Talk:First Fleet of South Australia

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Doug - can you please contact me through http://dukeofyork.tribalpages.com Deedubbleu (talk) 02:43, 20 June 2015 (UTC)

First Fleet?
A fleet in the naval sense is a group of vessels sailing together under a single command, which is precisely what Sydney's First Fleet did in 1788. The nine vessels which brought the settlers to Kangaroo Island in 1836 sailed completely independently, no two of them together, were not under any unified command, and arrived at their destination over a period of five months. I do not think this can in any sense be called a "fleet". Peter Bell (talk) 02:35, 13 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Can we rename this to "List of pioneer ships of South Australia" or similar. Is a bit misleading. Donama (talk) 01:40, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
 * They were however all associated with the South Australian Company, in communication with each other or at least aware of the others, and were all represented at the Proclamation, so not unrelated. And the term, though loosely applied, has some historical value. Doug butler (talk) 03:14, 9 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Thanks. These are all good points but it looks like a rename is still in order. What do you think it should be? Donama (talk) 00:16, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * What about "Pioneer ships of South Australia" or "South Australia(n) pioneer ships"? I'm not sure about the rules for naming list articles, but I prefer to start the article name with something related to the topic rather than the generic "list" - then if someone looks up "South Australian pioneer..." they are more likely to hit it? Laterthanyouthink (talk) 01:19, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
 * "Pioneer ships" is rather open-ended. "First Fleet" is problematic, though it was around when I was quite young, and has a certain ring. If the title must be changed, let it refer to pre-Proclamation. Doug butler (talk) 04:43, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Yes, I suppose there's that. It was just an idea based on seeing the first settlers referred to as pioneers in many sources, but I suppose that term does include a wider range of arrivals. (I don't have a big problem with "First Fleet" really, but didn't grow up with any of this, so best leave it to others.) Laterthanyouthink (talk) 09:43, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

William Williamses
Having encountered a William Williams in connection with Pirltawardli, I came across a State Library photograph which says "[Caption on photograph] 'W.Williams / Arrived in the Signet (sic) 11th September 1836 and at Government Iron Stores Montefiore Hill' [On back of photograph] 'William Williams / Deputy Colonial Storekeeper'", and under "Historical information" says "William Williams was appointed High Constable on 5th January 1837 but the appointment was cancelled by July of that year. He was a brewer of Walkerville and also owned Victoria Hotel in Hindley Street. He had the lease of many hotels over the years. He married Jane Catchlove in July 1837. They had 8 children. Williams died 1858 at Sturt Street, Adelaide." It's possible that the State Library is wrong, in which case I can send them the info we have, but thought I'd post here (and on the Walkerville Brewery talk page) first, just to check with whoever has done the original checking on this. Laterthanyouthink (talk) 01:19, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Captions on SLSA photographs are notorious, but we can't be too smug. Without Trove, checking these things is time-consuming and thankless. At one stage the library was grateful for corrections (or so it seemed), but the last few went unanswered. This cropped up yesterday and is posted without comment. Doug butler (talk) 05:02, 9 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Yes, I did start looking at Trove, but couldn't find anything in the time I had available. Yet another thing for another day! But what does the Trove book have to do with the William Williamses? Laterthanyouthink (talk) 09:47, 9 December 2019 (UTC)