Talk:Fill Your Heart (David Bowie song)/Archive 1

1
From previous version:

From a current version- the four bar melody comes form a quote in an interview with Paul Williams. SO it is patently true.Lead off witness 07:12, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

"Fill Your Heart" is a song written by Paul Williams with a four bar melody added by Biff Rose. This is unverifiable, and in fact patently false. In all likelihood this statement it is the continuation of an edit war from the Biff Rose page. The writer is trying to diminish Biff Rose's contributions.

The song was a more or less equal collaboration of the two songwriters.

Sojambi Pinola 06:46, 7 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Not so, Williams has said this in interviews about the song. Careers bear this out, Williams continued on in the lyrical sensibilities of this style. Rose went on to write almost unlistenable angry screeds, and develop a website with antisemtic and racist remarks. His music is dissimilar to this style on almost every outing he's produced since.216.244.15.89

If the "melody was written by Biff Rose" then he is one of the songwriters. Your wordings of this sentence, which you have used consistently here and at the Biff Rose page, make little sense, and that's why they keep getting changed. That's my 20 seconds for today. --Sojambi Pinola 11:18, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Rose ownership of song
this looks like it will be a long battle. The Call, so to speak.

Rose is admitted a partial songwriter on Fill Your Heart. But, Williams certainly weas responsible for the lion's share of the piece, the melody that Rose then added was extrapolated into a full song, with Lyrics by Williams- therefore Williams is responsible for abotu 2/3rds- which is perhaps why Bowie acknowledged the Arrangment on his recording- it was the skill of the arrangement that had caught his eye, and not so much Biff's performance of a song he was barely responsible for. Arrangers are often over looked, because the real meat of a song is thought to be in the chord structure. But in this case, Bowie saw that the additional work of the arranger made a song that was stronger than its beginnings. Beginnings that came from Paul Williams, and to a much smaller degree, Rose. However, in the music and film industry, a person will get a credit if they've have added 10 percent to the song. This was clearly a case of Rose adding that 10 percent, and milking it for all it has been worth. --216.175.114.201


 * What are your sources on the amount of song written by who? As far as I know, you "facts" are not citable.  A call to the owners of Irving/Almo Music would reveal that the two songwriters receive equal monetary shares of the song.


 * This is simple: Rose's version uses an Arthur G. Wright arrangement.  Tiny Tim's earlier recording uses a different arrangement.  Bowie's version re-uses the Arthur G. Wright arrangment, so he gave credit where it was due.  The "arrangement" is distinct from a given song.


 * Oops, went over my alloted 20 seconds by 40 seconds....bye. It won't be a "long battle" because, 1) I am not battling, and 2) there's not much more to say, at least on my end.  Evidence (wording of your entry, mostly) strongly suggests you are Jonah Ayers.--Sojambi Pinola 20:05, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

Evidence of your wording links you to Biff Rose. It is a no no Biff to edit one's own entry. Tsk Tsk.216.175.114.201 23:14, 13 June 2006 (UTC)


 * We've been through this. Even if I were Biff, which I am not, it would be kosher by Wikipedia rules.  Now, again.  Your citations? --Sojambi Pinola 07:26, 14 June 2006 (UTC)


 * On second thought, this is all reruns. Rather than answer anything more.....I refer any and all to the extensive discussions on the Biff Rose talk pages and archives. Talk:Biff_Rose  Nothing new here.  --Sojambi Pinola 07:29, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

"We try to encourage people not to write, or edit their own entires- that is entries that are about them. It makes for a more unbiased piece. When people write their own entries, it leads to tunnel vision." Jimbo Wales, the founder of Wikipedia, on his stance toward encouraging people to avoid writing and editing entries in Wikipedia about them. That's a citation from the horses mouth, Biff. 216.175.114.201 15:29, 17 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Your current version is pretty funny, I'll grant you that.   --Sojambi Pinola 17:03, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Even your responses lead me to believe this is actually Biff Rose. I looked into this. No one delved deeper than me. But I can see you were accused of doing Biff's writing. I say no, you are actually Biff. Don't edit your entry anymore, Biff. It's tiresome to fix the crazy stuff you invent.216.175.116.9 05:40, 19 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Nothing new here, see Talk:Biff_Rose. --Sojambi Pinola 13:38, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

I like how Biff is trying t oavoid answering for his misbehavior. How about that anti semitism on your onw website Biff-o? Might not be new, but sure is appalling.216.175.116.9


 * I keep these on file to avoid wasting time with you. Your old sockpuppets:.  Former incidents involving you making the same sorts of claims:, .  And a page where you gloat about your tactics and attempts to waste my time:    There.  That took about half a minute. --Sojambi Pinola 14:10, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Former incidents of biff's arguments about how he wants his own entry to read rather than a group process? That's more like it. I'm new here. Hi. I disagree. That's wikipedia baby. Or hsall I call you Biff? Hi Biff.

Succesful Fascism Included
If you mean that your edits have been dictated by Biff Rose, and that some other people have views they can back up that differ strongly from his opinion of himself, well yes it's succesful You have been found, User:Sojambi Pinola to have written, or edited exactly how Biff Rose has desired, which is in essence writing autoiogrpahy, something which wikipedia strongly discourages. You should keep going this way, because the more outrageous of these I can put together, the more case I'll have against you... the rose message board posts that have included direct instructions form Rose to you about what to write on Wikipedia have been erased, but ... they were cached and saved before hand. Screenshots have been taken and another wikipedian is taking the info to the admins that do not police this board. Siobhan Mcnally
 * 
 * this isn't vandalism- it's editing. Biff Rose wrote a melody to song that feautred lyrics and music by Paul Williams, who graciously allowed Rose to have credit on the song. This is precisely why Wiki fails, because if a group of people decide to believe one version of a story, they band together and label any alternative version as false, including factually backed up events, by doing so, they- the dominant group- can mislead the world. Hence- Wikipedia is not allowed to be cited for official documents or for scholastic endeavors. This is because those who have been granted administratorship, like Will Be Back have differing levels of morality, and often abuse their power. Since the current model of Wiki has been in effect literally thousands of administrators have been bounced fro mtheir duties, another very telling detail about the process of wikipedia. It's important to note that Biff Rose has been called racist and anti semitic, and by viable sources. It is also important to note that Rose has disavowed every single one of the people he has worked with in the past, presenting all of them, from management to agent, to label head honchos in very unfavorable light on his website message board, and other times in his songs. To label anyone who tries to represent this information as a vandal is totally ridiculous. I'm not Jonah Ayers anymore than I'm Walter, labelled thusly by biff's mouthpiece on here, Steve, er Sojambi Pinola. I'm actually a resident of New Orleans who has served mr. rose a number of the drinks he's sucked down since the early 90's. It's time to actually allow the other side of the story to be presented. a quick look at Rose's websites and messageboard will present the details of his mercurial albeit infinitesimal career. my goodness.]

So there you have it, you've got to be smart to chase this rabbit. Down the hole, across the mountains, but this rabbit, it's Biff Rose, and he's using the tactics of an internet troll once again. Always passing the buck to someone else, victimization, working the system till it seems that Biff has been done wrong. 216.175.116.9 22:16, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

Fill Your Heart
I am Biff Rose. I wrote "Fill Your Heart with love today don't play the game of time" and asked Paul Williams to finish putting a lyric to the song as I was working on about six songs at the same time. The year was 1967. Wikipdeia says the song was written in 1966. Change that to 1967. Paul then took the song and told everyone HE wrote it and printed it in the liner notes to his first album through his Producer Richard Perry. Perry made no mention of Biff Rose.None whatsoever.Paul felt regret in later years when the Internet was invented and everyone was entitled to the truth without suing anyone.Paul confessed to Sport Murphy (see mcvouty@optonline.net for verification) Head of Biff's "Sport" group that he had indeed ripped off Fill Your Heart. He Told Sport Murphy that he felt remorse. Sport Murphy told me in Sept.2005, "Paul Williams is a friend of mine." Sport led me to believe that he had a forgiving attitude towards Paul.This should all be included in the Wikipedia entry on who wrote Fill Your Heart and what has happened since then.For all the details wikipedia can't print see biffrose.biz.