Wales's successful Awaken the Dragon which saw over 1000 article improvements and creations and 65 GAs/FAs. As with the Dragon contest, the focus is more on improving core articles and breathing new life into those older stale articles and stubs which might otherwise not get edited in years. All contributions, including new articles, are welcome though.

Work on any of the items at: or other articles relating to the area.
 * Core articles
 * Missing article hotlist
 * Missing photograph hotlist

There will be sub contests focusing on particular areas:
 * Bristol (Day 1-3)
 * Cornwall and Scilly (Day 4-6)
 * Devon (Day 7-9)
 * Dorset (Day 10-12)
 * Gloucestershire (Day 13-15)
 * Somerset (Day 16-18)
 * Wiltshire (Day 19-21)

To sign up or get more information visit the contest pages at WikiProject England/The West Country Challenge.&mdash; Rod talk 16:09, 18 July 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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Did Joseph Conrad stay here for nine months in 1882 and write his short story "Youth"
I've been updating and expanding the notables for Falmouth. I've re-ordered them in date order. I've deleted one or two unreferenced entries without a wiki entry or without a link. But there is one about the writer Joseph Conrad which suggests he stayed in Falmouth for nine months in 1882 and wrote his short story "Youth". There is a link to a copy of the story. The wiki entry for Joseph Conrad and the wiki entry for the short story Youth (Conrad short story) make no mention of Falmouth in 1882. Indeed the publication history on Youth (Conrad short story) says it was written in 1898 but does not say where. I've not deleted the entry on the Falmouth page, but it does seem doubtful given what is said elsewhere. Any views?

ArbieP (talk) 09:44, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
 * I'd be tempted to delete it if there is no supporting citation. I'm not really sure a that a visit of less than a year qualifies him as a notable resident anyway. Geof Sheppard (talk) 13:41, 1 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Resist the temptation. The article does not assert that Conrad was a resident of Falmouth or that he wrote his story Youth there (or in 1882). I am clarifying the entry and adding a reference (which I found in Joseph Conrad's career at sea). --Frans Fowler (talk) 18:12, 4 March 2017 (UTC)

Georgian architecture and hotels
I have removed a passage about "Georgian town houses converted into guest houses and small hotels, often overlooking one of the beaches". There was no source for it. The "holiday" side of Falmouth behind the beaches was not developed till after the railway arrived in the 1850s, and the buildings there are not Georgian. --Frans Fowler (talk) 23:11, 27 February 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080705112726/http://www.falmouth.packet.archives.dial.pipex.com/id121.htm to http://www.falmouth.packet.archives.dial.pipex.com/id121.htm

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History of name
Arthur Mee in his Kings England series "Cornwall" says it was originally Smithwick which the Killigrews changed to Pennycomequick. 2.96.13.130 (talk) 22:57, 17 April 2019 (UTC)