Talk:Federalism in Quebec

The Status of Francophone Quebecers
"They oppose all recognition of the Francophone people of Quebec as a nation" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.115.85.176 (talk) 17:46, 6 September 2007 (UTC) I think that should be replaced with not recognizing the status of Quebec as a nation, because the usual federalist argument against Quebec nationalism is that Quebec as a province is just as linguistically and ethnically divisable as the rest of Canada. Therefore it would hypocracy to give "national status" to the territory itself, that argument does not always boil down to the status of the Quebecois people, or Quebec Francophones. Take for example the recent vote on nation status for the Quebecois people, the vast majority of federalist MPs had no problem at all voting in favour of recognizing the Quebecois people as a nation within Canada. However had the legislation been in favour of recognizing Quebec as a nation, even within Canada I believe it would have been defeated.

So I think that statement should be changed regarding "status-quo" or "Trudeauite" federalists. Does anyone have any objections?

Federalist parties
Beyond the Quebec Liberal Party and the Equality Party are there any other federalist parties in Quebec? What about the ADQ? They are not listed as separatist on the sovereignty article, so technically what are they? I know that they compaigned for the Yes side in 1995, but i they took power today what would they do? Also what about the Greens? Technically they are cooperating with the separatist UFP, but aren't they affiliated with the Green Party of Canada and therefor more likely to be federalist?


 * The ADQ hae said that they were in favour of a moratorium on referendum and based on some comments, I get the feeling they would only go ahead if there was some sort of grass root movement for it. In many way, they could be considered "etapists"


 * The greens of quebec are altermondialist so they favour a series of interlocking sovereign entity. This make them very close to Lévesque`s idea of sovereignty-association. As far as I know, they are not officialy affiliated with the federal greens.--Marc pasquin 00:12, 6 August 2005 (UTC)

Trudeauism
Is this really the best or most common or most neutral term for this class of federalists?

Google searches:


 * trudeauism: 54 hits
 * trudeauisme (restricted to French pages): 37 hits
 * trudeauist: 27 hits
 * trudeauiste (restricted to French pages): 186 hits

Quickly scanning through the hits, it seems these terms are used quite differently in English and in French. In English, they are terms of abuse hurled by right-wingers against left-wingers, and they are used when discussing economics, not national unity. In French, they are terms of abuse hurled by sovereigntists against federalists, with little regard to where their opponents sit on the federalist continuum.

It is also interesting (but admittedly not really relevant) that Trudeau himself was not a trudeauist according to the definition given here.

A would suggest that something like "status-quo federalist" would be a better, more neutral term to use in this article, perhaps mentioning that trudeauist is a non-neutral term used by some sovereigntists.--Indefatigable 15:02, 7 Sep 2004 (UTC)

This will have to change. To what we don't know, but it is impossible to have a movement for something that already exits. JillandJack 19:18, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Second, if the term Trudeauism has ever been used by any reputable media outlet, it would only refer to a "saying" etc. No such reference to describe an ideology exits. With 54 hits on Google, it is irrelevant to the world. JillandJack 19:24, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)

On the proposed merger
I don't think it makes sense to merge Quebec Autonomism with Quebec federalist ideology.

Is said to be autonomiste in Quebec a politician who supports provincial autonomy. Maurice Duplessis and Robert Bourassa would be considered autonomistes. It is implied that they are federalist. However, Trudeau for example, is considered a federalist by most but not a defender of provincial autonomy in general and certainly not a Quebec nationalist (actually it seems he was a right-wing catholic nationalist in his youth).

Both these articles are almost pointless though. Provincial autonomy in Quebec would make for a better article name I think. Federalism in Quebec also seems a better name than Quebec federalist ideology in my opinion. -- Mathieugp 12:23, 12 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Support the merge. The federalist ideology article has a section on the autonomistes.  Just because all federalists (such as Trudeau) are not autonomistes does not mean that autonomistes are not federalists.  The "Federalist nationalism" section of Quebec federalist ideology covers the exact same topic as Quebec Autonomism, so a merge is appropriate.  Skeezix1000 01:20, 16 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Do you also agree with Provincial autonomy in Quebec as a more neutral name for the article? This would leave the section on non-autonomist federalists orphan though. Where should it go? Trudeauism already redirects here, so maybe in a section of the Pierre Trudeau article? -- Mathieugp 19:40, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

New title proposal: Québec Federalism
The title "Quebec federalist ideology" seems redundant. Québec Federalism or Québecois Federalism, I think, is a bit clearer. Also, though I personally don't subscribe to the interpretation, I find the word "ideology", in contemporary English, has taken on a pejorative sense in regular usage. Or at the very least, that an 'ideology' implies an 'above normal' level of personal devotion, tending towards fanaticism. Or maybe I've seen too much Fox News...

Either way - what does y'all think?

And - because the word 'Quebec' is a French proper name, shouldn't this article use the 'accent-égu' on the first 'e'? —Preceding unsigned comment added by T noakes (talk • contribs) 11:20, 30 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I think the revised title is better. The spelling Quebec, without the accent, is an accepted English spelling, and this is the English wikipedia, so using spellings without accents is I think bettter than spellings with. Dbrodbeck (talk) 12:54, 30 October 2010 (UTC)

Non-neutral viewpoint
The following quote from the article appears to me as being non-neutral:

"Though the efforts of the Patriotes have been hijacked for contemporary political purposes by the Saint-Jean-Baptiste Society"

This is the statement of an opinion. I personally recommend that it be removed, or that a reputable source be found to support the statement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by DaimonAugustus (talk • contribs) 14:57, 26 October 2011 (UTC)